This service could replace the ferries, or aeroplanes

Forums › Travel (planes, train, cruise) › This service could replace the ferries, or aeroplanes

1 | ... | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10

6657 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3477

Trusted

#3091222 17-Jun-2023 19:28

Tinkerisk:

The difference between an Otto Lilienthal, a Wilbur Wright and other aviation geniuses has always been that they did not, as they do today, noisily pitch their vague ideas and visions to people in advance in colourful marketing brochures before they had flown the technical data themselves, in some cases painfully. Today, only ingenious, visionary, well-managed teams can come up with complex, technical solutions, but certainly not their colleagues from the marketing department.

It's called putting your money where your mouth is. Which is distinctly different from putting other people's money (OPM) where your mouth is.

Sony Xperia XA2 running Sailfish OS. https://sailfishos.org The true independent open source mobile OS
Samsung Galaxy Tab S6
Dell Inspiron 14z i5

frankv

5705 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3666

Lifetime subscriber

#3092159 19-Jun-2023 17:16

Tinkerisk:

The difference between an Otto Lilienthal, a Wilbur Wright and other aviation geniuses has always been that they did not, as they do today, noisily pitch their vague ideas and visions

Whilst I agree that the Wrights and Lillienthal didn't push ideas they couldn't justify, there has never been any shortage of "visionaries" seeking other people's money. e.g. Samuel Langley in 1898

tweake

2648 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1139

#3092162 19-Jun-2023 17:30

the fundamental difference between today and the early flight pioneers is today all the factors are well known.

the seagliders doesn't really involve anything groundbreaking or anything thats not understood. flight, ground effects, hydro foils, batteries, electric motors, float planes etc are all things pretty well known. the only thing thats new is how its packaged to provide a service.

problem here is that they are claiming they can offer something that goes against a lot of the principles of those things. the fact they there are trying to push the end service first before inventing the product says this is most likely an investor scam.

Tinkerisk

4802 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3660

#3092332 20-Jun-2023 06:38

Well, what can I say? I can't really judge such things, I was just a minor „airman“ in the LH seat at one of the largest paper processing companies with its own aircraft production. The promises of the marketing department never interested me anyway. 😇

Qui nihil scit, omnia credere debet.
Firewalls do NOT stop dragons.
In effect we have everything to hide from someone, and no idea who someone is.

eracode

Smpl Mnmlst
9334 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6203

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#3242076 29-May-2024 08:12

I was among the posters who poured scorn on the plans for Seaglider in NZ in the thread above and I’m still convinced they will never see the light of day in this country.

This story in NZ Herald today is about a plausible and realistic product which has passed a proof-of-concept test - as compared to the ridiculous proposal and claims made by the Seaglider NZ promoter a couple of years ago. I know it's not really comparable in terms of speed and physics etc - but still similar in some ways.

The passenger capacities mentioned in today’s story - 10 and 100 - are similar to the sizes of the two models Seaglider were talking about. Seaglider were talking about Auckland-Whangarei and Wellington-South Island routes. A 100-passenger electric hydrofoil traveling Auckland-Whangarei is probably a very big call - but not nearly as big as a 100-seater Seaglider.

Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.

Scott3

4177 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2990

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#3242153 29-May-2024 09:30

eracode:

I was among the posters who poured scorn on the plans for Seaglider in NZ in the thread above and I’m still convinced they will never see the light of day in this country.

This story in NZ Herald today is about a plausible and realistic product which has passed a proof-of-concept test - as compared to the ridiculous proposal and claims made by the Seaglider NZ promoter a couple of years ago. I know it's not really comparable in terms of speed and physics etc - but still similar in some ways.

The passenger capacities mentioned in today’s story - 10 and 100 - are similar to the sizes of the two models Seaglider were talking about. Seaglider were talking about Auckland-Whangarei and Wellington-South Island routes. A 100-passenger electric hydrofoil traveling Auckland-Whangarei is probably a very big call - but not nearly as big as a 100-seater Seaglider.

As you say, a ground effect aircraft isn't really comparable to a hydrofoil boat. ~100km/h vs ~540km/h

Should note that commercial passenger hydrofoil vessels aren't new tech. The below came out in 1975. I took one between Hong Kong and Macau many years back:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_929_Jetfoil

That said it is great to see the current surge in interest in hydrofoil tech.

Apple TV

Stream your favourite shows now on Apple TV (affiliate link).

eracode

Smpl Mnmlst
9334 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6203

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#3242171 29-May-2024 10:34

Scott3:

As you say, a ground effect aircraft isn't really comparable to a hydrofoil boat. ~100km/h vs ~540km/h

Should note that commercial passenger hydrofoil vessels aren't new tech. The below came out in 1975. I took one between Hong Kong and Macau many years back:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_929_Jetfoil

That said it is great to see the current surge in interest in hydrofoil tech.

Yes - certainly aware that passenger hydrofoils are not new. I remember the Italian-made hydrofoil that Kerridge Odeon started operating in the early 1960s between Auckland and the resort they owned on Pakatoa Island.

It’s the electric part of this that’s new - claimed to be a world first.

Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.

wellygary

8816 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5300

#3242173 29-May-2024 10:46

eracode:

It’s the electric part of this that’s new - claimed to be a world first.

About that,

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0c0rxxl

"Our first P-12 Shuttle has entered serial production and will join Stockholm city’s fleet of public transportation ferries in 2024 in a pilot, on the main routes. The pilot will run throughout 2024 and evaluate the P-12’s performance, in terms of maneuverability, comfort, chargeability, wake, and noise."

https://candela.com/p-12-shuttle/

eracode

Smpl Mnmlst
9334 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6203

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#3242230 29-May-2024 11:12

@wellygary Although I didn’t know about the boat in your link, I was careful to say ‘claimed’ - because I would have been surprised if the Auckland one really was a world first. It’s not rocket science. More BS from NZH who either made that up or accepted what they were told and published it without fact-checking.

Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.

wellygary

8816 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5300

#3242236 29-May-2024 11:34

eracode:

@wellygary Although I didn’t know about the boat in your link, I was careful to say ‘claimed’ - because I would have been surprised if the Auckland one really was a world first. It’s not rocket science. More BS from NZH who either made that up or accepted what they were told and published it without fact-checking.

The NZ boat designers know what else is being done around the world, that's why their precise claim is

"world’s first electric hydrofoiling tourism vessel" - which is it .

But its certainly not the world's first electric hydro foiling passenger vessel and there is a lot of work going on in the sector...

tweake

2648 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1139

#3242240 29-May-2024 11:43

hydrofoil should work well. once up on the foil, the gain in efficiency helps with the lack of power/charge.

its no way related to the idiot idea the sea glider is. afaik seaglider has yet to make a full sized prototype.

Apple TV

Stream your favourite shows now on Apple TV (affiliate link).

eracode

Smpl Mnmlst
9334 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6203

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#3242242 29-May-2024 11:49

When you look at the very close design and passenger capacity similarities of the Vessev to the Stockholm vessel, it would be hair-splitting by Vessev to distinguish between theirs as a tourism vessel and the Candela vessel which operates a 20km ferry route.

Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.

MikeAqua

8032 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3822

#3256643 5-Jul-2024 14:11

I've been watching with interest electric foiling boats. I'm yet to see footage of one operating in anything other than a calm or very calm sea state.

Some of the claims are a bit iffy/exaggerated: -

No pollution - OK so it isn't antifouled, no oil or grease is used anywhere on the boat, nor metals or paint or ...?

No noise pollution - OK so there is no noise at all? No wind noise or hull noise and there is no noise underwater, where it can adversely effect many species?

Mike

tweake

2648 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1139

#3256647 5-Jul-2024 14:30

MikeAqua:

I've been watching with interest electric foiling boats. I'm yet to see footage of one operating in anything other than a calm or very calm sea state.

Some of the claims are a bit iffy/exaggerated: -

No pollution - OK so it isn't antifouled, no oil or grease is used anywhere on the boat, nor metals or paint or ...?

No noise pollution - OK so there is no noise at all? No wind noise or hull noise and there is no noise underwater, where it can adversely effect many species?

foiling boats are not new. there is a rather famous big ferry that i think may still be running. really impressive seeing something of that size zipping along with the hull out of the water.

the electric side, thats a bit debatable but the foils do help a lot.

MikeAqua

8032 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3822

#3256658 5-Jul-2024 15:23

tweake:

foiling boats are not new. there is a rather famous big ferry that i think may still be running. really impressive seeing something of that size zipping along with the hull out of the water.

the electric side, thats a bit debatable but the foils do help a lot.

I was thinking of the smaller foiling boats. At channel ferry size it isn't such an issue. But a 6m boat with a foil height of ~1m in a 1m sea would be ... interesting, I think. All the video I have seen shows the small foil-boats operating in mill-pond flat or slightly ruffled water. The video linked above is an example of that.

The electric side make sense to me in someways. Wetted surface and prismatic drag are the two big energy sappers in boats. Foiling massively reduces both, especially prismatic drag.

From a review of a Candela C7 Candela C7 ~ Boating NZ

"During our time with the C7 the flight height fluctuated a little unnervingly at times, especially in choppier water, and the noise of the hydraulics became more noticeable the harder they had to work. Nor was the electric motor especially quiet, though much quieter than a conventional outboard".

Looking at the hull shape it would be quite adventurous if you had to travel in displacement mode in a following sea.

Mike

1 | ... | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10