Christopher Luxon, New Zealand Prime Minister 2023

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Forums › Politics › Christopher Luxon, New Zealand Prime Minister 2023

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#3483572 23-Apr-2026 16:50

sen8or:

Its not a strawman at all, you either have the ability to compromise on some things to achieve your long term goals, or you don't. By not compromising you potentially end up achieving very little (cutting your nose off to spite your face, can't see the forest for the trees, pick your anecdote).

National formed a Govt with two polarising partners, Act who is the more natural partner of National (if not a little too far right for some of its more centre oriented voters) and NZF who comes with all sorts of baggage / fish hooks. Was it the deal of the century, hardly. National had to agree to let some policy go to select committee (Treaty Principals) that has been somewhat of a poisened chalice for National, but they did what was necessary to get into power and enact their own policies.

Not sure what you mean by non nationalist policy, but I think its safe to assume that National have been heavily criticized for many of their various policies this term.

The strawman is the “truly green” comment. The greens are assumed to only be interested in environmental policy when they have a broad policy base, the same as every other party.

They are the only party ever held to this strange standard.

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#3483574 23-Apr-2026 17:03

Fair point.

SaltyNZ

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#3483595 23-Apr-2026 19:57

nunasdream:

I've been a long term Green voter. But, the current party leadership places style over policy

Thus, I'll begrudgingly vote Labour.

Have you actually read any of the policies? https://www.greens.org.nz/policy_complete_party

Here's one I helped write: https://www.greens.org.nz/emergency_management_policy

We were disappointed that we could not include even more detail in it. I think we ended up chopping out at least 3 more pages of stuff. shrug Policies have to be high level, they said...

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#3483629 24-Apr-2026 07:59

I read one policy; 'extend paid parental leave'.... to what? No number / time period given.

The thing that forces most parents back to work is that PPL tops out at a stupidly low amount and living off one income is impractical for 99% of workers - assuming you have a two parent household, which is not always the case.

Being able to take longer parental leave is a massive luxury not many could afford, even if it was enshrined in legislation.

As a soundbite it sounds good, but I'm not sure who this policy is for.

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#3483634 24-Apr-2026 08:25

GV27:

I read one policy; 'extend paid parental leave'.... to what? No number / time period given.

The thing that forces most parents back to work is that PPL tops out at a stupidly low amount and living off one income is impractical for 99% of workers - assuming you have a two parent household, which is not always the case.

Being able to take longer parental leave is a massive luxury not many could afford, even if it was enshrined in legislation.

As a soundbite it sounds good, but I'm not sure who this policy is for.

Please to be rereading my previous comment:

We were disappointed that we could not include even more detail in it. I think we ended up chopping out at least 3 more pages of stuff. shrug Policies have to be high level, they said...

It's not that that stuff does not exist. It's that the policy documents are explicitly high level.

Also:

Being able to take longer parental leave is a massive luxury not many could afford, even if it was enshrined in legislation.

Just because you are permitted to take it as a matter of law, does not mean you are obligated to take it in practice, you know. The law just means you can't be fired for taking it if you choose to.

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#3483637 24-Apr-2026 08:40

So the policy docs are so high level that people can't actually see what they'd be voting for? How is it possible for voters to become informed if the information is effectively with-held?

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#3483638 24-Apr-2026 08:51

GV27:

So the policy docs are so high level that people can't actually see what they'd be voting for? How is it possible for voters to become informed if the information is effectively with-held?

If knowing that number right now is important to you, Marama's email address is Marama.Davidson@parliament.govt.nz. She will no doubt be very happy to engage you in a conversation about it.

It's great you've read all our policy in such detail; I only wish you had mentioned such deficiencies in the published documents before I linked to the page here. We only just finished final review of some of them a couple of months ago. Your input would have been invaluable.

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#3483710 24-Apr-2026 13:19

SaltyNZ:

Tried that. Think 2017 - Peters made sure only NZF was formally in coalition with Labour. James Shaw was a minister, but outside cabinet, and effectively with no budget. He managed to get some things done, but only if it didn't annoy Winston enough for him to veto it outright.

But then all of those things - clean car scheme, climate resilience fund, oil and gas new exploration ban - all were immediately overturned by the new government. There is no sense in which the Luxon government would have "worked with" the Green Party on anything.

None of that happens in a vacuum. Make someone your enemy they will take the opportunity to screw you over in forming a coalition, or reverse your policy gains when they get into power. Is it petty? Sure. It's politics.

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#3483712 24-Apr-2026 13:26

gzt:
Those are not the only choice. The Green Party has very credible candidates in the Maori seats, including an ex-legal advisor of Te Pati Maori. There is enough similarity on policy I think it will come down to how people feel about the candidates and the work they're putting in.

IIRC the greens have won like four seats in their entire history, none of those are Maori seats. Fitzsimmons, Swarbrick, Genter, someone else ...

Their candidates might be credible people, but they are very unlikely to win any Maori seats.

Mike

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#3483714 24-Apr-2026 13:30

Handle9:

You could say the same for ACT. The more extreme the party the less likely they are to work with the other side of the aisle.

Act has been part of coalition governments. The Greens never have.

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#3483715 24-Apr-2026 13:31

MikeAqua:

None of that happens in a vacuum. Make someone you enemy they will take the opportunity to screw you over informing a coalition, or reverse your policy gains when they get into power. Is it petty? Sure. It's politics.

I don't think the Green Party "made" NZF their enemy. NZF just naturally despises any attitude more progressive than the 1950s straight white man. Likewise ACT.

And the Luxon government isn't run by Luxon.

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#3483716 24-Apr-2026 13:34

Handle9:

The strawman is the “truly green” comment. The greens are assumed to only be interested in environmental policy when they have a broad policy base, the same as every other party.

They are the only party ever held to this strange standard.

Honestly, if they were just an environmentally focused party, I could maybe stomach voting for them. There economic and social policies are way too left for me. My thought process is: "What would this party do with parliamentary majority?" In the case of the Greens, the answer is irrevocably change New Zealand, and (on balance) not for the better.

Mike

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#3483720 24-Apr-2026 13:43

And yet if they were, it would be "I can't vote for the Greens, they're a single issue party, and I care about a lot of other things too". I don't say 'Honestly, if ACT were just a socially liberal focused party, maybe I could stomach voting for them. Their economic policies are way too right for me."

You can just say you won't vote for the Greens. I am not offended, and if I was, it wouldn't matter anyway.

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#3483727 24-Apr-2026 13:57

MikeAqua:
gzt:
Those are not the only choice. The Green Party has very credible candidates in the Maori seats, including an ex-legal advisor of Te Pati Maori. There is enough similarity on policy I think it will come down to how people feel about the candidates and the work they're putting in.

IIRC the greens have won like four seats in their entire history, none of those are Maori seats. Fitzsimmons, Swarbrick, Genter, someone else ... Their candidates might be credible people, but they are very unlikely to win any Maori seats.

Well who knows but this time is very different. Labour lost all those seats to Te Pati over the years. The Green Party has established a lot of trust in the intervening years. Combined with a good candidate and a good campaign it is very possible voters may prefer that when compared to reverting to Labour.

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#3483736 24-Apr-2026 14:23

I have voted for the Greens in the past but I don't consider myself a Greens supporter. It is just that the other choices are so awful. I won't vote for them this time because they never go anywhere. I think I will give TOP a try. Not because I think they are any better, but because they might be different and that way I don't have to vote for Labour or National.

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