J Adern, How will she affect the election, and is she a good leader?

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#1863179 13-Sep-2017 08:26

GV27:

The affordable homes in the ballot require you to live in them for two years and the Welcome Home loans require you to live in it until the loan is repaid.

Not sure what that means in practice as you could pay it back by refinancing it, but the ballot rules seem pretty set in stone.

So after 2 years, you can flog the house for $1million if a buyer offers you that?

GV27

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#1863338 13-Sep-2017 10:23

Geektastic:

GV27:

The affordable homes in the ballot require you to live in them for two years and the Welcome Home loans require you to live in it until the loan is repaid.

Not sure what that means in practice as you could pay it back by refinancing it, but the ballot rules seem pretty set in stone.

So after 2 years, you can flog the house for $1million if a buyer offers you that?

Yes, however they are stated as being 'First Home' grants. I'm a bit older so it would end up being a forever home (and aiming at 2 bedroom ones), but when 'affordable housing' is a one bedroom apartment for $490K then it's not really practical to put theirs lives on hold even further to satisfy arbitrary rules. Two years seems reasonable.

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#1864321 13-Sep-2017 10:41

That's insane. 100,000 homes which just need to be lived on for 2 years then can be flogged for any amount. That seems like it's going to cause a small dip in pricing followed by another housing boom at high prices.

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#1864328 13-Sep-2017 10:47

networkn:

That's insane. 100,000 homes which just need to be lived on for 2 years then can be flogged for any amount. That seems like it's going to cause a small dip in pricing followed by another housing boom at high prices.

That's more or less what I was getting at!

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#1864338 13-Sep-2017 10:54

So what's the solution? Bearing in mind many people have put off having children already, are you going to lock them into living in a one bedroom apartment for five - ten years?

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#1864371 13-Sep-2017 11:31

GV27:

So what's the solution? Bearing in mind many people have put off having children already, are you going to lock them into living in a one bedroom apartment for five - ten years?

There is no easy solution, that's the whole point. Labour wants you to believe that National has neglected the situation, but in reality the situation is complicated and there isn't an easy answer. Unless you are going to smother the free market you have to balance supply and demand issues.

You can cool the market short term but unless supply exceeds demand which isn't likely to occur with the likes of @allo running around saying owning a house is a God given right and nothing else is to be aspired to, you can't easily solve it.

People will need to compromise to some degree if they want home ownership, by living outside the big centers, living in smaller spaces, or paying higher prices.

I travelled a fair bit in the last 3 years, and EVERYWHERE I went, Germany, Paris, Spain, London, Singapore and Malaysia, Melbourne, Sydney and the Gold Coast, the tours we did talked about a "housing crisis". Less so in Asia because high density houses and large families living in smaller spaces is considered normal.

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#1864400 13-Sep-2017 11:40

Geektastic:

So after 2 years, you can flog the house for $1million if a buyer offers you that?

And then those first home buyers become rich - Can't have that!

The policy is flawed.

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MikeAqua

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#1864557 13-Sep-2017 15:17

Possibly the real reason labour wants to cut immigration ...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11851380

https://www.enz.org/migrants.html

Mike

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#1864561 13-Sep-2017 15:19

I am guessing the NZ Herald is a left leaning rag? Seems to me they have had nothing positive on National and seem to almost be slobbering over JA.

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#1864563 13-Sep-2017 15:21

Is it? I always thought they favoured the right. Hard to tell these days, I guess.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

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#1864564 13-Sep-2017 15:22

Wiggum:

Geektastic:

So after 2 years, you can flog the house for $1million if a buyer offers you that?

And then those first home buyers become rich - Can't have that!

The policy is flawed.

You'll never hear me object to people becoming rich (although in my view that means you need owned assets of at least $10 million before you move from 'well off' to 'rich') but there really is no point in selling a sob story about 'affordable housing' as if you can just build a relatively small number of houses and the problem will magically go away.

The problem is partly that we are a low wage economy and we need a plan to change THAT as much as we need a plan to build more houses. I do not see a plan for that bit...!

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#1864570 13-Sep-2017 15:30

networkn:

I am guessing the NZ Herald is a left leaning rag? Seems to me they have had nothing positive on National and seem to almost be slobbering over JA.

China is the second biggest source of migrants (2016).

Only 15% of Chinese voters say they will vote labour. 75% national and 5% NZ First

India is the biggest source of migrants (2016).

50% of Indian voters (2014 data) say they will vote National.

The Pacifica community is not as staunchly labour as it used to be.

Labour must be concerned about the long term impact of migration has for them

Mike

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#1864575 13-Sep-2017 15:38

GV27:

So what's the solution? Bearing in mind many people have put off having children already, are you going to lock them into living in a one bedroom apartment for five - ten years?

Having children is not compulsory. It's a perfectly valid thing to put off forever.

OTOH, do you think everyone in Britain, USA, Germany, France etc somehow gets a multi-bedroom home when they decide to have children? They really don't. And if they do, IME, it's often far smaller than Kiwis expect until later in life when they are earning more and can afford a bigger one.

The cost of new build houses is an amalgam of wages, materials, land, council fees, professional fees and developer's profit. To reduce the cost, somehow you need to affect some of those in a meaningful way.

Building materials are extremely expensive here and I have heard muttering about doing things to combat that, but see no action nor can I really imagine what could be done that would have an effect on that. If you (for example) made building materials for new builds exempt from GST, all you would achieve is increasing the developer's profit by 15% I suspect.

Councils could be directed by law to provide all services relating to new builds free of charge: however, all that will do is increase the burden on ratepayers, as council employees still need to be paid etc.

Lower wages won't work - again, it would probably just increase the developer's profits and it would be a brave politician that suggested wage caps...!

Making the government the developer and working at zero profit is one way - but I think you'd need some way for the tax payer to be refunded for their largesse when such a house was sold on: profit could be divided between the government and the vendor, for example, or a tax levied on such sales of 10% or something.