Zero Tolerance Limits now

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#2556377 3-Sep-2020 14:41

Technofreak:

The same ones, who as I experienced very early one morning, will pull you over on the pretext "you looked to have been going a bit fast" in order that they might have the excuse to breathalyse and check licence, rego etc. I wasn't speeding nor had I been drinking and once he had given his weak excuse to my question as to why I had been stopped speed wasn't mentioned again. It was an illegal fishing exercise predicated on him saying he thought I was speeding.

Err, no. Stop making rubbish up.

A police officer has the right to stop you to exercise his or her conferred powers under the Land Transport Act 1998 and regulations enacted under it.

link

Feel free to post with facts but don't make inflammatory BS comments. A police officer may further require you to submit to a breath screening test by virtue of you driving on the road under s 68(1) of the Act. These kinds of things are known (in broad outlines) by anyone who's ever read the Road Code. Perhaps time for less typing and more thinking?

mattwnz

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#2556381 3-Sep-2020 14:43

The thing is the the acual people that are the speeders and main offenders often don't get caught from this type of thing.

When a new law comes in like speed cameras, the rules surrounding them often get more strict over time. So they are intially often quite palatable to allow them to be introduced. It is similar to new taxes, they start off sounding okay but over time they start to cover more and more things. Eg GST was 10%, then eroded to 12.5%, then more recently 15%, and I wouldn't be surprised to see it rise even higher in the next term to help cover covid. eg 17.5% or 20%. VAT in the UK is 20%
I recall that speed cameras were first introduced, they were only allowed in areas that were signposted, first as 'blackspot' areas. Then we moved to hidden ones. Now they are reducing the tolerance, even though the accuracy of speedos on cars can be out by quite a bit. I am sure if speed cameras were introduced with the current conditions, their would have been a big public backlash against them having them introduced. BUt beuase they are doing it in small steps, it has been more palatable.

snnet

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#2556383 3-Sep-2020 14:46

Note2luvr:

Do the mobile driving apps such as Google Maps, Sygic, Tomtom with a speedo counter using the GPS represent the true car speed, is that 100 percent accurate?

Please don't become one of those drivers that uses this to tailgate people who are relying on what most people driving are relying on - their speedo :)

frankv

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#2556437 3-Sep-2020 14:58

Technofreak:

Note2luvr:

Do the mobile driving apps such as Google Maps, Sygic, Tomtom with a speedo counter using the GPS represent the true car speed, is that 100 percent accurate?

In my experience they are generally very good. You do see the odd random fluctuation from time to time. This might be due to how/where the receiver is mounted and how good the lock on to the GPS signal is. Signal shading from high buildings, tunnels, flyovers can also have an impact. I don't know you could say 100% accurate but certainly in the range of 95%-99%.

So long at the errors are consistent, speed calculations will be within a kph in my experience, probably 99.999% of the time. When the GPS receiver switches from one satellite to another due to changing satellite geometry or signal strength, the position error changes and therefore the calculated speed from one point to the next will vary. However, nowadays it's quite uncommon to have only 4 satellites (the minimum to get a 3D fix) in view, so the transition from one satellite to the next can be compensated for, so there's very few sudden changes. In addition, they'll snap the vehicle position to the nearest point on a road, which reduces errors further. I'm pretty sure that the apps also run some kind of smoothing algorithm over the speed to minimise sudden changes in the displayed value. (In the good old days of few satellites and weak CPUs and no smoothing and no maps, I have seen my position jump several hundred metres in one second, then jump back again).

Technofreak

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#2556441 3-Sep-2020 15:05

dejadeadnz:

Technofreak:

The same ones, who as I experienced very early one morning, will pull you over on the pretext "you looked to have been going a bit fast" in order that they might have the excuse to breathalyse and check licence, rego etc. I wasn't speeding nor had I been drinking and once he had given his weak excuse to my question as to why I had been stopped speed wasn't mentioned again. It was an illegal fishing exercise predicated on him saying he thought I was speeding.

Err, no. Stop making rubbish up.

A police officer has the right to stop you to exercise his or her conferred powers under the Land Transport Act 1998 and regulations enacted under it.

link

Feel free to post with facts but don't make inflammatory BS comments. A police officer may further require you to submit to a breath screening test by virtue of you driving on the road under s 68(1) of the Act. These kinds of things are known (in broad outlines) by anyone who's ever read the Road Code. Perhaps time for less typing and more thinking?

Sorry no BS. There was only one reason why he stopped me and that was to breathalyse me. The cop told me lies as to why he pulled me over. Am I to take it you think it's within the law for the police to tell lies?

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tanivula

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#2556445 3-Sep-2020 15:18

Technofreak:

Note2luvr:

Do the mobile driving apps such as Google Maps, Sygic, Tomtom with a speedo counter using the GPS represent the true car speed, is that 100 percent accurate?

In my experience they are generally very good. You do see the odd random fluctuation from time to time. This might be due to how/where the receiver is mounted and how good the lock on to the GPS signal is. Signal shading from high buildings, tunnels, flyovers can also have an impact. I don't know you could say 100% accurate but certainly in the range of 95%-99%.

The speedo that comes through Waze on my phone has been bang on what the pole mounted 'your speed is' signs display. These have always been different by 10% on the majority of vehicles I've driven.

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wellygary

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#2556461 3-Sep-2020 16:01

tanivula:

The speedo that comes through Waze on my phone has been bang on what the pole mounted 'your speed is' signs display. These have always been different by 10% on the majority of vehicles I've driven.

Cars deliberately read high, (its a UN treaty requirement- cue global government tinfoil hat posts)

They even do it when the car actually knows what its true speed is...

I can reset the trip computer while I have the car in cruise control with the speedo sitting on 100km/h, but then when I select the trip display for average speed after a few secs it shows "90 km/h"...

Its all a plot I tell you :)

MikeB4

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#2556467 3-Sep-2020 16:10

@wellygary pssst psssst Lizards never get caught for speeding. Just saying 😀

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

dejadeadnz

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#2556597 3-Sep-2020 17:34

Technofreak:

Sorry no BS. There was only one reason why he stopped me and that was to breathalyse me. The cop told me lies as to why he pulled me over. Am I to take it you think it's within the law for the police to tell lies?

You asserted that the cop was acting unlawfully. The cop stopped you under powers available to him pursuant to the Land Transport Act 1998 -- what justification he gave you doesn't matter. He further had all the powers he needed to stop you to breathalyse you just because you were driving (whether that's a good law that's another matter). If he was exercising a legitimate power in stopping you in the first place and then also asked you to comply with a lawful direction, there is no illegality. Given that you can't understand such simple concepts, nothing else you have mentioned is remotely credible. Again, you're in no position to debate the law with me as someone who has the experience and qualifications to definitively lay out what the Land Transport Act says.

Stop making stuff up.

Handle9

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#2556599 3-Sep-2020 17:40

snnet:

Handle9:

FTFY

Yeah. thanks, just thought of coming back to change that to 1-10 hah

Edit: Sorry? fixed what? :D

Lol. Fair call.

frankv

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#2556702 4-Sep-2020 07:56

dejadeadnz:

You asserted that the cop was acting unlawfully. The cop stopped you under powers available to him pursuant to the Land Transport Act 1998 -- what justification he gave you doesn't matter. He further had all the powers he needed to stop you to breathalyse you just because you were driving (whether that's a good law that's another matter). If he was exercising a legitimate power in stopping you in the first place and then also asked you to comply with a lawful direction, there is no illegality.

So it's OK to lie to the person being stopped? Why does the cop even need to lie? Surely the powers under the Land Transport Act 1998 are given for the purposes described in the Act, not for the cop to use for his own purposes?

Again, you're in no position to debate the law with me as someone who has the experience and qualifications to definitively lay out what the Land Transport Act says.

Surely it is judges, not lawyers, who have the experience and qualifications to definitively lay out what the Land Transport Act says? Otherwise why bother with courts?

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dejadeadnz

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#2556728 4-Sep-2020 09:08

frankv:

So it's OK to lie to the person being stopped? Why does the cop even need to lie? Surely the powers under the Land Transport Act 1998 are given for the purposes described in the Act, not for the cop to use for his own purposes?

Cops can stop a driver by signalling them to stop and then to check your address and the like for any reason. Here's my suggestion: go back to my original post, google the provisions cited, and read them s l o w l y. The cops can administer a breath screening test upon any driver for no reason other than the fact that they were driving. And for the umpteenth time, Technofreak imputed a motive upon the cop. Let's examine it again:

The same ones, who as I experienced very early one morning, will pull you over on the pretext "you looked to have been going a bit fast" in order that they might have the excuse to breathalyse and check licence, rego etc.

This was his interpretation of the events. Courts will absolutely (in view of my experience having worked for judges, worked as a prosecutor, and for a short time a defence lawyer, and having sighted all the relevant case law authorities) not go behind the purported grounds for the exercise of a power legitimately conferred upon a decision-maker/officer unless there is legitimate evidence pointing to some kind of abuse of that power. There's none here -- the cop was doing what many, many other cops legitimately do under the LTA. This accords with common sense/public policy for anyone prepared to exercise their brain a tiny bit: do we want to courts to be flooded with cases involving defendants arguing for exclusion of evidence, discontinuation of cases, and the like on the ground that "The cop said I was being arrested for X mistakenly or whatever [when they could have legitimately arrested me for A, B and C grounds but nevermind]?".

Surely it is judges, not lawyers, who have the experience and qualifications to definitively lay out what the Land Transport Act says? Otherwise why bother with courts?

Courts exist to pronounce upon genuine disputes. They've already provided us with 20 plus years of case law/binding precedents on the relevant sections and the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act 1993 on unlawful detention and the law as it stands is what I told the OP. Instead of accepting the obvious (including cited legal provisions that you could have read yourself), you've deliberately twisted my words as though I am suggesting some rule by lawyer's dictate to try and white knight for some guy scurrilously attack upon a cop just doing their job. The principles that I have repeatedly discussed are well-established.

surfisup1000

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#2556789 4-Sep-2020 09:52

dejadeadnz:

You asserted that the cop was acting unlawfully. The cop stopped you under powers available to him pursuant to the Land Transport Act 1998 -- what justification he gave you doesn't matter.

Yes, they can stop you for no reason.

But, there are qualifications to that. Police can't stop someone based on race.

A couple of years back, a maori fella was discharged without conviction using the argument that the stop was based on his race ... even though he was subsequently found to be in possession of drugs or guns. It would really be difficult for the judge to determine whether the stop was racist.

Eva888

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#2556796 4-Sep-2020 10:16

Technofreak:
Note2luvr:

Do the mobile driving apps such as Google Maps, Sygic, Tomtom with a speedo counter using the GPS represent the true car speed, is that 100 percent accurate?

In my experience they are generally very good. You do see the odd random fluctuation from time to time. This might be due to how/where the receiver is mounted and how good the lock on to the GPS signal is. Signal shading from high buildings, tunnels, flyovers can also have an impact. I don't know you could say 100% accurate but certainly in the range of 95%-99%.

My hybrid has a digital speedo and a GPS. I swear the speedo isn’t correct it fluctuates up and down by about 6 or more Km and it is mostly a different speed to the GPS which shows a slower speed. It also feels as if I am driving too slow at 50 with other cars tailgating. You feel pushed to speed up.

I am a sensible driver and now really struggle to keep to the exact speed limit. It borders on dangerous having to watch a constantly changing digital speedo. Easier to have an accident now with eyes flicking back and forth checking it.

Is there a way to check if a speedo is accurate?

snnet

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#2556876 4-Sep-2020 11:19

Eva888:

My hybrid has a digital speedo and a GPS. I swear the speedo isn’t correct it fluctuates up and down by about 6 or more Km and it is mostly a different speed to the GPS which shows a slower speed. It also feels as if I am driving too slow at 50 with other cars tailgating. You feel pushed to speed up.

I am a sensible driver and now really struggle to keep to the exact speed limit. It borders on dangerous having to watch a constantly changing digital speedo. Easier to have an accident now with eyes flicking back and forth checking it.

Is there a way to check if a speedo is accurate?

There is a way to check how accurate a speedo is, usually at a garage. Someone else may know whether or not it is a required test for a warrant of fitness, though if it is it's probably one of the more "she'll be right" tests like some garages do with headlight aiming. I'm trying to remember where I saw one in use, it was probably a VTNZ station where your vehicle is driven onto a platform where there are wheels under your wheels and they accelerate and see what the external speedo reads vs the car speedo

I do think having to glance at the speedo all the time is going to make things more dangerous, but NZ drivers are pretty bad at tailgating anyway. I get it daily, even if I try to make a gap between myself and the vehicle behind me they just match the speed so they're either on autopilot and don't realise what they're doing or they're just..well.. you know, one of those words that starts with an a and ends with an s

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