Occupy Together!!

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#574196 27-Jan-2012 18:09

I hung out at the ChCh Occupy campsite for The Dresden Dolls free "ninja gig" (which was awesome by the way.)

It appears there's not much left but some hangers-on, some homeless people and the hard-core supporters.

Two of the occupiers that were near me were smoking weed and talking about tripping on acid the other night. Really feral looking too and so spaced out he wasn't making a whole lot of sense.

One spokesperson who got up to talk before the gig didn't have much to say, except for how long he'd "been there" - which evidently been only half the time really, because he was back living at home because staying there was putting his marriage at risk. When asked how to "get involved" it was suggested that one could come down with supplies, or play music... you know, real world-changing stuff.

The next spokesperson that got up wasn't much better. Generic "we can make a difference" stuff but not specifics about what they want changed, or how. She too was a part-timer, who went back home a lot.

I felt embarrassed for them actually. Incoherent, awkward and very vague speeches.

...just my impression of what I saw. But it seems to be a bunch of leftovers.

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KissySellOut

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#574197 27-Jan-2012 18:11

@KiwiNZ Well yeah sure, but once you sift out the extreme anarchists, communists and green party supporters I don't think that leaves many potential candidates or supporters. It's a bit of a contradiction in terms. Right wing parties already exist with similar agendas but hardly get any votes or even listened to or noticed by most. Not sure about here though but from what I've heard it's more or less the same... maybe a worldwide occupy party would be sweet (if tiny). It would probably get my vote.

Skolink

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#574253 27-Jan-2012 23:04

KiwiNZ: I was serious with my post regarding the 'occupy' movement forming a political party. They will be more likely to be listen to and it's easier to change the system from within the system.

Speaking of changing the system from within the system, maybe it would be more effective to 'occupy' (join) one of the already popular political parties. It may however be impossible to influence the direction of the party without the right connections already.

lyonrouge

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#574333 28-Jan-2012 10:14

KissySellOut:
lyonrouge: @kissysellout, is English your second language or are my posts ambiguous? I think we are not so far appart on views but separated by a common language?

Dude.... I'm from the UK, go figure (there is one common language there and not surprisingly it is English). Your posts really aren't all that ambiguous, not at all in fact. How did you figure that exactly..? Actually Lyon, I'd say it's the opposite, our language might be the same but our views are pretty different on this subject at least. Have been from the start. If it came down to it and some anarchist (for example) is either going to be locked up without good cause for who knows how long or go to court and do things reasonably, some how I think I'd go with court and so would this hypothetical anarchist. This hasn't been about the legal system anyway - it is about the banks and similar institutions, even the government itself for some. Also yes, I am in New Zealand, why? Do you want to go for a coffee? ;)

KissySellOut

I believe our objectives are the same, it's the method I think that differs.

"it is about the banks and similar institutions, even the government itself for some"

I have nothing against banks as such, they perform a useful function, however "financial institutions" in the broader sense have behaved irresponsibly, through investor greed, propped up by RDGS, which I proposed an action plan for earlier in this thread.

Central Government appears sound (I'm a centerest pragmatist, I vote neither left nor right) however, local government, possibly due to lesser media scrutiny appears to have issues, but I'm unable to quanitify this and hence have cannot provide an action plan other than "continuing to monitor".

My question regarding if you were in NZ was in relation to you asking if people had been arrested, which happened early that day and I thought you were in a location where NZ news was not readily available, but I do like coffee and a chance to meet visitors from outside NZ.

KissySellOut

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#574336 28-Jan-2012 10:25

@lyonrouge Awesome. I am down just outside Lower Hutt just now with no TV or media other than the internet so I wasn't sure, somebody told me that via email. Why were they arrested? Were they violating any laws or just the court order? I guess I'm lucky I wasn't there at the time... I'll be back in in Auckland soon though. Is there any one camping at Victoria Square?

lyonrouge

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#574350 28-Jan-2012 11:19

there's was a group in Victoria Park, but I believe they are Maori Sovereignty protesters, preparing for Waitangi Day I expect.

kingjj

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#574420 28-Jan-2012 15:13

@KissySellOut they were mainly arrested for breach of the peace, and subsequently released without charge. Check out stuff.co.nz, nzherald.co.nz, scoop.co.nz, radionz.co.nz/news for a good cross section of news.

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KissySellOut

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#574447 28-Jan-2012 18:01

Thanks... I'd been to a couple of those sites before but they all say pretty different things (such as there were 3, 4, 20 or over 30 arrests, very inconsistent). So how many people were actually put in the cells..? Just 3 or so? Victoria Park... I don't know, haven't been at Occupy for a couple of weeks now but I think there's mixed agendas if everyone who said they were going there did. I think most would certainly be supporting both movements.
I just read about how many were turned down for the Hobbit audition... lucky I got in! The police made about 3/4 of the people leave but I'm not sure why, it was a really calm crowd. Maybe there was too much traffic.

kingjj

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#574453 28-Jan-2012 19:13

Two were arrested and released during first eviction, four were arrested during the second.

SepticSceptic

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#575307 31-Jan-2012 13:46

After the debacle at Oakland and burning the American flag, the occupy movement has no longer any relevance to the general populace, either in the USA and abroad.

Once you start the flag burning, especially on home soil, you are going to get many people off-side, including those that had tacitly supported the movement...

ScottStevensNZ

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#575332 31-Jan-2012 14:22

KissySellOut:
lyonrouge: @kissysellout, is English your second language or are my posts ambiguous? I think we are not so far appart on views but separated by a common language?

Dude.... I'm from the UK, go figure (there is one common language there and not surprisingly it is English). Your posts really aren't all that ambiguous, not at all in fact. How did you figure that exactly..? Actually Lyon, I'd say it's the opposite, our language might be the same but our views are pretty different on this subject at least. Have been from the start. If it came down to it and some anarchist (for example) is either going to be locked up without good cause for who knows how long or go to court and do things reasonably, some how I think I'd go with court and so would this hypothetical anarchist. This hasn't been about the legal system anyway - it is about the banks and similar institutions, even the government itself for some. Also yes, I am in New Zealand, why? Do you want to go for a coffee? ;)

KissySellOut

I guess he was hoping you would have got the George Bernard Shaw reference.

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lyonrouge

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#575500 31-Jan-2012 18:47

oh dear, another less than stellar display from Occupy Wellington. I'm not only unsupportive of, but against, Maori sovereignty claims (even when so articulately conveyed as witnessed tonight).

ps. I'm a New Zealander of Maori decent.

KissySellOut

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#575568 31-Jan-2012 21:43

Uh... I just meant the few campers at Victoria Park, last I checked that wasn't many. Don't ask me anyway, it's been a couple of weeks. I don't have a problem with Maori Sovereinity itself at all - but any kind of supremacists piss me off.

lyonrouge

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#575631 1-Feb-2012 08:06

When one race wants to rule all others, I think I would consider that a supremacist attitude.
When one race wants to rule itself in an isolated enclave, that too fits a supremacist attitude.

KissySellOut

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#575742 1-Feb-2012 10:33

I think there's a difference... serious supremacists are more extreme and rasict, people who believe in keeping their race "pure" and often dislike and judge people based on their skin colour. I find that really irritting and that's what I was talking about, there's no reasoning with it at all. I'm a Scot (Danish, Welsh, Scottish and Canadian to be precise) so I'm white as they come and only once experienced actual racism directly. I don't think you can summarise by saying this group of people want to rule this one because that isn't nessecarily accurate. There's always people who disagree or keep quiet about their views anyway.
The others aren't bothered so much about skin colour, just preservation of tradition and often some disdain for people who conned and killed their ancestors... at least there's solid reasons for that thinking. They don't think they're superior (in my experience) they just want to live parallel to other races rather than conforming to other peoples beliefs, habits and systems.

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