Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.




Fat bottom Trump
9930 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4782

Subscriber

# 208234 2-Feb-2017 10:26
One person supports this post
Send private message

There has been a lot of flack about the granting of New Zealand citizenship to American billionaire Peter Thiel, who apparently has little connection to this country. The critics say he has been allowed to buy citizenship by making some big investments and donations. His supporters, such as Rod Drury and Sam Morgan, say more wealthy entrepreneurial foreigners like Bill Gates and Mark Zuckerberg should be encouraged to do the same as their investments create jobs and benefit all of us. In other words, they should get special treatment because they are special people.

 

So is this a good idea or not? Should New Zealand citizenship be for sale to those with enough money and skills, while everyone else has to wait in line and jump through hoops? Are we on the way to a new upper class to which we doff our caps and touch our forelocks?

 

Edit: Forgot the link

 

http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/323610/thiel-citzenship-'absolutely'-good-for-nz-drury

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7
I fix stuff!
1745 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 422

Trusted
Vocus
Subscriber

  # 1714357 2-Feb-2017 10:30
Send private message

Sounds like trickle down economics........


Hmm, what to write...
1010 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 522

Trusted
Subscriber

  # 1714358 2-Feb-2017 10:33
2 people support this post
Send private message

why not? as long as they meet the fit and proper person tests as well

 

 

 

All people are not equal, we want the ones that have something we want. In this case Money





Matthew


 
 
 
 


1485 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 343

Trusted

  # 1714360 2-Feb-2017 10:42
One person supports this post
Send private message

We already effectively sell permanent residency, and the pathway to citizenship is just residency and then live in NZ majority of the year for five years.   Citizenship has almost no real world benefits to PR, except for someone like Thiel to buy NZ land and businesses easier.  The thing leaves a bit of a sour taste, secrecy and having a private ceremony in US as can't be bothered to come to NZ and be ordained with the common people.  And if he is such a proud new Kiwi, why keep a secret for five years?

 

 


277 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 57


  # 1714364 2-Feb-2017 11:01
One person supports this post
Send private message

Most countries have an economic/investor migrant category where people can acquire residency and citizenship based on the amount of money they are prepared to invest in a particular country.  That is not the only criteria they must meet of course but it is the main one.  New Zealand is no exception. Equally someones lack of wealth need not be a barrier to them getting residency and citizenship. For example people can come here for family reunification purposes.  Clearly we should many categories to grant people residency and citizenship depending on their circumstances.  I don't see any particular issue with granting some rich people citizenship. In the case of Peter Thiel, his politics, as deplorable as they are too me at least, seem to be the main reason for his case attracting attention.  Had George Clooney been granted citizenship I doubt we would be hearing as much negative comment.





Tinshed
Wellington, New Zealand


2824 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 754


  # 1714366 2-Feb-2017 11:04
Send private message

jonb:

 

We already effectively sell permanent residency, and the pathway to citizenship is just residency and then live in NZ majority of the year for five years.   Citizenship has almost no real world benefits to PR, except for someone like Thiel to buy NZ land and businesses easier.  The thing leaves a bit of a sour taste, secrecy and having a private ceremony in US as can't be bothered to come to NZ and be ordained with the common people.  And if he is such a proud new Kiwi, why keep a secret for five years?

 

 

 

 

 

 

what has happened in the past week or so is probably why he kept it secret and there are lots of people who get citizenship and you never hear about it . 





Common sense is not as common as you think.




Fat bottom Trump
9930 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4782

Subscriber

  # 1714374 2-Feb-2017 11:17
4 people support this post
Send private message

I think one of the main issues with Thiel's citizenship is he doesn't live here and never has, but has only visited a few times, just like many tourists. Different rules for the rich.

 

 

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


1485 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 343

Trusted

  # 1714383 2-Feb-2017 11:29
One person supports this post
Send private message

vexxxboy:

 

jonb:

 

We already effectively sell permanent residency, and the pathway to citizenship is just residency and then live in NZ majority of the year for five years.   Citizenship has almost no real world benefits to PR, except for someone like Thiel to buy NZ land and businesses easier.  The thing leaves a bit of a sour taste, secrecy and having a private ceremony in US as can't be bothered to come to NZ and be ordained with the common people.  And if he is such a proud new Kiwi, why keep a secret for five years?

 

 

 

 

 

 

what has happened in the past week or so is probably why he kept it secret and there are lots of people who get citizenship and you never hear about it . 

 

 

Lots of people get citizenship after actually living in New Zealand. Exceptionally few have got citizenship without, which is why it is a story.  If we are going to grant citizenship to wealthy and powerful non residents, then change the rules to make it transparent.  


4132 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1393


  # 1714384 2-Feb-2017 11:34
2 people support this post
Send private message

 

 

He is a far better person than many of the people already living in NZ, so all good. 

 

 


13903 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6649

Trusted
Subscriber

  # 1714390 2-Feb-2017 11:38
2 people support this post
Send private message

Rikkitic:

 

I think one of the main issues with Thiel's citizenship is he doesn't live here and never has, but has only visited a few times, just like many tourists. Different rules for the rich.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No there is not different rules.There are different criteria and The Department has rules that anyone can read and rules that are in line with Government Policy and legislation. You can easily read them if you wish.

 

As for this decision, if it meets the legislative and policy requirements I see no issue, we are under populated and folks meeting the requirements that bring their wealth here should be supported.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

Using empathy takes no energy and can gain so much. Try it.

 

 


20054 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6109

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  # 1714393 2-Feb-2017 11:45
Send private message

Rikkitic:

 

I think one of the main issues with Thiel's citizenship is he doesn't live here and never has, but has only visited a few times, just like many tourists. Different rules for the rich.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'd like you to cite which different rules were applied to him than anyone else. Specifically. 

 

Can you show which rules he has breached in any way?

 

 


12739 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4245

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  # 1714400 2-Feb-2017 11:53
Send private message

Of course. No problem and anyone who applies for citizenship this way still has to pass the usual background checks, health checks and so on.

 

The only difference is that they do not need to prove that they have a job or useful skills - which, given that they already have a heap of money is hardly necessary.

 

Why would you not want to bring entrepreneurial people and wealthy people to NZ? We have to get the income of the nation up somehow and whatever we've been doing for the last 150 years has hardly achieved a lot in that respect. We still have far too much of the tax burden falling on too few people.






20054 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6109

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  # 1714403 2-Feb-2017 11:55
Send private message

Geektastic:

 

Of course. No problem and anyone who applies for citizenship this way still has to pass the usual background checks, health checks and so on.

 

The only difference is that they do not need to prove that they have a job or useful skills - which, given that they already have a heap of money is hardly necessary.

 

Why would you not want to bring entrepreneurial people and wealthy people to NZ? We have to get the income of the nation up somehow and whatever we've been doing for the last 150 years has hardly achieved a lot in that respect. We still have far too much of the tax burden falling on too few people.

 

 

 

 

The question for me, is WILL he provide any value. Time will tell, but I'll be pretty surprised if he spends significant funds here other than buying land, so I expect his tax contribution to be minimal. 


12739 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4245

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  # 1714404 2-Feb-2017 11:56
One person supports this post
Send private message

Rikkitic:

 

I think one of the main issues with Thiel's citizenship is he doesn't live here and never has, but has only visited a few times, just like many tourists. Different rules for the rich.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Being rich has benefits: that is why most people try and achieve it...!






12739 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4245

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  # 1714406 2-Feb-2017 11:57
Send private message

networkn:

 

Geektastic:

 

Of course. No problem and anyone who applies for citizenship this way still has to pass the usual background checks, health checks and so on.

 

The only difference is that they do not need to prove that they have a job or useful skills - which, given that they already have a heap of money is hardly necessary.

 

Why would you not want to bring entrepreneurial people and wealthy people to NZ? We have to get the income of the nation up somehow and whatever we've been doing for the last 150 years has hardly achieved a lot in that respect. We still have far too much of the tax burden falling on too few people.

 

 

 

 

The question for me, is WILL he provide any value. Time will tell, but I'll be pretty surprised if he spends significant funds here other than buying land, so I expect his tax contribution to be minimal. 

 

 

 

 

I don't care if he does (although I think he will simply by association) - the question for me is will he be detrimental to NZ and that is likely to be a big fat no IMV.








Fat bottom Trump
9930 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4782

Subscriber

  # 1714416 2-Feb-2017 12:04
Send private message

networkn:

 

 

 

I'd like you to cite which different rules were applied to him than anyone else. Specifically. 

 

Can you show which rules he has breached in any way?

 

 

I'm not sure any rules were applied to him. I think he just threw a ton of money around, got some other rich people to write letters of support, and received his citizenship.

 

I doubt he breached any rules, since none were applied to him. Anyway, that is not my question. My question is whether people think this is a good thing or not. For my part, I'm not sure. It offends my sense of fair play but I also see the positives. I'm not sure where the line should be drawn, so I am asking what others think. Even you.

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

WLG-X festival to celebrate creativity and innovation
Posted 22-May-2019 17:53


HPE to acquire supercomputing leader Cray
Posted 20-May-2019 11:07


Techweek starting around NZ today
Posted 20-May-2019 09:52


Porirua City Council first to adopt new council software solution Datascape
Posted 15-May-2019 12:00


New survey provides insight into schools' technology challenges and plans
Posted 15-May-2019 09:30


Apple Music now available on Alexa devices in Australia and New Zealand
Posted 15-May-2019 09:11


Make a stand against cyberbullying this Pink Shirt Day
Posted 14-May-2019 20:23


Samsung first TV manufacturer to launch the Apple TV App and Airplay 2
Posted 14-May-2019 20:11


Vodafone New Zealand sold
Posted 14-May-2019 07:25


Kordia boosts cloud performance with locally-hosted Microsoft Azure ExpressRoute
Posted 8-May-2019 10:25


Microsoft Azure ExpressRoute in New Zealand opens up faster, more secure internet for Kiwi businesses
Posted 8-May-2019 09:39


Vocus Communications to deliver Microsoft Azure Cloud Solutions through Azure ExpressRoute
Posted 8-May-2019 09:25


Independent NZ feature film #statusPending to premiere during WLG-X
Posted 6-May-2019 22:13


The ultimate dog photoshoot with Nokia 9 PureView #ForgottenDogsofInstagram
Posted 6-May-2019 09:41


Nokia 9 PureView available in New Zealand
Posted 6-May-2019 09:06



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.


Support Geekzone »

Our community of supporters help make Geekzone possible. Click the button below to join them.

Support Geezone on PressPatron



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.