2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2452315 1-Apr-2020 14:36

Fred99:
Geektastic: I’ve seen a few reports of various places within NZ in which locals are erecting barriers and attempting to prevent anyone entering.

Ignoring for a moment the fact that people aren’t supposed to be going anywhere much anyway, by what right do those taking this action claim the ability to close public highways etc?

They've got no rights at all to close public roads, but IIRC some of the first reports of this were closing of privately owned roads that had been used by the public. The usual clickbait-prone dimwits who never read past a headline thought this was a thing. And now it's become a thing, apparently. Just not a very big thing - for example the "roadblock" in Makara isn't a roadblock - it's some locals who've put a movable barrier mainly to the side of the road with some signs telling people to bugger off.

I saw one in the East Cape where they were stopping people “crossing our borders”!

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#2452317 1-Apr-2020 14:38

Paul1977:
Here's a question:

Lets look at absolute best case that NZ manages to essentially eradicate COVID-19 from our shores, and is able to enforce appropriate border controls to keep it out until a vaccine is available.

Will (or should) the government make vaccination a legal requirement (unless there is a legitimate medical reason that an individual can't be vaccinated)?

They certainly should. Nobody should be able to risk putting us back in this position.

Rikkitic

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#2452320 1-Apr-2020 14:43

Geektastic: The roads are almost empty and yet I’ve seen reports of vehicles hitting each other....

I vividly remember a news item in Holland from the days of the carless Sundays: Dutch people were not allowed to be on the roads but foreigners were. So naturally there was a collision on one of our ultra-modern wide laned high speed superhighways between a German and a Belgian, the only two cars on the road at that time! They must have been aiming at each other for this to be possible.

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#2452323 1-Apr-2020 14:47

Jase2985:
kiwifidget:

How rude are our journalists?

Watching yet another 1pm update, and the questions just get shouted out all at once.

Whatever happened to raising your hand and waiting to be asked?

because there is 30 journalists and time for 15 questions. you have to be in to win.

It would be nice to see some sort of "draw a number from a hat on the way in" type system, then wait for your number before shouting over everyone else. (Or some sort of social-distancing equivilant)

Grunta47

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#2452326 1-Apr-2020 14:49

shk292:

But, without labouring the point too much, I think common sense can be applied.

The point I was making is that we all need to get out once a day or so, or go crazy, and I don't see why walking here: http://www.windsurf.co.nz/windsurf_cam_orewa2.asp

on a 100m or more wide beach is more dangerous than walking down a relatively busier urban street. Beaches are great because they have no hard surfaces and are automatically washed twice per day.

That's my 2c worth anyway, happy to debate because this is a forum and hopefully populated with intelligent people who can argue logically but please don't just reply with a slogan.

That's the point, too many people don't have common sense......or as has been said many a time, People are Stupid.

I agree, those who want to can go out once a day. However (my opinion only) beaches are where those without common sense will make mistakes and cause issues. More and more people will go down to the beach as we roll into week 2 and then all of a sudden its just like a normal weekend. One clown will start swimming, then the next and so on.

At least going for a walk on the streets/footpath you are more likely to have a plan to be out for x amount of time and cover x distance.....you're focused. From the photos I have seen of people on beaches a large number have gone there just to hang out.

There are a number of walking tracks around where I live, but I wont go on those as you cant keep separation if you meet someone. Likewise I could go for a mountain bike ride as on my normal route I would only pass/be passed by 5 odd people, but once again no separation possible.

4 weeks is not long for sensible people to sacrifice some of their freedom, but the stupid people were struggling after 2 days.

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#2452327 1-Apr-2020 14:56

Regarding vaccines / anti-viral drugs, I don't want to be a naysayer, but we don't want a repeat of the Thalidomide disaster.

Obviously this is a worldwide disaster. We all want a solution as soon as possible.

However it would be easy to make panicked decisions around safety.

Jumping to a wrong solution is worrisome here, potentially wasting time and redirecting efforts to the wrong place.

It's doubly worrying when you have a snake oil salesman like Trump who wants a vaccine for all the wrong reasons.

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#2452347 1-Apr-2020 15:42

Geektastic:

Paul1977: Here's a question: Lets look at absolute best case that NZ manages to essentially eradicate COVID-19 from our shores, and is able to enforce appropriate border controls to keep it out until a vaccine is available.

Will (or should) the government make vaccination a legal requirement (unless there is a legitimate medical reason that an individual can't be vaccinated)?

They certainly should. Nobody should be able to risk putting us back in this position.

That would require some tweaking of s11 of the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act 1990. I doubt any Government will want to go there.

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#2452372 1-Apr-2020 15:58

If the vaccine is really good, then you wouldn't need 100% compliance to ensure herd immunity.

Lastman

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#2452377 1-Apr-2020 16:12

MikeAqua:

freitasm:

There is no evidence of herd immunity yet which relies on people developing resistance - but at what cost? That's what vaccines exist for.

8 strains of Coronavirus last I read up on the subject. Tricky vaccine? There are only 2 or 3 strains in the regular flu-jab.

Actually this is less mutation than standard flu, I read.

freitasm

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#2452385 1-Apr-2020 16:31

Press release:

Work to scale up the health system in preparation for COVID-19 was today outlined by Health Minister David Clark, as he reported back to the new Epidemic Response Committee.

“We are well placed to contain the spread of COVID-19. We have taken early and decisive action at our borders, and that swift action has given us valuable time to refine our plan, and increase our preparedness,” said David Clark.

“Since January we have ramped up our testing capacity to 3300 tests per day. That is expected to grow, even in the face of strong international demand for the products used in the testing process.

“More than $40 million has gone towards contact tracing and we have quadrupled Healthline’s workforce since the end of January, to over than 500 staff working on COVID-19. We expect staff numbers to continue to increase.

“In Primary Care, we’ve moved quickly, and have already established 49 Community Based Assessment Centres, where people who have symptoms of COVID-19 can safely be tested. Another 61 Centres are in the works, doubling the number of sites available.

“All GP clinics have also been supplied Personal Protective Equipment, to help protect our GPs, nurses and other staff. Just last week 640,000 face masks were sent to DHBs from the National Reserve Supply and today, it was announced that the Ministry of Health was opening its national reserves of personal protective equipment to make 7 million masks available over coming weeks. The Ministry will begin an initial distribution of 1.2 million masks from the national stock to DHBs within the next 48 hours, so they are able to get masks to community health and disability workers who need them.

“Across our Public Hospitals we have access to 533 ventilators with another 247 in private hospitals and other organisations. More ventilators are on order from overseas. I also announced yesterday that we are fast tracking 36 new intensive care beds at Christchurch Hospital.

“We currently have around 2,500 trained ICU/Critical Care nurses and DHBs are already running refresher courses and training new staff to care for ventilated patients, should that be needed.

“We are fortunate to have such dedicated and professional doctors, nurses, midwives, laboratory scientists, mental health workers and allied health workers. These people provide outstanding care for New Zealanders day in, day out. And we are asking so much of them as we combat COVID-19.

“This a global pandemic. As has been clear with our first death from COVID-19 on Sunday we are not immune to the terrible impacts of this disease. But we are well prepared. We will continue to work to our plan, and continue to do all that we can to keep people safe and well - and ensure that our country bounces back as quickly as possible”, said David Clark.

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#2452387 1-Apr-2020 16:31

The New York Times - Coronavirus Live Updates: White House Projects Grim Toll for Americans

today

Here’s what you need to know: [headings only]

Models predicting expected spread of the virus in the U.S. paint a grim picture.
President Trump strikes a somber note as he warns of a “painful two weeks ahead.”
As many as 25 percent of people infected with the new coronavirus may not show symptoms.
Ignoring party lines, governors challenge Trump’s assertions on availability of supplies.
As of Tuesday afternoon, at least 173,741 people [in the USA] have tested positive for the virus, according to a New York Times database.

At least 3,433 patients with the virus have died.

Medical workers transferred the bodies of people who had died after contracting the virus to a temporary morgue in Brooklyn on Monday.

(click to view)

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#2452389 1-Apr-2020 16:36

As of Tuesday afternoon, at least 173,741 people [in the USA] have tested positive for the virus, according to a New York Times database.

At least 3,433 patients with the virus have died.

188435 cases and 4011 deaths

(some sites especially US CDC and WHO are slow collating totals)

Today I think was the first day that US death totals exceeded Italy. And it will get worse - much worse.

It's a tragedy.

Geektastic

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#2452392 1-Apr-2020 16:41

Dratsab:

That would require some tweaking of s11 of the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act 1990. I doubt any Government will want to go there.

If it’s that or all this again, I think they’ll be in there like a robber’s dog to be honest.

Geektastic

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#2452393 1-Apr-2020 16:43

freitasm:
Press release:

Work to scale up the health system in preparation for COVID-19 was today outlined by Health Minister David Clark, as he reported back to the new Epidemic Response Committee.

“We are well placed to contain the spread of COVID-19. We have taken early and decisive action at our borders, and that swift action has given us valuable time to refine our plan, and increase our preparedness,” said David Clark.

“Since January we have ramped up our testing capacity to 3300 tests per day. That is expected to grow, even in the face of strong international demand for the products used in the testing process.

“More than $40 million has gone towards contact tracing and we have quadrupled Healthline’s workforce since the end of January, to over than 500 staff working on COVID-19. We expect staff numbers to continue to increase.

“In Primary Care, we’ve moved quickly, and have already established 49 Community Based Assessment Centres, where people who have symptoms of COVID-19 can safely be tested. Another 61 Centres are in the works, doubling the number of sites available.

“All GP clinics have also been supplied Personal Protective Equipment, to help protect our GPs, nurses and other staff. Just last week 640,000 face masks were sent to DHBs from the National Reserve Supply and today, it was announced that the Ministry of Health was opening its national reserves of personal protective equipment to make 7 million masks available over coming weeks. The Ministry will begin an initial distribution of 1.2 million masks from the national stock to DHBs within the next 48 hours, so they are able to get masks to community health and disability workers who need them.

“Across our Public Hospitals we have access to 533 ventilators with another 247 in private hospitals and other organisations. More ventilators are on order from overseas. I also announced yesterday that we are fast tracking 36 new intensive care beds at Christchurch Hospital.

“We currently have around 2,500 trained ICU/Critical Care nurses and DHBs are already running refresher courses and training new staff to care for ventilated patients, should that be needed.

“We are fortunate to have such dedicated and professional doctors, nurses, midwives, laboratory scientists, mental health workers and allied health workers. These people provide outstanding care for New Zealanders day in, day out. And we are asking so much of them as we combat COVID-19.

“This a global pandemic. As has been clear with our first death from COVID-19 on Sunday we are not immune to the terrible impacts of this disease. But we are well prepared. We will continue to work to our plan, and continue to do all that we can to keep people safe and well - and ensure that our country bounces back as quickly as possible”, said David Clark.

Earlier, more decisive action would possibly have prevented us ever having it.

Rikkitic

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#2452395 1-Apr-2020 16:47

Geektastic:

Earlier, more decisive action would possibly have prevented us ever having it.

Maybe. Easy to be wise after the fact. I'm still damned glad this isn't America.

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