Red Peak to be added as a 5th option on the referendum

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#1393157 23-Sep-2015 22:49

I'm happy with the current flag.

So, like others here, I will be voting for the truly hideous Koru design that looks like a stylised monkey's backside, on the basis that it's the one least likely to be agreed to in the second referendum.

I did however like John Oliver's take on the whole thing.

old3eyes

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#1393220 24-Sep-2015 08:30

I'm all in favor of changing the current British looking flag but if red peak gets chosen in the first referendum I'll vote to keep the current one in the second. A silver fern is the only thing that is recognizable as NZ..

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#1393232 24-Sep-2015 09:04

old3eyes: A silver fern is the only thing that is recognizable as NZ.

Actually I think a Kiwi is. It's the patch worn by the armed forces overseas, to differentiate us, despite having the flag on us anyway...

kiwitrc

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#1393233 24-Sep-2015 09:06

Wheres bloody OSH! That middle guy is going to get a sunburnt head.

trig42

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#1393238 24-Sep-2015 09:16

kiwitrc: Wheres bloody OSH! That middle guy is going to get a sunburnt head.

When I first looked, I thought middle guy was a girl. Might be.

Anyway, I don't mind the 'Red Peak' design (although Red Peak isn't what it's designer called it is it?), especially after reading the 'meaning' behind the colours and design he chose.

In my view, a flag should be able to be drawn by kids at primary school (I remember drawing the NZ flag at Primary school). I suppose kids could draw some approximation of a fern or Koru, but they could all probably draw Red Peak.

I will probably vote for RP as my preferred out of the now 5 offered, but vote to keep the current in the next round. I think a new flag should be left until NZ becomes a republic.

If the RSA gets its way and has the current flag added to the 5 options, a second referendum may not be needed (if the current is the clear winner that is), but it would be interesting to see if the current flag beat the total for all the other 5 combined.

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#1393239 24-Sep-2015 09:17

I'd still like to know what it was that made the flag committee choose the ones they did...and why the Red peak brigade have managed to hijack the process.

Personally, I will vote for what i like on the day, and like the idea of changing our flag...but it certainly won't be for a logo from an engineering firm in Colorado.

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#1393241 24-Sep-2015 09:19

My thoughts are:
(1) I don't particularly like the current flag and would be really happy to change it, but I don't hate it enough to change to a flag that I like even less, just for the sake of change.
(2) There are three graphic elements I don't want to see on a new flag - (A) a kiwi, (B) the silver fern and (C) the Union Jack. I accept that many people do want one or more of these things, I just don't.

So while I'm not necessarily a big fan of the Red Peak, I like it better than any of the other four finalists. Three of the designs out for me because (2)(B). It bugs me that the panel didn't try to find four more distinct options for people to consider. The Kyle Lockwood designs are so similar it's pointless including both. I don't mind a koru on the flag, but the Andrew Fyfe design didn't particularly appeal - there was a design in the style of the Gordon Walters paintings that I liked more. So in the first referendum I'll vote Red Peak if it's an option, and Koru if it's not. In the second referendum I'll probably vote to keep the current flag because I just don't like the choices enough to change, despite (2)(C).

DizzyD

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#1393244 24-Sep-2015 09:33

trig42: I think a new flag should be left until NZ becomes a republic.

This is what I have been saying all along.

Until New Zealand is a republic, and not bound by the crown and/or the treaty between Maori/crown. Whats the point of a new flag?

I'm happy at removing the Union Jack from the flag once it has no more relevance to modern day NZ. Most countries change their flags after some sort of reform, not for the fun of it. When NZ breaks ties completely with the monarchy and moves forward as the republic of NZ, that will be a good time for a new flag.

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#1393414 24-Sep-2015 12:12

The motion has been passed. (no pun intended)

old3eyes

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#1393433 24-Sep-2015 12:22

DizzyD:
trig42: I think a new flag should be left until NZ becomes a republic.

This is what I have been saying all along.

Until New Zealand is a republic, and not bound by the crown and/or the treaty between Maori/crown. Whats the point of a new flag?

I'm happy at removing the Union Jack from the flag once it has no more relevance to modern day NZ. Most countries change their flags after some sort of reform, not for the fun of it. When NZ breaks ties completely with the monarchy and moves forward as the republic of NZ, that will be a good time for a new flag.

True. But i can't see us becoming a republic any time soon even if Queen Elizabeth was to die next week. There are too many "All British" running the country plus the likes of the RSA would have heart attacks everywhere....

Regards,

Old3eyes

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#1393434 24-Sep-2015 12:23

trig42:

In my view, a flag should be able to be drawn by kids at primary school (I remember drawing the NZ flag at Primary school). I suppose kids could draw some approximation of a fern or Koru, but they could all probably draw Red Peak.

Tried drawing a Union Jack correctly recently?
It's bloody hard getting those smaller red bits in the right location.

Complaining red peak looks like that US North Carolina engineering firm seems stupid, when our flag looks equally as similar as the Australian flag.

I still fundamentally struggle with the proposition that NZ can be 'summed up' with either a fern or koru, which is a fern anyway and I prefer to think of it as a wave/beach symbol, or some stars anyone in the southern hemisphere can see.

Might as well put a kiwi on there, as that's the only one native/limited to NZ. Likewise a 'roo on the Aussie flag.
Canada changed theirs, but stayed in the common wealth, in 1964.

We should cut to the chase, in that people don't want the union jack, but don't want to leave the commonwealth either. And the flag debate is conveniently underway whilst other major trade agreement deals are being done, and JK's on his last term and a flag would be a pretty cool legacy story for the grandkids. I don't do conspiracy stuff really, but one does wonder if the push for a flag was really there in the first place. Given the money tied up in this process, -now that we have some options, surely this could all be handled in a single ballot vote. ie do you want to change?, if yes which one of these shtbox designs do you fancy?

This was interesting (no idea of the date on this):

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#1393439 24-Sep-2015 12:37

DizzyD:
trig42: I think a new flag should be left until NZ becomes a republic.

This is what I have been saying all along.

Until New Zealand is a republic, and not bound by the crown and/or the treaty between Maori/crown. Whats the point of a new flag?

I'm happy at removing the Union Jack from the flag once it has no more relevance to modern day NZ. Most countries change their flags after some sort of reform, not for the fun of it. When NZ breaks ties completely with the monarchy and moves forward as the republic of NZ, that will be a good time for a new flag.

The flag has nothing to do with our system of Government

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

dafman

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#1393446 24-Sep-2015 12:46

Now, doesn't this look a whole lot better ...

JWR

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#1393455 24-Sep-2015 12:56

Jaxson:
trig42:

In my view, a flag should be able to be drawn by kids at primary school (I remember drawing the NZ flag at Primary school). I suppose kids could draw some approximation of a fern or Koru, but they could all probably draw Red Peak.

Tried drawing a Union Jack correctly recently?
It's bloody hard getting those smaller red bits in the right location.

Complaining red peak looks like that US North Carolina engineering firm seems stupid, when our flag looks equally as similar as the Australian flag.

I still fundamentally struggle with the proposition that NZ can be 'summed up' with either a fern or koru, which is a fern anyway and I prefer to think of it as a wave/beach symbol, or some stars anyone in the southern hemisphere can see.

Might as well put a kiwi on there, as that's the only one native/limited to NZ. Likewise a 'roo on the Aussie flag.
Canada changed theirs, but stayed in the common wealth, in 1964.

We should cut to the chase, in that people don't want the union jack, but don't want to leave the commonwealth either. And the flag debate is conveniently underway whilst other major trade agreement deals are being done, and JK's on his last term and a flag would be a pretty cool legacy story for the grandkids. I don't do conspiracy stuff really, but one does wonder if the push for a flag was really there in the first place. Given the money tied up in this process, -now that we have some options, surely this could all be handled in a single ballot vote. ie do you want to change?, if yes which one of these shtbox designs do you fancy?

This was interesting (no idea of the date on this):

A few things I gained from looking at that comparison.

The Canadian flag is by far the best.

Most of the flags (new and old) are terrible.

Our new flag options are mostly good compared to those flags.

However, I think that it is the wrong time to change the flag and for the wrong reasons.

I don't like our current flag and if we were becoming a republic, then I would definitely want a new one.

But, I just don't see it as very likely that New Zealand will opt for a new flag at this time.

I am feeling like I will make a protest vote to discourage future vanity projects like this one.

Kyanar

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#1393456 24-Sep-2015 12:56

dafman: Now, doesn't this look a whole lot better ...

Honest truth? No. It doesn't. Kind of cringeworthy, actually.

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