Winston. Kingmaker? Could Well Be.

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MikeB4
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#1825388 19-Jul-2017 17:02

SaltyNZ: Winston Peters re. Owen Glenn 2009?

I had forgotten about that fiasco. Mr Peters has been in a few funding related mysteries

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

DonGould

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#1825414 19-Jul-2017 18:12

Will Winston make Winston king this time?

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tdgeek

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#1825440 19-Jul-2017 19:28

DonGould:

Will Winston make Winston king this time?

Could Well Be!

But the bottom line from this thread is all parties are bad, most politicians are bad. Hard to evaluate policies when all that is the case

frankv

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#1825744 20-Jul-2017 10:34

tdgeek:

But the bottom line from this thread is all parties are bad, most politicians are bad. Hard to evaluate policies when all that is the case

I like the idea of direct democracy; the Swiss model seems to me to work well. We need binding referenda.

SaltyNZ

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#1825749 20-Jul-2017 10:43

frankv:

I like the idea of direct democracy; the Swiss model seems to me to work well. We need binding referenda.

Me too. But I think the chances of that are just slightly less than Metiria Turia and James Shaw being made Deputy Prime Minister and Treasurer in a National-led coalition.

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These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

MikeB4

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#1825774 20-Jul-2017 11:20

I think Mark Richardson may have brought himself a fight this morning

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/07/winston-peters-a-political-predator-mark-richardson.html

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

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MikeAqua

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#1825789 20-Jul-2017 11:44

Rikkitic:

I stand by my comment. A lot of people seem to have such a blind hatred of the Greens that they can't possibly conceive that anything good can come from them. It is not their policies, or their ideas, or their convictions, just the mere fact that the 'Green' label has been slapped on them. There is a real, arrogant, irrational, sneering dismissal of Green politics and the Green party by some on the right.

I don't hate the Green party. I do disagree with >95% of their policy mechanisms (but not always the end goals). I think the Greens play a valuable role as dissenting voice in opposition.

What irks me is Turei's hypocrisy and somewhat causal attitude to the matter.

Googling Turei calls for resignation and checking out the resulting articles is revealing. Turei has called for the heads of numerous people over ethical breaches. If she had frequently succeeded, she would have more stuffed politicians than the Backbencher.

The ethical standards she has sought to apply to others would also require her own resignation (or sacking).

As for the right arrogantly sneering at the left, it's very capably reciprocated. That's politics.

Mike

MikeAqua

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#1825790 20-Jul-2017 11:47

MikeB4:

I think Mark Richardson may have brought himself a fight this morning

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/07/winston-peters-a-political-predator-mark-richardson.html

I think he's right. Peter's isn't trying to assist with any of these problems, just stir people up and exacerbate conflict. I wonder to what extent Peter's simply diverted attention away from people affected by the Manawatu gorge closure.

As Joyce said he is "barking at every bus".

Mike

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#1825809 20-Jul-2017 12:06

MikeAqua:
MikeB4:

I think Mark Richardson may have brought himself a fight this morning

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/07/winston-peters-a-political-predator-mark-richardson.html

I think he's right. Peter's isn't trying to assist with any of these problems, just stir people up and exacerbate conflict. I wonder to what extent Peter's simply diverted attention away from people affected by the Manawatu gorge closure.

As Joyce said he is "barking at every bus".

He does this every election. Nothing new here.

ripdog

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#1825863 20-Jul-2017 13:11

It's really sad how much vitriol is thrown at people like Metiria who befraud the government for only a few thousand dollars, for the purpose of keeping food on their (and their childrens') plates and a roof over their heads. These people would rather poor people get thrown onto the street or live in freezing garages/cars rather than lie to get the bare necessities.

I have no doubt that the average income of people on this site is above average and folks in this thread moaning about bludgers and fraudsters have never been in a position of choosing between food and shelter.

Serious poverty is disturbingly common in New Zealand, and it's f***ing disgusting that we, as a developed economy, allow kids to go hungry to school and adults to live on the street. The Greens are the only party with a credible policy to seriously tackle poverty, rather than dither and dather on the edges.

I'd love to see some vitriol thrown at massive corporations which profit shift overseas to claim 'losses' in NZ when in reality they're making bank here - and not paying tax. The problem is dramatically more vast that benefit fraud, and the loss to NZ much greater. (Especially considering that benefit fraud goes to NZ citizens who then spend it in the local economy. Unauthorized stimulus?)

Wiggum

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#1825875 20-Jul-2017 13:38

ripdog:

It's really sad how much vitriol is thrown at people like Metiria who befraud the government for only a few thousand dollars, for the purpose of keeping food on their (and their childrens') plates and a roof over their heads.

Its never OK to steal from somebody else.

Consider other poor people, who also pay tax, who were also in the same boat at Metiria. Is it fare that Metiria steals from them?

You need to change you perspective as to how you look at this. Its not stealing from the government. Its stealing from all taxpayers, rich/poor, and others just like Metiria battling to make ends meet.

Metiria is a fraud, she should be fired. She stole from people worse off than herself. And is now using all this for her own political gain.

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frankv

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#1825882 20-Jul-2017 13:47

Batman:
MikeAqua:

MikeB4:

I think Mark Richardson may have brought himself a fight this morning

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/07/winston-peters-a-political-predator-mark-richardson.html

I think he's right. Peter's isn't trying to assist with any of these problems, just stir people up and exacerbate conflict. I wonder to what extent Peter's simply diverted attention away from people affected by the Manawatu gorge closure.

He does this every election. Nothing new here.

And of course Mark Richardson is doing the same thing. The more outrageous stuff he says, the happier the producers are. Verbal clickbait. Right up to the point where too many people get offended and he gets fired.

MikeAqua

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#1825891 20-Jul-2017 13:59

frankv:

I like the idea of direct democracy; the Swiss model seems to me to work well. We need binding referenda.

Be careful what you wish for. Results of this have been mixed in California. The state has to fund whatever binding referenda usher in.

Mike

Paul1977

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#1825892 20-Jul-2017 14:01

I don't like Winston Peters at all. I agree with some of what he says, but he's too smarmy and arrogant for my liking. And even when he does say things I agree with, I believe he only does so because he believes those positions score him political points. I think Winston is most concerned about Winston.

I'm loathed to compare anyone to Donald Trump, but as far as their campaigning styles go they are very similar. It's all about stirring up righteous indignation.

ripdog

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#1825946 20-Jul-2017 15:27

Wiggum:

ripdog:

It's really sad how much vitriol is thrown at people like Metiria who befraud the government for only a few thousand dollars, for the purpose of keeping food on their (and their childrens') plates and a roof over their heads.

Its never OK to steal from somebody else.

Consider other poor people, who also pay tax, who were also in the same boat at Metiria. Is it fare that Metiria steals from them?

You need to change you perspective as to how you look at this. Its not stealing from the government. Its stealing from all taxpayers, rich/poor, and others just like Metiria battling to make ends meet.

Metiria is a fraud, she should be fired. She stole from people worse off than herself. And is now using all this for her own political gain.

Last I checked, the vast majority of income tax comes from higher earners. Lower earners have less money to tax, it's taxed at a lower rate, AND they tend to have tax credits applied.

And quite frankly, if someone was in truly abject poverty and needed to steal a fraction of a cent from me to make ends meet, I don't have an issue with that. I want my tax to go to those who need it, and there's few more needy than single mums on welfare.

Again I ask: where is your outrage over tax evasion/avoidance? They both cost the country orders of magnitude more than benefit fraud, and yet all the rage is directed at the poor.

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