North and South Korea talks

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#2005005 30-Apr-2018 11:44

I think the biggest problem in trying to guess what he's up to is that everything that's known about him as a "verified fact" could be scribbled on the back of an envelope.

tdgeek

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#2007429 3-May-2018 19:37

From CNN

Following the success of the summit, planning is now underway for US President Donald Trump to meet with North Korean leader Kim Jong Un within a month to further discuss the dismantling of North Korea's nuclear arsenal.

That is so wrong. Its not about removing NK's nuclear weaponry, its about denuclearisation, its not the same thing. Will the US remove its nuclear umbrella ? No. Problem solved. Both the US and NK will reman nuclear nations. It makes me wonder where CNN's words come from = propaganda.

Fred99

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#2012759 9-May-2018 15:32

North Korea can't be all bad - they even have "new type of specialty beer".

Looks like something you'd get from a horse with a kidney infection.

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#2012781 9-May-2018 16:05

Those women have a lot to learn about pouring beer. I'm sure they don't want to come to a corrupt western democracy to learn though. Perhaps we could send them to Iran. Oh wait ...

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#2012801 9-May-2018 16:57

Looks like the average pint of Lion Brown to me!

Fred99

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#2012869 9-May-2018 18:52

DaveB:

Looks like the average pint of Lion Brown to me!

You need to go to Specsavers.

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#2012880 9-May-2018 19:20

MikeAqua:

Those women have a lot to learn about pouring beer. I'm sure they don't want to come to a corrupt western democracy to learn though. Perhaps we could send them to Iran. Oh wait ...

I think they want to get a head...

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#2012884 9-May-2018 19:24

I watched another doco on KJU. Pretty darn interesting. Managing the US, done. Managing SK, done. Managing propaganda, done. He has taken the KJS stance not the KJI stance. Transparent, engaged his sister, auntie, to get an across the board resonance. But how will he manage NK citizens getting a taste of first world SK? That is tricky.

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#2012972 9-May-2018 21:22

I hope nk and sk are able to resume the humanitarian efforts for those that were separated during the war, with all care, as soon as possible. That can't be soon enough really.

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#2013345 10-May-2018 12:52

gzt: I hope nk and sk are able to resume the humanitarian efforts for those that were separated during the war, with all care, as soon as possible. That can't be soon enough really.

I don't expect it to happen - perhaps with the exception of some staged, controlled events.

Put it this way, the power of NK leaders is protected not just by the gun, but by maintaining god-emperor status for the leaders. With a free exchange of information between re-united family members - inevitably showing up a huge gulf between opportunity and wealth afforded by the two systems - then that god-emperor status falls apart.

So I can't see it happening except perhaps for allowing some new contact with highly trusted hand-picked North Koreans loyal to KJU.

I'm fearful that KJU is trolling the West into a trap. The outcome might not be all bad, perhaps there's a slim chance that Trump might achieve an agreement for verifiable denuclearisation in exchange for reduction of sanctions - which would be a good thing. More likely IMO, the trap is set for Trump to fail, for KJU to put the blame for this on claims of US hegemony (at least partly true), and for him to appeal to China and Russia for relief.

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#2013397 10-May-2018 13:41

The nuclear issue is a security issue for NK so it's a chicken and egg scenaio there. I assume all parties have already decided on a sensible approach to security or the parties would not be talking. Sk is certainly moving ahead.

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#2013410 10-May-2018 13:56

Fred99:

gzt: I hope nk and sk are able to resume the humanitarian efforts for those that were separated during the war, with all care, as soon as possible. That can't be soon enough really.

I don't expect it to happen - perhaps with the exception of some staged, controlled events.

Put it this way, the power of NK leaders is protected not just by the gun, but by maintaining god-emperor status for the leaders. With a free exchange of information between re-united family members - inevitably showing up a huge gulf between opportunity and wealth afforded by the two systems - then that god-emperor status falls apart.

So I can't see it happening except perhaps for allowing some new contact with highly trusted hand-picked North Koreans loyal to KJU.

I'm fearful that KJU is trolling the West into a trap. The outcome might not be all bad, perhaps there's a slim chance that Trump might achieve an agreement for verifiable denuclearisation in exchange for reduction of sanctions - which would be a good thing. More likely IMO, the trap is set for Trump to fail, for KJU to put the blame for this on claims of US hegemony (at least partly true), and for him to appeal to China and Russia for relief.

I agree.

NK removing its weapons won't happen. He told his people the other week they are there to protect the country. There will be denuclearisation, but the same as the Cold War. Weapons were set to maximum limits. This is where Trump will spit the dummy, and maybe walk away, as he said he might do.Sanctions will start to reduce, US wont accept that, and maybe penalise others as he may do with the West countries that support the Iran deal and that the US has now walked away from. There are many countries, both regional and global who can manage such affairs, and if the US isnt part of it, manage it much better

Edit. The issue of NK citizens is extremely thorny. Little will happen for a long while apart from staged events as you say. By then, theings will be better NK wise, KJU will want some form of border control or that SK wont just accept NK citizens willy nilly. But thats a while off, worry about that later

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#2013722 11-May-2018 07:31

June 12, Singapore

From Washington Post

Trump has spoken in increasingly positive terms about the summit, while cautioning that he is prepared to walk away if progress isn't being made. At the top of the agenda will be North Korea's nuclear programme. Trump has said any deal will have to include the denuclearisation of the rogue nation.

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#2017291 17-May-2018 07:42

So, as well as the military exercises that were so clearly stupid to run, the US has spelled out what their definition of nuclearisation is. Removal and unfettered inspections. That will never happen, and they must know this. So instead of just keeping quiet and seeing what developes, they have placed their cards on the table, seemingly to get NK to react. Then they can say NK walked away. Its very clear that the US is being a bully, has no interest to negotiate, nor to see where diplomacy can take this issue. NK and SK have made great progress towards a possible breakthrough, yet the US just wants to ruin it. I expect a Twitter Tanty from Trump when these talks next month do not happen and/or when NK and SK have the talks instead. I hope other nations offer to help, despite the threats that US will use

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#2017332 17-May-2018 08:54

tdgeek:

So, as well as the military exercises that were so clearly stupid to run, the US has spelled out what their definition of nuclearisation is. Removal and unfettered inspections. That will never happen, and they must know this. So instead of just keeping quiet and seeing what developes, they have placed their cards on the table, seemingly to get NK to react. Then they can say NK walked away. Its very clear that the US is being a bully, has no interest to negotiate, nor to see where diplomacy can take this issue. NK and SK have made great progress towards a possible breakthrough, yet the US just wants to ruin it. I expect a Twitter Tanty from Trump when these talks next month do not happen and/or when NK and SK have the talks instead. I hope other nations offer to help, despite the threats that US will use

Agree, I'd say our new great Sec. of State and Bolton will be driving this. Trump might still be keen to come up with some giant deal to prove he is better than Obama though.

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