Spark UFB Modem - Fibre 30/10 plan + Gigatown

Forums › Spark New Zealand (including Skinny and BigPipe) › Spark UFB Modem - Fibre 30/10 plan + Gigatown

paul151

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#160453 7-Jan-2015 11:05

Just signed up for the UFB 30/10 plan while I wait for the Chorus team to finishing wiring up my street. Hopefully this work will be done by early next month.

I'm concerned that my 'free' modem with the 12 month plan that is soon to be shipped to my house may not be up to it when it comes to the 1 gigabit speeds I'll shift to when they become available in Dunedin.

Does anyone from Spark lurk here that can comment? I've only signed up because I plan to take advantage of the Spark Gigatown offer for Dunedin residents. The Spark website says 'Get Fibre 30 or 100 now and, once our new Gigatown plans are available, switch over for free when you sign up for a new 12mth contract'

My expectation is that a hardware I receive on the basis of signing up with the intent on switching to as yet unavailable plan would be able to supply gigabit LAN connectivity.

I'm concerned that I'm about to get a HG630b ?? in the mail soon that won't handle the jandle. What will Spark do for Gigatown customers who have signed in good faith in Jan 2015 to ensure their hardware is up to it?

Oh, I was told at the Dunedin George St store they could not flag in their system that I wanted to upgrade to the Gigatown offer when it was available. That once Gigatown speeds were available I needed to alert them and then I would be shifted over. This seems strange to me. How am I going to know from a technical standpoint the speed is now available, asides any mainstream media coverage?

I would have thought the exchange software combined with account management software could have shifted customers over that had asked to be 'flagged to do so' in advance? Guess not?

PeterReader

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#1209778 7-Jan-2015 11:05

Hello... Our robot found some keywords in your post, so here is an automated reply with some important things to note regarding broadband speeds.

If you are posting regarding DSL speeds please check that

- you have reset your modem and router

- your PC (or other PCs in your LAN) is not downloading large files when you are testing

- you are not being throttled by your ISP due to going over the monthly cap

- your tests are always done on an ethernet connection to the router - do not use wireless for testing

- you read this topic and follow the instructions there.

Make sure you provide information for other users to help you. If you have not already done it, please EDIT your post and add this now:

- Your ISP and plan

- Type of connection (ADSL, ADSL2, VDSL)

- Your modem DSL stats (do not worry about posting Speedtest, we need sync rate, attenuation and noise margin)

- Your general location (or street)

- If you are rural or urban

- If you know your connection is to an exchange, cabinet or conklin

- If your connection is to a ULL or wholesale service

- If you have done an isolation test as per the link above

Most of the problems with speed are likely to be related to internal wiring issues. Read this discussion to find out more about this. Your ISP is not intentionally slowing you down today (unless you are on a managed plan). Also if this is the school holidays it's likely you will notice slower than usual speed due to more users online.

A master splitter is required for VDSL2 and in most cases will improve speeds on DSL connections. Regular disconnections can be a monitored alarm or a set top box trying to connect. If there's an alarm connected to your line even if you don't have an alarm contract it may still try to connect so it's worth checking.

I recommend you read these two blog posts:

- Is your premises phone wiring impacting your broadband performance? (very technical)

- Are you receiving a substandard ULL ADSL2+ connection from your ISP?

I am the Geekzone Robot and I am here to help. I am from the Internet. I do not interact. Do not expect other replies from me.

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Ragnor

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#1209938 7-Jan-2015 14:37

They will likely send out a different device when/after people actually sign up to Gigatown. Probably doesn't make sense to them to send out a higher end device until then.

Sending out the cheapest most basic piece of crap is just business... The average joe doesn't notice.

ISP's can't offer high end devices for free economically and when they offer them for an additional cost (eg: Snap Fritzbox) many people are too cheap to take them. Just like many people were/are too cheap to pay for master filter installs.

Anyway as always friends don't let friends use ISP provided modem/routers if possible.

InstallerUFB

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#1209942 7-Jan-2015 14:45

paul151: <snip> I would have thought the exchange software combined with account management software could have shifted customers over that had asked to be 'flagged to do so' in advance? Guess not?

Exchange (GPON) Management Software is Chorus's (LFC) / Account Management Software is Spark's (RSP) - two different companies

lxsw20

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#1209950 7-Jan-2015 14:57

My guess is they will provide the HG659B router for Gigatown customers.

paul151

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#1210021 7-Jan-2015 16:58

Ragnor: friends don't let friends use ISP provided modem/routers if possible.

So I bridge it when I get it to something else? What would you suggest would be worth getting?

plambrechtsen

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#1210307 8-Jan-2015 05:12

paul151:
Ragnor: friends don't let friends use ISP provided modem/routers if possible.

So I bridge it when I get it to something else? What would you suggest would be worth getting?

In the brave new world of UFB you don't need to use our router or run it in bridging mode since it's an ethernet port you plug into. You just need a router that supports PPPoE over VLAN 10.
The issue is only medium to high end routers tend to support the VLAN 10 tagging on the WAN, and no you can't opt out of turning off VLAN 10 tagging.

But to answer your question you will most probably get a 630 when you sign up and that device is perfectly adequate to run 100mb UFB connections. So I have no qualms saying use it unlike Ragnor :). As there are ongoing conversations as to the CPE we will supply under Gigatown, which is still being actively tested in our lab to ensure it works as expected. It may be the 659, it may be something different.

paul151

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#1210684 8-Jan-2015 17:00

plambrechtsen: In the brave new world of UFB you don't need to use our router or run it in bridging mode since it's an ethernet port you plug into. You just need a router that supports PPPoE over VLAN 10. The issue is only medium to high end routers tend to support the VLAN 10 tagging on the WAN, and no you can't opt out of turning off VLAN 10 tagging.

Ah, brave new worlds sound like fun :-)

I'm interested to see what I can / can't do with the 630 but was thinking of putting in something like a MicroTik router when all of this shakes out as I want more control over what the teens online activities and time spent online etc.

Can you point me at a few of the medium to high end routers I could look at as an alternative to whatever does end up shiping from Spark?

But to answer your question you will most probably get a 630 when you sign up and that device is perfectly adequate to run 100mb UFB connections. So I have no qualms saying use it unlike Ragnor :)

I'm looking at it like you I suspect, it's a bit of kit that will do the job for the plan I'll be on pre-upgrade to Gigatown

As there are ongoing conversations as to the CPE we will supply under Gigatown, which is still being actively tested in our lab to ensure it works as expected. It may be the 659, it may be something different.

CPE? Newbie question. And when Spark does settle on what it will do/use to roll out the 1 Gigabit service how long will it take to deploy over the top of the existing UFB infrastructure the Chorus guys are installing up my street as I type :-) ??

I think I read somewhere Spark was going to be later to the party offering Gigabit speeds compared to some of the other ISPs playing in this pond?

Thanks for the fast reply and helpful info, appreciated :-)

plambrechtsen

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#1211059 9-Jan-2015 12:29

paul151:
plambrechtsen: In the brave new world of UFB you don't need to use our router or run it in bridging mode since it's an ethernet port you plug into. You just need a router that supports PPPoE over VLAN 10. The issue is only medium to high end routers tend to support the VLAN 10 tagging on the WAN, and no you can't opt out of turning off VLAN 10 tagging.

Ah, brave new worlds sound like fun :-)

I'm interested to see what I can / can't do with the 630 but was thinking of putting in something like a MicroTik router when all of this shakes out as I want more control over what the teens online activities and time spent online etc.

Can you point me at a few of the medium to high end routers I could look at as an alternative to whatever does end up shiping from Spark?

Hummm I tend to shy away from recommending anything other than the spark supplied CPE (Customer Premises Equipment) aka the Spark supplied router. Since then the expectation would be on me to get it working, support it and be to blame if things go wrong. With the greatest respect I don't really want to be in that position. There are plenty of suggestions on here in the UFB generic forum of capable routers. I always tend towards the higher end ones such as Cisco or Juniper otherwise building my own running OpenWRT/Linux of some flavor works for me :)

paul151:
plambrechtsen: But to answer your question you will most probably get a 630 when you sign up and that device is perfectly adequate to run 100mb UFB connections. So I have no qualms saying use it unlike Ragnor :)

I'm looking at it like you I suspect, it's a bit of kit that will do the job for the plan I'll be on pre-upgrade to Gigatown

As there are ongoing conversations as to the CPE we will supply under Gigatown, which is still being actively tested in our lab to ensure it works as expected. It may be the 659, it may be something different.

CPE? Newbie question. And when Spark does settle on what it will do/use to roll out the 1 Gigabit service how long will it take to deploy over the top of the existing UFB infrastructure the Chorus guys are installing up my street as I type :-) ??

I think I read somewhere Spark was going to be later to the party offering Gigabit speeds compared to some of the other ISPs playing in this pond?

Thanks for the fast reply and helpful info, appreciated :-)

As said above CPE = Customer Premises Equipment, that's the Spark supplied router or using your own. Not the Fibre Company supplied ONT which you plug into, which Spark have no control over.

In regards to when we will come to the party, I can roughly say we won't be the first to offer Gigatown, nor will we be the last :).

But I can say our products will be of the highest grade and offer the best stability no matter when you use them. Which as a company is really how we roll.

I'm personally struggling to see how it will greatly differ from the 100mb service. For the few that really use 100mb, it may be of advantage, but for the vast majority of customers there will be little to no improvement of experience apart from downloads may get down just that little bit faster if the content is served locally.

I live on 14mb ADSL as there isn't anything better available without moving house or moving to Vodafone Cable which I refuse to do on principal. And see a number of the data usage across our broadband customer fleet. So I am personally struggling to see how it's anything other than marketing.

paul151

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#1211382 9-Jan-2015 20:00

Hummm I tend to shy away from recommending anything other than the spark supplied CPE (Customer Premises Equipment) aka the Spark supplied router. Since then the expectation would be on me to get it working, support it and be to blame if things go wrong. With the greatest respect I don't really want to be in that position. There are plenty of suggestions on here in the UFB generic forum of capable routers. I always tend towards the higher end ones such as Cisco or Juniper otherwise building my own running OpenWRT/Linux of some flavor works for me :)

Fair enough and thanks for the info you have offered. I certainly don't want to stick you in any uncomfortable position :-)

As said above CPE = Customer Premises Equipment, that's the Spark supplied router or using your own. Not the Fibre Company supplied ONT which you plug into, which Spark have no control over.

Ah, OK, all good - it's just a lingo I'm coming up to speed with.

In regards to when we will come to the party, I can roughly say we won't be the first to offer Gigatown, nor will we be the last :).
But I can say our products will be of the highest grade and offer the best stability no matter when you use them. Which as a company is really how we roll.

Yep, given the size and scale of the Spark operation I'd expect nothing less re high quality / stability :-)
I just hope Dunedin Spark customers are not waiting until the middle of the year to get access to the speeds offered as part of the Gigatown prize.

I'm personally struggling to see how it will greatly differ from the 100mb service. For the few that really use 100mb, it may be of advantage, but for the vast majority of customers there will be little to no improvement of experience apart from downloads may get down just that little bit faster if the content is served locally.

I live on 14mb ADSL as there isn't anything better available without moving house or moving to Vodafone Cable which I refuse to do on principal. And see a number of the data usage across our broadband customer fleet. So I am personally struggling to see how it's anything other than marketing.

That's the most interesting comment of this thread. I'm interested in where the Gigatown speed 'advantage' starts/stops? You seem to suggest it's fine for folks within the city but how far do those speeds really reach? Do we still end up hitting a traffic snarl up (to use motorway parlance) when traffic leaves NZ and travels the same cable as everyone else or do you think there will be some prioritisation done at this level?

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plambrechtsen

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#1211389 9-Jan-2015 20:31

paul151: Yep, given the size and scale of the Spark operation I'd expect nothing less re high quality / stability :-)
I just hope Dunedin Spark customers are not waiting until the middle of the year to get access to the speeds offered as part of the Gigatown prize.

I think it's unlikely that we wouldn't have launched by then, I can't comment on dates but there are a few competing projects in the Non production environment so things can slip.

paul151:

I'm personally struggling to see how it will greatly differ from the 100mb service. For the few that really use 100mb, it may be of advantage, but for the vast majority of customers there will be little to no improvement of experience apart from downloads may get down just that little bit faster if the content is served locally.

I live on 14mb ADSL as there isn't anything better available without moving house or moving to Vodafone Cable which I refuse to do on principal. And see a number of the data usage across our broadband customer fleet. So I am personally struggling to see how it's anything other than marketing.

That's the most interesting comment of this thread. I'm interested in where the Gigatown speed 'advantage' starts/stops? You seem to suggest it's fine for folks within the city but how far do those speeds really reach? Do we still end up hitting a traffic snarl up (to use motorway parlance) when traffic leaves NZ and travels the same cable as everyone else or do you think there will be some prioritisation done at this level?

The tyranny of distance and how TCP works means that unless you are using UDP or a multi-threaded download it's unlikely that you would get over 20MB/s which is about 160mb connection or so when talking to a site in the UK which is around 300ms away.

Few calculators to look at:

http://wand.net.nz/~perry/max_download.php

http://www.convert-me.com/en/convert/data_transfer_rate/dmegabitps.html

So really anything over that, is really icing on the cake which you would only really use with multi-threaded downloads, or downloading files that are coming off local Contend Delivery Networks (CDNs) servers.

Sideface

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#1211405 9-Jan-2015 20:49

plambrechtsen: ... I live on 14mb ADSL as there isn't anything better available without moving house or moving to Vodafone Cable which I refuse to do on principal. ...

Please explain.

I went from ADSL2 to cable (100/10) 2 years ago - UFB will not be an option until 2020 - it's like going from a Morris Minor to a BMW.

Sideface

plambrechtsen

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#1211409 9-Jan-2015 21:10

Sideface:
plambrechtsen: ... I live on 14mb ADSL as there isn't anything better available without moving house or moving to Vodafone Cable which I refuse to do on principal. ...

Please explain.

I went from ADSL2 to cable (100/10) 2 years ago - UFB will not be an option until 2020 - it's like going from a Morris Minor to a BMW.

I was a cable customer when it was TelstraClear, and the times I had issues (which was semi-frequently until I demanded that they come out and replace the overhead lead-in cable and coax splitter which resolved my cable instability issue) I would spend upwards of an hour on hold waiting to get someone no matter the time I tried to call. Some things haven't changed when it moved to Vodafone.

Call me unreasonable, but when I call up for support (infrequent that it may be) I tend to like someone answering in under 30 mins at peak.

But then again since I had ADSL installed I haven't had a single outage in 3 years. The last time the PPP session dropped was when I moved my connection to a new Static IP for testing.

paul151

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#1211417 9-Jan-2015 21:45

plambrechtsen: But then again since I had ADSL installed I haven't had a single outage in 3 years. The last time the PPP session dropped was when I moved my connection to a new Static IP for testing.

Newbie question, can you get static IP with UFB and is it the same crazy rates as per home ADSL?

I'm on a dynamic one that only changes when things drop and touch wood so far they have not (much) - will the same thing apply to my 30/10 fibre plan - in fact does it really ever 'drop' once you're on a plan like that?

Quic "Sprinter" UFB - Ref (free setup): R338237EFDIUJ

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plambrechtsen

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#1211445 9-Jan-2015 22:35

paul151:
plambrechtsen: But then again since I had ADSL installed I haven't had a single outage in 3 years. The last time the PPP session dropped was when I moved my connection to a new Static IP for testing.

Newbie question, can you get static IP with UFB and is it the same crazy rates as per home ADSL?

I'm on a dynamic one that only changes when things drop and touch wood so far they have not (much) - will the same thing apply to my 30/10 fibre plan - in fact does it really ever 'drop' once you're on a plan like that?

The broadband stack is the same no matter the access be it adsl, vdsl or ufb. So yes you can get a static ip depending on your plan it may be included apart from the unlimited plan which you can't get a static ip. And yes you get a new ip each reconnect of the pppoe session. I have seen sessions up for 180+ days.

michaelmurfy

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#1211461 9-Jan-2015 23:26

paul151:
plambrechtsen: In the brave new world of UFB you don't need to use our router or run it in bridging mode since it's an ethernet port you plug into. You just need a router that supports PPPoE over VLAN 10. The issue is only medium to high end routers tend to support the VLAN 10 tagging on the WAN, and no you can't opt out of turning off VLAN 10 tagging.

Ah, brave new worlds sound like fun :-)

I'm interested to see what I can / can't do with the 630 but was thinking of putting in something like a MicroTik router when all of this shakes out as I want more control over what the teens online activities and time spent online etc.

Can you point me at a few of the medium to high end routers I could look at as an alternative to whatever does end up shiping from Spark?

But to answer your question you will most probably get a 630 when you sign up and that device is perfectly adequate to run 100mb UFB connections. So I have no qualms saying use it unlike Ragnor :)

I'm looking at it like you I suspect, it's a bit of kit that will do the job for the plan I'll be on pre-upgrade to Gigatown

As there are ongoing conversations as to the CPE we will supply under Gigatown, which is still being actively tested in our lab to ensure it works as expected. It may be the 659, it may be something different.

CPE? Newbie question. And when Spark does settle on what it will do/use to roll out the 1 Gigabit service how long will it take to deploy over the top of the existing UFB infrastructure the Chorus guys are installing up my street as I type :-) ??

I think I read somewhere Spark was going to be later to the party offering Gigabit speeds compared to some of the other ISPs playing in this pond?

Thanks for the fast reply and helpful info, appreciated :-)

Just so you know I've benchmarked my Mikrotik RB951G-2HnD to be able to route very very close to 1gbit of traffic as long as you don't have traffic queueing or anything that will smash the CPU running on it. I just bought a house and am going to install the MikroTik CRS125-24G-1S-RM for geek-cred and because there is actually a wall rack in the house - having a router that does switching is a little bit of a bonus since it saves room in the rack and looks pretty awesome, for WiFi I am going to be using a UniFi-AC router and this will give me sub-gigabit speed over WiFi (with a supported device) as well as gigabit access all over the house via Ethernet (to 200/200 UFB, damn you Dunedin!)

The difference in physical specs between the Mikrotik RB951G-2HnD and the MikroTik CRS125-24G-1S-RM is almost nothing apart from being a smart switch too but for me the ability to enable and disable Ethernet ports in the house without physically unplugging them or limiting the bandwidth of a port, putting them on another VLAN etc is pretty neat.

You don't have to pay much money to get a router that can route 1gbit - for you the RB951G-2HnD or the Ubiquiti Edgerouter (from here) combined with a UniFi AC would give you a pretty kick-ass and scalable network. You've also got the Ubiquiti Security Gateway which seems to be based off the Edgerouter (so one would assume the packet switching would be pretty quick) however since it has a built in UniFi controller it is worth a look too. Might need to check with Ubiquiti if it supports VLAN tagging on the WAN ports though :)

Also for laughs, check out Uniquiti's promotional video:

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