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#2151414 28-Dec-2018 13:05

Assessment is a 550 run lead, SL bat last 10 overs. Over 2 days to score 550, over 2 days to get 10 wickets. Here in ChCh 27 tomorrow, 30 on Sunday. Many tired fielders and bowlers, and batting friendly. SL need a 200 opening or near opening partnership, then it gets interesting

TeaLeaf

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#2151420 28-Dec-2018 13:07

tdgeek:

Its a team game, but you tend to focus on someone to blame and on anyone who doesnt meet your stats every game

Yes of course I do. Its the most individual team sport in the world.

I am only focussing on Nichols becauses hes getting better, and my only issue is he scores his tons on easy pitches, not when the going gets tough, what I am seeing is he is improving that. Of course you want your 5 and 6 to be able to succeed when the top order fails, if they dont they would never bat or have piss poor averages. So thats the gig. Its a tough gig. And no its not fair number 5, its probably one of the toughest spots in the game out side being a world class all rounder like Hadlee or Kallis etc.

Hes clearly showing potential going from avg of 29 last year to now be 39.56, but if you look at his graph its either big tons or nothing. I just want him to fill in between with a few more 50s etc. Its unrealistic to expect him to save us every game with double tons etc. But I think hes on his way to becoming world class.

So Im focussing on him because hes IMPROVED A LOT, not because hes failing. He only needs that tiny nudge and I think he will be very consistent. Its likely what will happen is when Ross retires though he will be bumped to 4, then he will no longer be our middle order, which IMO suits him, I think hes good enough to play 4.

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#2151427 28-Dec-2018 13:17

tdgeek:

Assessment is a 550 run lead, SL bat last 10 overs. Over 2 days to score 550, over 2 days to get 10 wickets. Here in ChCh 27 tomorrow, 30 on Sunday. Many tired fielders and bowlers, and batting friendly. SL need a 200 opening or near opening partnership, then it gets interesting

Yep looking at that surface and the weather report totally agree this time with not declaring early. 550 though is like 100 over the world record for 4th innings win, would take some batting. But despite SL's form recent years, Angelo Mathews is back and they do have the talent to score double tons. Unfortunately their top order has been failing and its that 4-6 middle order thats been saving them recently. Things will turn around for them, they are a very proud nation, I remember them coming through as guppies and then to become Test team and then to become world dominant thanks to a couple of legendary batsman and one controversial world record holding spinner.

The Windies have completely different problems, there is a video on youtube I should find that interviews a lot of the management and some of the old guns as to why. If Brian Lara had a world class team around him, he would most definitely have been the best modern era batsman by AVG, but imo he is still the best regardless. Imagine captaining them today and being a world class batsman, tough gig.

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#2151428 28-Dec-2018 13:17

TeaLeaf:

Of course you want your 5 and 6 to be able to succeed when the top order fails, if they dont they would never bat or have piss poor averages.

The batsmen are all fixers, so there are no fixers in actual fact. The openers are fixers, to fix issues later on by setting a base, the rest play the game, steady and slow and safe, or scoring, all depends how the game is going. So there are no fixers, they all are, whuch means there is no fixing role. Its a team sport. If the top 2 go out cheaply then 3 and 4 steady the ship, and so on. If any of these "fixers" bring the score back to solid, then more decisions can be made as to a total or time.

You say Nichols can only score on an easy pitch, so when everyone goes out cheaply on a tough pitch he is to get a ton? He should open then if he is that good

Its a team sport

I see Santner hitting huge sixes in the super smash

C deG needs to go. He is not a bowler, and his batting is not worth the spot

TeaLeaf

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#2151438 28-Dec-2018 13:45

tdgeek:

I see Santner hitting huge sixes in the super smash

C deG needs to go. He is not a bowler, and his batting is not worth the spot

Colin is a tough won, hes still scoring, but his bowling has dried up. Santner is not a wicket taker but was promising with the bat but just didnt deliver, if hes improved I think you will see him in the T20 squad as he can bowl dot balls and sounds like hes improved his batting like he evidently was asked to.

With Colin, it was his bowling that excited everyone, 6fa on debut etc. Then he showed what Auckland had known for a decade that he can bat.

But I feel hes not batting to his potential, hes definitely better than avg 30, but hes mostly scored 30s and 40s, hes consistent at that. Id like to see him come in and score another couple of centuries and more 50s.

Styris and Richardson were arguing over what makes an all rounder (Styris was suggesting Matthews for SL is better at bowling than he is), so mark said Avg 30+ with bat SR under 30 with ball and you are a genuine all rounder, which I totally agree with. Matthews is a Batsman who is a worse bowler tham Kane Williamson, who also has been mentioned twice this series for not bowling enough, which I also agree with.

Anyway, so on stats you would say Colin is excelling at his job, hes not Master Class ala Hadlee or Kallis, ie is super good at one and good at the other or like Kallis super good at both. But there are very few all rounders in the game who hold stats like his. Now hes only played 14 tests which Richardson alluded to. But hes played first class for a long time and is one of those awesome players who flew under the radar and never made national level.

So Im crticial of him too, but Id like to see Santner play some ODIs to get a feel for his batting, he could play tests and be useful on non seaming wickets if he can be a 35 type batsman. But then you would ask why are we playing 2 spinners on dirt pitches, which I personally would say, because he bats well and holds up an end and Sodhi turns the ball sideways and is a handy batsman close to all rounder status. But Santner and Patel wouldnt make much sense. So I think if he does make it to test level it will be pitch dependant (ie Eng and NZ you would want a seamer for wicket taking, sub continent or any flat pitches you would play him for his accuracy with the ball and his batting. The other thing is Whilst Taylor is 34 he clearly can still bat, Colin is not getting younger and hes expected to be a bowler and batsman, tough gig on the body even at a younger age. Time will tell I guess.

Did you see the ODI squad listed for SL? It was very interesting, they are clearly testing out some players to make sure they got the World Cup next year right. The main interest imo is around Doug Bracewell, but hasnt produced when given the oppurtunity, but has gone back and performs so is getting another recall.

My personal opinion is that, especially ODI level, we need to invest in Lockie Fergusson, a young gun and the only Fast Fast who is not getting injured all the time. He was awesome in the UAE. On the green pitches in England, I think he will be lethal. I wish there was a daytime ODI at Hagley as I reckon Lockie would tear it up. His only down side is hes not a swing bowler, but his accuracy has improved a lot at high pace, which if you look at Glen Mcgrath, you dont need to swing the ball, the best ball is the one that hits the edge, which means about 6 inches of deviation. At 150kph that is hard to handle.

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#2151439 28-Dec-2018 13:48

Black Caps ODI squad

Kane Williamson (c)
Trent Boult
Doug Bracewell
Lockie Ferguson
Martin Guptill
Matt Henry
Colin Munro
Jimmy Neesham
Henry Nicholls
Tim Seifert (wk)
Ish Sodhi
Tim Southee
Ross Taylor

Pretty weak on the batting side, but they clearly looking at pace bowlers. Seifert is really to see if he can deliver the runs, Neesham in there as the all rounder being tested. Bracewell for his bowling. They already know what Matt Henry delivers. This clearly wont be our WC squad, Latham will be in there and I think will be keeper unless Seifert smashes fast 50s or centuries.

Looking forward to Guptils lofted straight drives, have missed watching him since his injury.

tdgeek

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#2151446 28-Dec-2018 14:01

C DeG has to go. His stats are not great, Santner is not far short of his batting averages. Santner has more wickets than Sodhi and C deG per match, yet you say Santners batting is an issue, C deG is a very good batman? He isn't excelling. he is a player who at times did a great job, so we hang on for fail after fail, then he gets a good score or a few wickets, so he hangs around. We need very good, not can be very good, this is why the current team is getting more stable, there is less in and out "promising but dont deliver that often" players. Use his spot for new talent, their results wont be far off what we already have

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tdgeek

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#2151449 28-Dec-2018 14:04

"Sodhi turns the ball sideways and is a handy batsman"

Handy? he is like early Santner, definitely not handy. I like his bowling.

TeaLeaf

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#2151451 28-Dec-2018 14:13

We have an aging side so we have to start throwing these other players in there. My concern on the test side is who is going to replace Taylor, clearly Nichols will go up one but who can play 5. I personally think thats where Guptil should have been playing tests, but I think thats done and dusted given age as well.

Bowling wise we are pretty strong youth knocking on the door.

If Taylor's heart is still in it there is no reason he cant go on another 4 years even, but we definitely will be short a batsman if he does retire at any time, Im sure he will be communicating it well ahead to NZ Cricket, but still. Dont get me wrong we have players in first class. I just hope the jump wont be to hard.

For 4 million people and Cricket being not well loved by a lot of ladies and men a like in NZ compared to Aus or IND etc, we do pretty blimmin well. Id say its our most over performing sport per capita and more so given the public interest. And we have a great Womans team. Its definitely our summer sport, I dont know why people find 5 days boring, attention span? lol

tdgeek

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#2151454 28-Dec-2018 14:19

TeaLeaf:

I dont know why people find 5 days boring, attention span?

Its generally boring to the non purists. A lot of time between action. As they discussed on the coverage, there are more and more games like this, thats better than 4 wickets in a day of 1.8 RR. If its a nice batting track its a huge bore, as a lot of time to watch a game that is not a contest (batting vs bowling)

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#2151478 28-Dec-2018 14:58

Yes I do feel NZs pitches have become too batting focussed, Id like to see more green for longer like some Eng pitches, but thats why I like Hagley being VERY Green for 4 sessions usually, which usually sets up a result. Its the Lathams I suppose ppl find boring, but I find it utterly glorious. I love how he goes from what same would call boring and now his run rate climbs vertically with these 150+ that hes scored, especially that last one, I have a feeling we will see Lathams #5 style very soon. NZ may get the 550 and have half a session at them this afternoon.

I guess if you didnt grow up watching tests and or playing cricket it would be boring. I love football, grew up being a Liverpool fan, but some games bore me silly. I think after living in Aus for so long, the difference there is the over patriotic culture comes into it more than the cricket and the boxing day test is more like Australia day, drinking tends to be part of that. NZ crowds are more chilled.

One stroke Nichols plays that I really enjoy is his pull shot, he never looks out of control, like he knows where the ball is landing as soon as it leaves the hand.

If they put the foot down they could be 620 by end of the day. I honestly think our current score even on this pitch is out of SLs league. 550, no chance outside miracles. Its ODI time imo, perhaps t20, that will take the bore out :-)

TeaLeaf

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#2151484 28-Dec-2018 15:13

I really hope these big tons raise Lathams confidence and he can improve on that avg of 11 against SA. Of course they are a supreme bowling attack, but Im certain over time that will lift. Right now his AVGs show he can score big against the bottom 4 but 30 and under against the top 3.

If we declare 550, thats 275 over say 9 sessions, its close to 3RPO. I feel Kane has to dangle the carrot or they will just block our the test which takes the advantage away, give them a world record win chance and players might play their shots which is how they will potentially make mistakes. Of course if NZ bowl insanely well with line and length they will find the edge.

I think 550 is plenty. Scoreboard pressure is very under rated.

tdgeek

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#2151486 28-Dec-2018 15:18

I meant boring as in a 5 day test where in most periods its slow, few runs, few wickets, the inevitable draw. This game has been the opposite, and RSA had a game that progressed quicker than this one. Latham is rocketing up the records leaderboard but his record is against low teams, ZIM, BANG and SL. He needs to show it with top 6 teams, until then he hasn't got there IMHO

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#2151488 28-Dec-2018 15:25

Yep I agree, he needs to now take this momentum on to the top teams.

I agree with Mark Richardson, batting tomorrow is what SL will want, 1:30 today after tea they have more vague goals. Latham will be 200, Nichols well passed his ton.

I think Kane will declare 1 hour before stumps. Which is a compromise between what Richardson is saying and what people may expect.

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#2151497 28-Dec-2018 15:44

Darn Tom deserved another double ton.

Fantastic ton from Nichols.

Its T20 time. If they went hard they could add 80-100 in the next hour easily. No point hanging around now, plenty of big hitters left and Watling.

Sri Lankan batsman will not want to be batting after soooooo long in the field, 180 overs in 220ish fielding is harsh.

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