2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2520858 10-Jul-2020 16:53

GV27:

I just have a horrible feeling that community transmission is statistically inevitable, especially if more and more people start returning. Between the fence jumpers and false negatives, I know there's little that can be done, but the risk is never really zero.

That's why its cleat they are going to cap arrivals at between 3-4000 a fortnight,

Australia just capped theirs at ~4000 a week, and the current arrivals forecasts for next week in NZ is only ~2000 with 3000 to leave MIQ (so numbers on hotels fall 1000)

https://covid19.govt.nz/assets/resources/miq-data/miq-daily-update-2020-07-10.pdf

They have been running to catch up over the past 3 weeks, and things are getting missed. If we can dial it back to a fixed number, and not have to keep adding hotels, I think it will become a lot more manageable.....

Fred99

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#2520872 10-Jul-2020 17:16

Australia is also going to start charging for quarantine. From SMH:

Prime Minister Scott Morrison made the announcement after the national cabinet meeting on Friday, and added all states and territories will be moving toward charging for quarantine.

"Some states already [charge for quarantine], other states are moving towards that, and I will leave that to them to make their announcements at the appropriate time and where possible, we will seek to have some sort of national uniformity across those pricings," Mr Morrison said.

Daynger

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#2520879 10-Jul-2020 17:29

frankv:

Batman: Nobody wants to blame nobody here.

Yeah, right; Tui moment. There's always people wanting to blame [insert a demographic] for all their woes.

This dickhead......

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/man-charged-escaping-hamilton-covid-19-hotel-buy-alcohol-named-denied-bail

Good to see they named him and refused bail, and to a lesser extent he tested negative.

tdgeek

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#2520895 10-Jul-2020 18:28

Daynger

This dickhead......

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/man-charged-escaping-hamilton-covid-19-hotel-buy-alcohol-named-denied-bail

Good to see they named him and refused bail, and to a lesser extent he tested negative.

Yep. Its sad that these people are not criminals but they feel free to flout the rules, as "Im not really a criminal" But we need to treat all of these people (99% of which, comply) as if they need maximum prison security. When , and I say when, this happens again, the rules will change. This is not an NZ issue its happened globally.

ezbee

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#2520907 10-Jul-2020 18:52

While there were objections from certain areas, it does seem it is the right choice to pull back on numbers coming over the border.

Another idiot threatening staff at Hotels to add to the list.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300033956/coronavirus-man-arrested-charged-with-threatening-staff-at-isolation-hotel

The trust model does not work well in this situation as there is a small % that can't be by either stupidity , or deliberation.

I would have a $1000 bond lodged, before travel, and a list of instant fines, backed up with a trip to court for tougher penalties.
Refund on 14 days of trouble free isolation.

tdgeek

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#2520912 10-Jul-2020 19:01

ezbee:

While there were objections from certain areas, it does seem it is the right choice to pull back on numbers coming over the border.

Another idiot threatening staff at Hotels to add to the list.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300033956/coronavirus-man-arrested-charged-with-threatening-staff-at-isolation-hotel

The trust model does not work well in this situation as there is a small % that can't be by either stupidity , or deliberation.

I would have a $1000 bond lodged, before travel, and a list of instant fines, backed up with a trip to court for tougher penalties.
Refund on 14 days of trouble free isolation.

Yep. Non compliance is a standard arrest, 30 days in the clink

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kingdragonfly

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#2520938 10-Jul-2020 20:19

That got out of hand quickly.

And in local news, the police seem to want to pan off guard responsibility to some yet to be determined group.

Again previous generations faced the same problem of people being dicks, and used islands.

Rikkitic

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#2520941 10-Jul-2020 20:21

kingdragonfly:

Again previous generations faced the same problem of people being dicks, and used islands.

We've got lots of those. Auckland Island comes to mind.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

Oblivian

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#2520942 10-Jul-2020 20:22

Take no prisoners!

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=12347235

In short. Ambulance officers at a KFC at 0130

Car of people ordered _20_ meals

Cops door knock as a follow up, b-day party under lockdown. 16 people. $26,000AU

Geektastic

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#2520951 10-Jul-2020 21:38

Oblivian:

Take no prisoners!

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=12347235

In short. Ambulance officers at a KFC at 0130

Car of people ordered _20_ meals

Cops door knock as a follow up, b-day party under lockdown. 16 people. $26,000AU

I am envious of Australia's ability to clobber wrongdoers. They are much better at it than NZ.

mattwnz

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#2520952 10-Jul-2020 21:39

tdgeek:
GV27:

I just have a horrible feeling that community transmission is statistically inevitable, especially if more and more people start returning. Between the fence jumpers and false negatives, I know there's little that can be done, but the risk is never really zero.

I agree. It can never be zero, not unless you do 5 million tests a week on us. My faith is that we can contain any outbreaks. We hardly got any CT when we started getting cases, same with Level 3. If we did, then the whole country is clean and focus on ring fencing where it turned up, all the resource can go there.

But your right its never zero

As shown by Australia, once there are cases on the community it can be very difficult to control the spread again, without lockdown or at least moving up a level to try and reduce the transmission rate. Other countries that have got down to low levels, several have also has second waves. Unless it is eliminated then countries have to go in and out of lockdowns to control the numbers. The best thing NZ can do is make sure our borders are watertight so we don't get any cases in the community. If we do get community cases it may indicate a failure in the protocols somewhere or someone has breached those protocols. The problem is we are relying in people doing the right thing, when some people aren't. This means that we have gradually been making these isolation hotels more and more difficult to escape from. Living in a country with covid in the community, is going to be very negatively affected financially over the long term.

Also I got an advertising email today from a NZ business titled is your business ready for another lockdown. If their is a local lockdown in Auckland I can just see people escaping before it occurs, like what occurred in Victoria potentially allowing the virus out as well. It is madness.

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tdgeek

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#2520999 11-Jul-2020 09:24

mattwnz:

As shown by Australia, once there are cases on the community it can be very difficult to control the spread again, without lockdown or at least moving up a level to try and reduce the transmission rate. Other countries that have got down to low levels, several have also has second waves. Unless it is eliminated then countries have to go in and out of lockdowns to control the numbers. The best thing NZ can do is make sure our borders are watertight so we don't get any cases in the community. If we do get community cases it may indicate a failure in the protocols somewhere or someone has breached those protocols. The problem is we are relying in people doing the right thing, when some people aren't. This means that we have gradually been making these isolation hotels more and more difficult to escape from. Living in a country with covid in the community, is going to be very negatively affected financially over the long term.

Also I got an advertising email today from a NZ business titled is your business ready for another lockdown. If their is a local lockdown in Auckland I can just see people escaping before it occurs, like what occurred in Victoria potentially allowing the virus out as well. It is madness.

AUS is not NZ. They flout far more than us and throw lockdown are loose. We can lockdown any ares that pop up, that locks off spread before it takes off, and as we saw here it never took off, it never got CT over low single digits.

But we do need to treat the law abiding citizens in these facilities as maximum security prisons. They seem to think absconding is ok as its not a "real" crime

cshwone

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#2521010 11-Jul-2020 09:43

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/122083465/police-union-slams-government-for-posting-247-cop-babysitters-at-covid-quarantine-facilities

I must admit I am disappointed in this position by the Police union. It comes across as a bit precious and lacking appreciation that COVID-19 is the biggest threat to the nation at the moment.

Police are the people with the power of arrest and roving patrols give any absconder time to start the spread rather than nailing them there and then. Or more importantly deterring any dubious actions.

tdgeek

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#2521013 11-Jul-2020 09:49

cshwone:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/122083465/police-union-slams-government-for-posting-247-cop-babysitters-at-covid-quarantine-facilities

I must admit I am disappointed in this position by the Police union. It comes across as a bit precious and lacking appreciation that COVID-19 is the biggest threat to the nation at the moment.

Police are the people with the power of arrest and roving patrols give any absconder time to start the spread rather than nailing them there and then. Or more importantly deterring any dubious actions.

I can see their point. They either go after burglers, murderers, assaulters, rapists, or they babysit law abiding citizens who want to sneak out to buy conditioner.

cshwone

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#2521014 11-Jul-2020 09:59

tdgeek:

cshwone:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/122083465/police-union-slams-government-for-posting-247-cop-babysitters-at-covid-quarantine-facilities

I must admit I am disappointed in this position by the Police union. It comes across as a bit precious and lacking appreciation that COVID-19 is the biggest threat to the nation at the moment.

Police are the people with the power of arrest and roving patrols give any absconder time to start the spread rather than nailing them there and then. Or more importantly deterring any dubious actions.

I can see their point. They either go after burglers, murderers, assaulters, rapists, or they babysit law abiding citizens who want to sneak out to buy conditioner.

But surely it is not up to them which laws they police

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