Netflix to crack down on unblockers

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#1476666 22-Jan-2016 11:11

What about customers in NZ using an unblocking service with their region set to NZ? I switched to NZ last week to see the catalogue and started watching Making a Murderer. I haven't switched 'back' to another region yet, so does Netflix see me as a 'geo-pirate' or is it ok if I am viewing my 'home' catalogue?

Rikkitic

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#1476691 22-Jan-2016 11:43

Why can't local distributors maintain two or more catalogs side by side? There would be the Netflix NZ catalog, but also the US one for an extra fee. I don't see why it always has to be an all or nothing deal. Also, I don't see why the overseas catalog would necessarily have to be sold by any particular distributor. Maybe it could be offered to the highest bidder, with the only restriction being that the bidder has to be operating within the boundaries of the country it is bidding from. So Netflix, along with other distributors, would bid on the overseas catalog rights and Sky might end up with them while Netflix continues to operate the NZ catalog. Other overseas content producers, like BBC, could do the same, with the local distributor acting as an agent.

For me, and I think for a lot of people, the issue is not getting content for free, but getting freedom of choice. The things I want to watch just are not available here, at any price. Yet I know they are available elsewhere. This is what motivates geo-unblocking in the first place.

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MikeB4

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#1476697 22-Jan-2016 11:56

What I would like to see in light of free trade agreements and globalisation is one catalogue and no geoblocking but that is up to the owners to agree on and the Networks to pay the appropriate fee. Those two bodies should

be free to negotiate this.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

Paul1977

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#1476699 22-Jan-2016 11:57

Rikkitic:

Why can't local distributors maintain two or more catalogs side by side? There would be the Netflix NZ catalog, but also the US one for an extra fee. I don't see why it always has to be an all or nothing deal. Also, I don't see why the overseas catalog would necessarily have to be sold by any particular distributor. Maybe it could be offered to the highest bidder, with the only restriction being that the bidder has to be operating within the boundaries of the country it is bidding from. So Netflix, along with other distributors, would bid on the overseas catalog rights and Sky might end up with them while Netflix continues to operate the NZ catalog. Other overseas content producers, like BBC, could do the same, with the local distributor acting as an agent.

For me, and I think for a lot of people, the issue is not getting content for free, but getting freedom of choice. The things I want to watch just are not available here, at any price. Yet I know they are available elsewhere. This is what motivates geo-unblocking in the first place.

The catalogs aren't bought or sold as a single commodity. Netflix US catalog is made up of everything that Netflix has purchased individually for that region. That's my understanding anyway.

Paul1977

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#1476702 22-Jan-2016 12:04

MikeB4:

What I would like to see in light of free trade agreements and globalisation is one catalogue and no geoblocking but that is up to the owners to agree on and the Networks to pay the appropriate fee. Those two bodies should

be free to negotiate this.

That would be the ideal for many (including myself), but how would the extra costs of a global license be passed onto the consumer? Customers in the USA would say a price increase is unfair as they are already getting pretty much everything already. Then many non-US customers might say they don't want to be forced to pay more, even if it does mean more content - for some the current local catalog might be all they need.

MikeB4

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#1476705 22-Jan-2016 12:08

Paul1977:

MikeB4:

What I would like to see in light of free trade agreements and globalisation is one catalogue and no geoblocking but that is up to the owners to agree on and the Networks to pay the appropriate fee. Those two bodies should

be free to negotiate this.

That would be the ideal for many (including myself), but how would the extra costs of a global license be passed onto the consumer? Customers in the USA would say a price increase is unfair as they are already getting pretty much everything already. Then many non-US customers might say they don't want to be forced to pay more, even if it does mean more content - for some the current local catalog might be all they need.

That will be up the providers to determine what the best acceptable price will be in their markets. I would think it logical that those outside the US would pay more for a greater selection without having

to pay the monthly fee to a unblocking service.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

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NonprayingMantis

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#1476708 22-Jan-2016 12:08

Paul1977:

Rikkitic:

Why can't local distributors maintain two or more catalogs side by side? There would be the Netflix NZ catalog, but also the US one for an extra fee. I don't see why it always has to be an all or nothing deal. Also, I don't see why the overseas catalog would necessarily have to be sold by any particular distributor. Maybe it could be offered to the highest bidder, with the only restriction being that the bidder has to be operating within the boundaries of the country it is bidding from. So Netflix, along with other distributors, would bid on the overseas catalog rights and Sky might end up with them while Netflix continues to operate the NZ catalog. Other overseas content producers, like BBC, could do the same, with the local distributor acting as an agent.

For me, and I think for a lot of people, the issue is not getting content for free, but getting freedom of choice. The things I want to watch just are not available here, at any price. Yet I know they are available elsewhere. This is what motivates geo-unblocking in the first place.

The catalogs aren't bought or sold as a single commodity. Netflix US catalog is made up of everything that Netflix has purchased individually for that region. That's my understanding anyway.

it's a bit of both.

Netflix will go to, say, Sony Pictures, and Sony will offer a particular catalogue of their content which will include a bunch of good stuff and heaps of crud, and it will cost s flat fee (e.g. $100m/year) last for a certain period (e.g. 3 years). Netflix will have to buy it all, or take nothing.

It may or may not include anything new that Sony releases during that period, or they might need to pay extra for that.

They then go around other studios and the cycle happens again.

So generally speaking Netflix can't cherry pick individual shows they like, they have to buy them as a bundle (which is one reason why there is so much absolute garbage on Netflix as well as the good stuff).

Each studio is different though. and TV is very different from Movies.

jmh

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#1476727 22-Jan-2016 12:10

Rikkitic:

For me, and I think for a lot of people, the issue is not getting content for free, but getting freedom of choice. The things I want to watch just are not available here, at any price. Yet I know they are available elsewhere. This is what motivates geo-unblocking in the first place.

Same for me. I'm happy to pay for what I use so long as I don't have to sit through wall-to-wall advertising.

Paul1977

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#1476740 22-Jan-2016 12:18

MikeB4:

Paul1977:

MikeB4:

What I would like to see in light of free trade agreements and globalisation is one catalogue and no geoblocking but that is up to the owners to agree on and the Networks to pay the appropriate fee. Those two bodies should

be free to negotiate this.

That would be the ideal for many (including myself), but how would the extra costs of a global license be passed onto the consumer? Customers in the USA would say a price increase is unfair as they are already getting pretty much everything already. Then many non-US customers might say they don't want to be forced to pay more, even if it does mean more content - for some the current local catalog might be all they need.

That will be up the providers to determine what the best acceptable price will be in their markets. I would think it logical that those outside the US would pay more for a greater selection without having

to pay the monthly fee to a unblocking service.

I agree that it makes sense for those outside the USA to pay more for the extra content. I'm just not sure that everyone would like it forced on them, there will be a lot of Netflix NZ users who have no idea what geounblocking is and are quite happy with the selection they currently get for $12.99.

It reminds be of when 2Degrees bought Snap and increased the VoIP price from $10 to $15 and justified it by give free national calling (which heaps of people didn't want or need).

People are funny. If Netflix had debuted in NZ with a global catalog for $25, people probably would have jumped on it. But after having it for a while at $12.99, I bet even increasing it to just $20 (but with more content) will annoy people.

Obviously a far more complicated licensing model; but I think the consumer would rather have the option of paying more for a larger catalog, but not have to if they don't want.

On the other hand I could be completely wrong about that.

ockel

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#1476741 22-Jan-2016 12:19

NonprayingMantis:

Paul1977:

Rikkitic:

Why can't local distributors maintain two or more catalogs side by side? There would be the Netflix NZ catalog, but also the US one for an extra fee. I don't see why it always has to be an all or nothing deal. Also, I don't see why the overseas catalog would necessarily have to be sold by any particular distributor. Maybe it could be offered to the highest bidder, with the only restriction being that the bidder has to be operating within the boundaries of the country it is bidding from. So Netflix, along with other distributors, would bid on the overseas catalog rights and Sky might end up with them while Netflix continues to operate the NZ catalog. Other overseas content producers, like BBC, could do the same, with the local distributor acting as an agent.

For me, and I think for a lot of people, the issue is not getting content for free, but getting freedom of choice. The things I want to watch just are not available here, at any price. Yet I know they are available elsewhere. This is what motivates geo-unblocking in the first place.

The catalogs aren't bought or sold as a single commodity. Netflix US catalog is made up of everything that Netflix has purchased individually for that region. That's my understanding anyway.

it's a bit of both.

Netflix will go to, say, Sony Pictures, and Sony will offer a particular catalogue of their content which will include a bunch of good stuff and heaps of crud, and it will last for a certian period (e.g. 3 years). Netflix will have to buy it all, or take nothing. It may or may not include anything new that Sony releases during that period, or they might need to pay extra for that.

They then go around other studios and the cycle happens again.

So generally speaking Netflix can't cherry pick individual shows they like, they have to buy them as a bundle.

Each studio is different though. and TV is very different from Movies.

Netflix have said that Disney was the last big output deal that they'll do. Henceforth it will be buying individual shows on their merits.

Its similar in NZ. Big output deals like TVNZ has with ABC/Disney may be a thing of the past. Mediaworks relinquished its FOX output deal which is why some new Fox shows have come back to TVNZ. Like The Simpsons. As the rights come up for offer the networks can pick and choose. Likewise BBC stuff. Why TopGear moved around.

Now it is very much an individual show basis but the pricing in some markets may not suit the buyer depending on either the demographic, the economics (cost-per-thousand viewers etc) or other factors. It may be down to something like legacy output deals. Some good examples: Shadow Hunters. Netflix has global rights excluding the US. Daredevil (which would have been an ABC-Disney and landed with TVNZ c/legacy) is a Netflix global. Willing to pay the exclusivity price to get it. Better Call Saul - Lightbox buys it exclusively to help assemble its catalogue.

The analog corollary would be the humble video store that decided which titles it did and didnt want to stock. And those titles that it wanted exclusively for its chain. You build a catalog - you dont buy it unless you're the second owner and the first owner sold it or went bust.

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gzt

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#1476749 22-Jan-2016 12:27

Netflix would be pretty happy with a global licensing model because then Netflix would then set regional prices to their hearts content and profit.

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ockel

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#1476773 22-Jan-2016 12:41

gzt: Netflix would be pretty happy with a global licensing model because then Netflix would then set regional prices to their hearts content and profit.

But a willing buyer needs a willing seller.

Besides why buy global and sell global when you can buy local and sell global - even more profit. (but shhhh dont tell anyone).

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tdgeek

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#1476781 22-Jan-2016 12:49

Rikkitic:

Why can't local distributors maintain two or more catalogs side by side? There would be the Netflix NZ catalog, but also the US one for an extra fee. I don't see why it always has to be an all or nothing deal. Also, I don't see why the overseas catalog would necessarily have to be sold by any particular distributor. Maybe it could be offered to the highest bidder, with the only restriction being that the bidder has to be operating within the boundaries of the country it is bidding from. So Netflix, along with other distributors, would bid on the overseas catalog rights and Sky might end up with them while Netflix continues to operate the NZ catalog. Other overseas content producers, like BBC, could do the same, with the local distributor acting as an agent.

For me, and I think for a lot of people, the issue is not getting content for free, but getting freedom of choice. The things I want to watch just are not available here, at any price. Yet I know they are available elsewhere. This is what motivates geo-unblocking in the first place.

That is the key.

Take Netflix's own content. They can sell it here under Netflix NZ, or sell it to a distributor here. It's here, thats all that matters

Other content would be bought. Maybe by Netflix NZ, Lightbox, Neon. It would be here.

Depending on your tastes, you might have one or more of the services, but all the content that is available globally, is avaliable here

Would this keep everyone happy? All the contect is here and geoblock bypassing is not needed

dclegg

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#1476788 22-Jan-2016 12:59

tdgeek:

Would this keep everyone happy? All the contect is here and geoblock bypassing is not needed

It all depends on whether it is offered at a reasonable price, or if price gouging tactics are used.

A perfect example of this is Game of Thrones. If you want to watch it in HD, in a timely manner, you need to have a Sky Basic package ($49.22), SOHO ($9.99), HD access ticket ($9.99). A grand total of $69.20. And that's not factoring in the cost for the MySky HDi box (which I believe may be required for HD content). Considering we're not actually interested in any other Sky content, that's a very poor deal for us.

You can watch in on Neon, but for some inexplicable reason that is only in SD. Or you can wait a year and get the Blu-Ray. But you better stay away from the Internet for 12 months, unless you don't mind spoilers.

Instead we pay USD $15 per month to watch it via HBO Now.

Wade

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#1476792 22-Jan-2016 13:04

As a consumer, how much extra per month would you deem acceptable to pay for a global NF library? I think we all agree it could happen but I doubt content owners will not be prepared to take a cut in revenue so would become a lot more costly for NF which would have to be passed onto the consumer one way or another

The argument regarding people in the US shouldn't have to pay a premium is irrelevant as there is plenty of content available in other regions that is not available in US so they stand to gain as well

I consider that if i could move the cost of Unotelly across to NF as a premium it would be status quo cost-wise, but would a 30% increase in cost be acceptable to the masses or more importantly cover the global cost for content? I'm guessing probably not

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