They lost the war on drugs

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Forums › Politics › They lost the war on drugs

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#1524810 2-Apr-2016 20:18

Can you tell me how do we manage the social effects? How do we mitigate the damage to health, wrecked families, domestic violence?

Fred99

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#1524814 2-Apr-2016 20:24

MikeB4:

Can you tell me how do we manage the social effects? How do we mitigate the damage to health, wrecked families, domestic violence?

What the heck?

It will be better than it is now. Drug use will decrease or at worst not increase. Gangs have their water cut off. Even if a user of opiates remains addicted for the rest of their lives, then the health benefit for them from prescribed controlled-dose drugs dispensed in sanitary conditions at low cost will be massive.

blakamin

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#1524818 2-Apr-2016 20:28

MikeB4:

So drugs become legal, the criminals become law abiding upright citizens and drug use drops away and we all live happily ever after.

We all know that won't happen, and being flippant about it isn't contributing to the discussion.

Pretty pathetic reply really... I expected better.

MikeB4

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#1524820 2-Apr-2016 20:29

Ok I'm out, 20+ years in social services tells me a hell of a lot different, but this venue means nothing.

Enjoy

Fred99

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#1524821 2-Apr-2016 20:34

MikeB4:

Ok I'm out, 20+ years in social services tells me a hell of a lot different, but this venue means nothing.

Enjoy

I'm not sure that "this venue means nothing" at all.

"There's something we need to talk about". There really is.

And social media - including forums like this - are a damned good place where such things can be discussed.

dejadeadnz

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#1524822 2-Apr-2016 20:35

MikeB4:

Ok I'm out, 20+ years in social services tells me a hell of a lot different, but this venue means nothing.

Enjoy

Because everyone should just be cowed to silence by your appeals to your own authority. Right. Look, experience has some relevance but at least deign to offer some of us peons a few lines of argument.

blakamin

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#1524823 2-Apr-2016 20:37

MikeB4:

Ok I'm out, 20+ years in social services tells me a hell of a lot different, but this venue means nothing.

Enjoy

25+ years of knowing junkies tells me that you have no idea what you were doing and probably shouldn't have been in social services. A certain attitude helps nobody.

Enjoy.

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MikeB4

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#1524825 2-Apr-2016 20:42

I apologize for my poor attitude and posts, but I have dealt with parents burying their kids who have overdosed, wives that have been beaten by drug abusing spouses. Children beaten by drug addict parents.

So many times that I finally changed my career direction as I could not take it further. Everything I have seen tells me that this will be a monumental mistake

blakamin

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#1524826 2-Apr-2016 20:48

MikeB4:

I apologize for my poor attitude and posts, but I have dealt with parents burying their kids who have overdosed, wives that have been beaten by drug abusing spouses. Children beaten by drug addict parents.

So many times that I finally changed my career direction as I could not take it further. Everything I have seen tells me that this will be a monumental mistake

Mike I understand that... but I have SEEN PEOPLE DIE... because people were too scared to call an ambulance!

I've been in the room and called an ambulance myself.

I have lost members of my own family.

I've also seen/been children abused by the catholic church...

I've seen children beaten by non-drinkers/non-drug users... because of mental illness.

A nice puritanical attitude is fine, but it changes NOTHING!

Regulation, support, and most of all, help, changes things... And none of this will happen while it's illegal.

blakamin

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#1524828 2-Apr-2016 20:53

Just watched an undercover cop in the US get shot by police, and receive $8.5million in compensation, on the news... War on drugs. Awesome. smh.

Oh, it was a weed bust...

MikeB4

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#1524829 2-Apr-2016 20:54

blakamin:

MikeB4:

I apologize for my poor attitude and posts, but I have dealt with parents burying their kids who have overdosed, wives that have been beaten by drug abusing spouses. Children beaten by drug addict parents.

So many times that I finally changed my career direction as I could not take it further. Everything I have seen tells me that this will be a monumental mistake

Mike I understand that... but I have SEEN PEOPLE DIE... because people were too scared to call an ambulance!

I've been in the room and called an ambulance myself.

I have lost members of my own family.

I've also seen/been children abused by the catholic church...

A nice puritanical attitude is fine, but it changes NOTHING!

Regulation, support, and most of all, help, changes things... And none of this will happen while it's illegal.

I am not disputing the point regarding folks passing because of fear to get help, first responders attacked for the same reasons I to have seen this. I am not being puritanical and I know all too well that domestic violence is blind to social class.

MikeB4

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#1524854 2-Apr-2016 20:59

This discussion presses too many buttons and brings back too many black memories for me. I said earlier I wanted out, so I respectfully bow out. I am also taking time out from Geekzone, sometimes the toll is too high.

frankv

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#1524884 2-Apr-2016 21:59

MikeB4:

So drugs become legal, the criminals become law abiding upright citizens and drug use drops away and we all live happily ever after.

Arguing that something shouldn't happen because it isn't a perfect solution is counter-productive.

To some extent, the criminals *will* become law abiding upright citizens, because people who are law-abiding upright citizens (apart from using marijuana) will no longer be criminalised. ust like homosexuality was a crime, and now is not. And prostitution was a crime and now is not.

Whether drug use drops away is actually not that important... what we should focus on is preventing (or at least minimising) the negative effects of drug use. Imagine, for example, if someone came up with the perfect drug... it makes the user happy, and has no negative health or social or psychiatric effects. Surely it would be OK for people to use that? Then we *could* all live happily ever after.

tdgeek

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#1525013 3-Apr-2016 09:04

dejadeadnz:

MikeB4:

Ok I'm out, 20+ years in social services tells me a hell of a lot different, but this venue means nothing.

Enjoy

Because everyone should just be cowed to silence by your appeals to your own authority. Right. Look, experience has some relevance but at least deign to offer some of us peons a few lines of argument.

Actually, that goes both ways.

You've said that drug use will decrease or not increase much, good point. But thats not really saying anything. I want to know why this will happen. If we have x amount of users now, and we have x amount of non users now. How can readily and legally available drugs cause existing users to now start using less? And the non users who could be users, as right now its just not easily available to them apart from a party sharing someone else, they can readily access drugs.

SepticSceptic

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#1525052 3-Apr-2016 09:38

Fred99:

What "product" will the gangsters turn to?

There will always be something - may not be now, but there will be something ..

Umpty Candy ? - 2000AD - Judge Dredd Reference - Uncle Ump's Umpty Candy was a confectionery sold in Mega-City One which became known as "the sweet that was too good to eat." Although it was not a narcotic drug (in Mega-City One, sugar is also illegal) and was not addictive per se, it tasted so good that it was impossible to stop eating it once it had been tasted. People who tried to give it up experienced severe withdrawal syndromes. The problem became so acute that the judges banned Umpty Candy, arrested Ump and faked his death, pretending that the secret recipe had died with him. However, a corrupt judge ensured that the secret got out, and black market Umpty was soon being sold illicitly by criminals known as umptybaggers

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