2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

Forums › Health and fitness › 2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2502380 10-Jun-2020 16:19

Rikkitic:
Isn't the point that Ozzies and other foreigners spend more money than Kiwis would on the same activities?

Largely. You can see any number of comments on here about how expensive activities are in NZ.

They certainly arent cheaper in Aus. There is a greater probability that people will go out for a meal or do a more expensive activity when they travel overseas than when they do a road trip.

frankv

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#2502385 10-Jun-2020 16:28

Handle9:

There is a greater probability that people will go out for a meal or do a more expensive activity when they travel overseas than when they do a road trip.

Yup... when you've spent thousands on air fares and accommodation for a one-off trip, a few extra dollars for a never-to-be-repeated experience makes good sense... it's a small percentage of the total outlay for a big value. But if you've driven there in your own car, and stayed at your cousin's house so your trip costs are a few hundred dollars, and you'll be back there in a couple of years time, it's easy to skip the (relatively) big bucks experience "until next time".

ockel

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#2502387 10-Jun-2020 16:33

Handle9:
Rikkitic:

Isn't the point that Ozzies and other foreigners spend more money than Kiwis would on the same activities?

Largely. You can see any number of comments on here about how expensive activities are in NZ.

They certainly arent cheaper in Aus. There is a greater probability that people will go out for a meal or do a more expensive activity when they travel overseas than when they do a road trip.

Very true. NZ Domestic travel tends to be day-trips (61%) and by car (90%). So short trips with limited spend on travel and accommodation to start. Compare that to overseas trips which tend to be longer (who heads overseas for anything less than 5 days?) involve accommodation, dining, activities etc.

Compare that to Australians that ~50% self drive and stay for 11 days (on average). And they spend $2,500 pp when they come. When was the last time you thought about spending $2,500 pp on an 11 day trip in NZ???

If the average NZer took their overseas holiday budget and spent that within NZ instead it'd be a huge boost - but our behaviour in the past doesnt indicate we're likely to do that. And surveys of those that were due to travel overseas but have been cancelled seem to indicate that only 20% intend to replace their trip with a NZ domestic holiday. The vast majority would look to pay down debt or spend on something else.

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ezbee

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#2502410 10-Jun-2020 17:14

Treatment of aircrews.

Title is a bit clickbaity but this item does give you can idea of how aircrews are managed at the moment.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12338813

""
Upon arrival, the crew was shepherded onto a chartered bus and taken straight to their hotel.

After checking in, they were barred from leaving their rooms during their three-day layover - not even to meet their fellow crew members. They get their meals served on trays left outside their doors
""

Article tenant is that this is too tough.

Its hard to see how this can be eased where crews come from and through countries where C19 is very acive.
Never mind close contact with passengers with variety of origins.

When there is transtasman bubble for TT crews things could be different if they only work that TT service, everywhere else choices are few.
Suppose that will mean that TT bubble flights must not have passengers who transited from somewhere else too.
Terminals might need to separate people, as crowding in the luggage and customs halls mixing with flights from covid countries is not going to work.
Will they have to use domestic terminal for these flights ?

Whole bubble thing is not going to be that easy to administer in practice.

freitasm

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#2502412 10-Jun-2020 17:16

Air crew coming in from a country that still has active cases into a country with zero/no/nada active cases - and complaining?

Easy, don't come back.

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#2502414 10-Jun-2020 17:23

freitasm:

Air crew coming in from a country that still has active cases into a country with zero/no/nada active cases - and complaining?

Easy, don't come back.

To be fair I think it was a NZ friend of a crew member highlighting this , and Herald might have amped it up a bit.

In this market the crew themselves are probably so thankful they are still working.

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#2502421 10-Jun-2020 17:43

MikeB4:

@tdgeek @Handle9 slow breath in slow breath out. Repeat this 30 times and then go for a walk.

Yep. I dont mind what people say, its how they say it. Decorum, class.

mattwnz

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#2502422 10-Jun-2020 17:51

ezbee:

Suppose that will mean that TT bubble flights must not have passengers who transited from somewhere else too.
Terminals might need to separate people, as crowding in the luggage and customs halls mixing with flights from covid countries is not going to work.
Will they have to use domestic terminal for these flights ?

Whole bubble thing is not going to be that easy to administer in practice.

IF people are transiting in from other places, then would it be a 'trans tasman bubble'. My understanding of the 'trans tasman bubble' idea, was that international travel for both countries would be solely limited to travel between New Zealand and Australia. Otherwise it wouldn't be much different to pre covid travel. If Australia are wanting to open up the bubble to other countries, including the possibly the uk, where it is obviously not contained, then NZ wold be also in that bubble with those other countries if we were to join them.

Fred99

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#2502424 10-Jun-2020 17:54

mattwnz:

If Australia are wanting to open up the bubble to other countries, including the possibly the uk, where it is obviously not contained, then NZ would be also in that bubble with those other countries if we were to join them.

It would be utter madness to open the (Aus) border to the UK. Surely nobody is seriously suggesting that?

empacher48

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#2502430 10-Jun-2020 17:56

As aircrew, this what it has been like from late March for both crew arriving here and us going overseas. The complaint appeared to be from the NZ based friend who wouldn’t see the flight attendant rather than the aircrew complaining.

We all just accept it is what we have to do while we are out of the country to protect our country. Everyone I know and work with treat this very seriously. Almost a professional responsibility.

tdgeek

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#2502432 10-Jun-2020 18:08

Handle9:

Get a grip. If you can't be bothered to even check basic facts why should others do it for you or take you seriously?

Opinion isn't fact, it seems you can't tell the difference.

If you cant check basic facts?

I said

"That was my feeling. If I spent $4k on a NZ trip as I cant go to AUS thats into our economy and tourism operators/supporting retail. If I spent that in AUS it drops our balance of payments and no money into our economy. Same applies to the OZ people who are stuck there. If however, we all flew to the other country, while it won't fully offset, a lot of it would seem to if travel was 1:1

If the AUS tourist to NZ volume exceeded the Kiwi's going to AUS we get a benefit, but isnt it just a net benefit?"

I dont need to check basic facts, Im aware that the travel to and fro is not a lot different. Ockel with his usual patronising attitude confirms that. Hence why I said it won't fully offset. And if AUS exceeded NZ its just a net benefit. So why do I need to check basic facts? I stated as much and Ockel confirmed it, its fairly close, so my query supporting the previous poster was, what is the real benefit as the net benefit is low. Yes, you conveniently decided to omit the rest of my post. if you bothered to engage you could say reasons why this low net benefit was valuable. But no, resort to nit picking.

If your need wasn't to nit pick, you could do what most of us try to do in a forum discussion, discuss it. But no. You could argue that Kiwis will spend less, but no. You could argue that AUS may be more inclined to travel here as its seems to be a safer haven and Kiwis will have less inclination to travel there, so a greater benefit to NZ, but no.

If you prefer to nit pick than engage in a discussion where people educate and enlighten others or are educated and enlightened by others, well hey, that's what I thought a forum discussion was about, but clearly I am wrong, its about point scoring and name calling.

Yes, I made the mistake about supporting another post that is this tourist thing that beneficial. After all, the media tells us that we need to open the border now, well, Winston does as do the airlines as do the tourist operators. And many here see that as a risk. So, my support of another post that is the net benefit that great, was, in my opinion, relevant. And again I don't need to research that the inflow and outflow is vastly different, its not, is IMO a relevant point as to whether the net gain is that valuable. I see that others have outlined their opinions. Great. Pity you couldn't in a respectful and dignified manner, do the same.

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Handle9

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#2502459 10-Jun-2020 18:34

Instead of just postulating and getting offended when you are challenged you could actually offer some justification for your opinion, which would be far less frustrating for others.

I guess it's also my fault that I can only insert two levels of quotes?

tdgeek

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#2502464 10-Jun-2020 18:55

Handle9:

Instead of just postulating and getting offended when you are challenged you could actually offer some justification for your opinion, which would be far less frustrating for others.

I guess it's also my fault that I can only insert two levels of quotes?

It was just a general opinion, nothing more nothing less. Simple, as that. I dont feel challenged. If I was, and in fact for every 1 that flits to AUS, 5 come here, them Im wrong, tell me, no issue at all. If you or anyone else can see benefits then post away, after all its JUST a discussion, thats all it is. The previous poster stated that its an offset thing, tourist back and forth. I am aware its relatively similar.

Say no one can travel for the forseeable future. Many like overseas travel, many like local travel, many dont bother. So, if we are stuck here the locals will still travel, the overseas keen people will probably travel locally. I should have added that assumption. So we get an economic benefit. Money circulates, cashflow is king. If we can go to AUS, then NZ$ don't benefit NZ, those $ leave. The $ coming from AUS "in my opinion" seem to do little more than offset what we sent to AUS, which would have been spent here. So, the main point was do we get a real benefit or not from a Trans Tasman bubble? Are the overseas travel people better in the short term to recycle the $ here? Rather then spend in AUS which offsets what AUS spend here? Given the need for the bubble by airlines. tourist operators who are biased, and the feeling of many here that its too soon, is it financially worth it?

Thats all. As far as researching the numbers. I already know its close. Ockel confirmed that, so is it beneficial is it for us? Given that we can recycle our $ (assuming, and its probably a big assumption that the usual overseas travellers will check out NZ in the meantime) Should we start getting new imported cases here, was it too soon?

mattwnz

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#2502465 10-Jun-2020 18:56

Fred99:

mattwnz:

If Australia are wanting to open up the bubble to other countries, including the possibly the uk, where it is obviously not contained, then NZ would be also in that bubble with those other countries if we were to join them.

It would be utter madness to open the (Aus) border to the UK. Surely nobody is seriously suggesting that?

Someone previously posted a link to an article about this a few weeks ago. Although I can't find it as the search page has no search box, and it maybe about 100 pages back.

Fred99

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#2502468 10-Jun-2020 19:07

empacher48: Everyone I know and work with treat this very seriously. Almost a professional responsibility.

Only almost? Seriously?

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