2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2437245 13-Mar-2020 05:08

mattwnz:

I just think the whole way this has occurred is very odd, how can someone eating a bat, cause this whole domino effect occurring?

This has been predicted for decades.
The only slight difference is many predictions were for another influenza pandemic - not coronavirus - but same effect.

Bill Gates, through the Bill & Melinda Gates foundation, has been waving his arms and yelling about this for the last couple of years.
A few weeks ago - as it spread unchecked in many places - he published this article in the New England Journal of Medicine - saying 'I told you so' and pointing out how lucky we are that it's not even more deadly..

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#2437246 13-Mar-2020 05:23

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/world/italy-announces-all-shops-except-pharmacies-and-food-outlets-will-be-closed-as-coronavirus-death-toll-climbs-by-31percent-to-827-in-24-hours-and-intensive-care-units-are-advised-to-stop-treating-the-elderly/ar-BB115dP0?li=BBqdg4K

Looks like how valuable a life is in Italy to be how many days some ones has to live their rest of life if this Doctors opinion carries.

Can understand if person expected not to survive. They’re looking at throwing people out of intensive care, that could be being treated for non virus related case, leaving them to die, so a younger person can be treated. It’s one Doctors opinion so may not be the policy there.

Also saw a headline EU condemns Trump’s travel ban. What is it with countries getting upset when another Country puts a travel ban on them, surely it’s a legitimate way to reduce likelihood of importing Virus?

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#2437248 13-Mar-2020 06:15

rugrat:

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/world/italy-announces-all-shops-except-pharmacies-and-food-outlets-will-be-closed-as-coronavirus-death-toll-climbs-by-31percent-to-827-in-24-hours-and-intensive-care-units-are-advised-to-stop-treating-the-elderly/ar-BB115dP0?li=BBqdg4K

Looks like how valuable a life is in Italy to be how many days some ones has to live their rest of life if this Doctors opinion carries.

Can understand if person expected not to survive. They’re looking at throwing people out of intensive care, that could be being treated for non virus related case, leaving them to die, so a younger person can be treated. It’s one Doctors opinion so may not be the policy there.

Emergency management of resources in NZ would be the same.
Eg. prolonged mechanical ventilation or ECMO required.. with a limited number of machines, overwhelming demand.

Contraindications might be (at a guess): Age > 75, Underlying conditions, Irreversible lung damage, Severe septic shock, Chronic organ dysfunction.. = couple of team members take a look at your case, they assess your likely outcome, talk to a Senior Medical Officer..

I'd hate to be the ones making that decision. It's the classic ethical dilemma described in the Trolley problem.

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#2437252 13-Mar-2020 06:57

Sidestep:

he published this article in the New England Journal of Medicine - saying 'I told you so' and pointing out how lucky we are that it's not even more deadly..

i read it just now, it's not an I told you so.

He's suggesting rich governments come together to fund accelerated vaccine development using machine learning and then fund production at a non profit manufacturing, ASAP.

Tinkerisk

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#2437254 13-Mar-2020 07:05

👍 Mass events restricted and schools shortly before closure in Germany.

Qui nihil scit, omnia credere debet.
Firewalls do NOT stop dragons.
In effect we have everything to hide from someone, and no idea who someone is.

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#2437255 13-Mar-2020 07:07

Batman:

Sidestep:

he published this article in the New England Journal of Medicine - saying 'I told you so' and pointing out how lucky we are that it's not even more deadly..

i read it just now, it's not an I told you so.

To quote the article: "Global health experts have been saying for years that another pandemic whose speed and severity rivaled those of the 1918 influenza epidemic was a matter not of if but of when"

The foundation Bill Gates formed, and largely financed, has been one of the most vocal warning us about the potential of a pandemic - like this one, or worse - for years.

He can bluntly say "I told you so" and it's true.

Here's another one of many recent articles - in 'Business Insider' "Bill Gates has warned about a pandemic for years."

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#2437262 13-Mar-2020 07:25

The Brazilian President's communications director, who was recently pictured with Donald Trump, has tested positive for coronavirus, while the Canadian Prime Minister has gone into self-isolation.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/2020/03/donald-trump-met-brazilian-political-aide-with-coronavirus-justin-trudeau-in-isolation-with-ill-wife.html

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#2437266 13-Mar-2020 07:42

Sidestep:

To quote the article: "Global health experts have been saying for years that another pandemic whose speed and severity rivaled those of the 1918 influenza epidemic was a matter not of if but of when"

The foundation Bill Gates formed, and largely financed, has been one of the most vocal warning us about the potential of a pandemic - like this one, or worse - for years.

He can bluntly say "I told you so" and it's true.

Here's another one of many recent articles - in 'Business Insider' "Bill Gates has warned about a pandemic for years."

while it may be true that he is a harbinger of doom, i am not sure how that has anything to do with covid-19 let alone writing an article in a reputable medical journal.

are you saying you think the world should have self isolated and closed all borders the moment bill gates predicted a pandemic?

the article is recommending a combined govt efforts to produce an accelerated vaccine and make it available to all who need, "not to the highest bidder"

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#2437277 13-Mar-2020 08:21

F1 GP in Melbourne will be postponed, as one team has an infected case and has pulled out. I can see that sport in 2020 will be pummelled, due to crowds and how international sports events are run. When you now get politicians getting infected in Europe, South America and North America, that shows how widespread it is, so cancel any sport that has anyhting to do with the Americas and Europe and Asia. Which pretty much means, most sport will grind to a halt

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#2437282 13-Mar-2020 08:28

Have we been lucky - or just well placed here in NZ as to why there hasn't been any more cases confirmed beyond the 5?

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#2437286 13-Mar-2020 08:32

tehgerbil:

Have we been lucky - or just well placed here in NZ as to why there hasn't been any more cases confirmed beyond the 5?

One of two things - we're missing out on detecting community spread (even thought lots of testing is being done) or by some miracle community spread isn't occuring yet.

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#2437287 13-Mar-2020 08:33

Sidestep:

rugrat:

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/world/italy-announces-all-shops-except-pharmacies-and-food-outlets-will-be-closed-as-coronavirus-death-toll-climbs-by-31percent-to-827-in-24-hours-and-intensive-care-units-are-advised-to-stop-treating-the-elderly/ar-BB115dP0?li=BBqdg4K

Looks like how valuable a life is in Italy to be how many days some ones has to live their rest of life if this Doctors opinion carries.

Can understand if person expected not to survive. They’re looking at throwing people out of intensive care, that could be being treated for non virus related case, leaving them to die, so a younger person can be treated. It’s one Doctors opinion so may not be the policy there.

Emergency management of resources in NZ would be the same.
Eg. prolonged mechanical ventilation or ECMO required.. with a limited number of machines, overwhelming demand.

Contraindications might be (at a guess): Age > 75, Underlying conditions, Irreversible lung damage, Severe septic shock, Chronic organ dysfunction.. = couple of team members take a look at your case, they assess your likely outcome, talk to a Senior Medical Officer..

I'd hate to be the ones making that decision. It's the classic ethical dilemma described in the Trolley problem.

Exactly & this is why we should be prudent & close our boarder completely & enforce quarantine on those currently infected. Its unfair that elderly New-Zealander's should be put in a position where they will not be able to receive treatment if infected with the virus. They deserve better than this.

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#2437296 13-Mar-2020 08:34

tehgerbil:
Have we been lucky - or just well placed here in NZ as to why there hasn't been any more cases confirmed beyond the 5?

If we really want to, shutting the border completely will work very well for us because it’s extremely difficult to breach our border, unlike many countries such as those in mainland Europe where you can just walk across undetected.

Tinkerisk

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#2437317 13-Mar-2020 09:01

👍 "Young lower risk people" are starting local groups (often just next door) of #NachbarschaftsChallenge (Germany) or #NeighborhoodChallenge (US) to offer support to the elders who will not be capable to leave their quarantine (later on) for tasks like buying food etc. - That's really great and doesn't need close contact for contamination! So it's recommended for the elders to get familiar with Twitter which could be a challenge as well ;-) ...

Qui nihil scit, omnia credere debet.
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In effect we have everything to hide from someone, and no idea who someone is.

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#2437323 13-Mar-2020 09:06

tehgerbil:

Have we been lucky - or just well placed here in NZ as to why there hasn't been any more cases confirmed beyond the 5?

Voluntary isolation seems to be effective, and seems to be people are complying (well, the Govt said that)

The number travelling in from affected countries as tourists must have plummetted, so if we got lucky early on, now the numbers are low due to bans, so much less exposure.

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