Jacinda Ardern - our new PM

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Forums › Politics › Jacinda Ardern - our new PM

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1759 posts

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#2019713 21-May-2018 12:05

Just get real guys...including you Mike...NZ could stop using all fossil fuels tomorrow and the global effect will be zero. Technology is advancing at a huge pace and we know the global legislation has difficulty keeping up.

Technology to replace all our fossil driven devices is not yet available or affordable and will take many years yet to get in place. We need fossil fuels for our public transport and all things before then.

To mine the materials needed for batteries alone is not possible as the world does not have enough of these minerals/metals at this point.

Whilst it must feel wonderful to feel righteous, a dose of reality is still needed.

In the meantime you could lobby the Government to supply us with subsidies on electric vehicles and solar installations. That would be a start in the right direction.

rjt123

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#2019716 21-May-2018 12:14

MikeB4:
rjt123:
MikeB4: It is a step in the right direction.

Virtue signalling.

What ever you want to call it, but waking up maybe useful to you.

Oh we all got the warm fuzzies when the government announced this policy, but let's just be clear that it doesn't actually reduce consumption, from what I have read about it, it's more about protection the ocean from accidental oil spills than about reducing emissions. It's easy to confuse it with what u expect to hear...

MikeB4

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#2019717 21-May-2018 12:16

Pumpedd:

Just get real guys...including you Mike...NZ could stop using all fossil fuels tomorrow and the global effect will be zero. Technology is advancing at a huge pace and we know the global legislation has difficulty keeping up.

Technology to replace all our fossil driven devices is not yet available or affordable and will take many years yet to get in place. We need fossil fuels for our public transport and all things before then.

To mine the materials needed for batteries alone is not possible as the world does not have enough of these minerals/metals at this point.

Whilst it must feel wonderful to feel righteous, a dose of reality is still needed.

In the meantime you could lobby the Government to supply us with subsidies on electric vehicles and solar installations. That would be a start in the right direction.

Get real, that is a really stupid and selfish attitude.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

MikeB4

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#2019719 21-May-2018 12:19

rjt123:
MikeB4:

rjt123:
MikeB4: It is a step in the right direction.

Virtue signalling.

What ever you want to call it, but waking up maybe useful to you.

Oh we all got the warm fuzzies when the government announced this policy, but let's just be clear that it doesn't actually reduce consumption, from what I have read about it, it's more about protection the ocean from accidental oil spills than about reducing emissions. It's easy to confuse it with what u expect to hear...

Every journey starts with a single step and without that first step you are going nowhere.

Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Whai-a te marama-tanga,
me te aroha - e ngā iwi!
Ki-a ko tapa tahi,
Ki-a ko-tahi rā
Tātou tātou e

Tā-tou tā-tou e E!!
Hi aue hei !!!

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

rjt123

517 posts

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#2019724 21-May-2018 12:26

MikeB4:
Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Whai-a te marama-tanga,
me te aroha - e ngā iwi!
Ki-a ko tapa tahi,
Ki-a ko-tahi rā
Tātou tātou e

Tā-tou tā-tou e E!!
Hi aue hei !!!

On a lighter note... Google translate gives some interesting results:

Customers,
we are
Customers,
we are
Afternoon,
and love - people!
So-and-one,
So-and-so
We are

Add your print to E !!
Hi how to !!

😂😂😂

MikeAqua

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#2019727 21-May-2018 12:33

rjt123: Oh we all got the warm fuzzies when the government announced this policy, but let's just be clear that it doesn't actually reduce consumption

Agreed. When the end of exploration hits domestic production, imports will simply increase to compensate. Shipping petroleum product has local and global environmental impacts too.

Mike

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Pumpedd

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#2019736 21-May-2018 12:44

rjt123:
MikeB4:

Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Whai-a te marama-tanga,
me te aroha - e ngā iwi!
Ki-a ko tapa tahi,
Ki-a ko-tahi rā
Tātou tātou e

Tā-tou tā-tou e E!!
Hi aue hei !!!

On a lighter note... Google translate gives some interesting results:

Customers,
we are
Customers,
we are
Afternoon,
and love - people!
So-and-one,
So-and-so
We are

Add your print to E !!
Hi how to !!

😂😂😂

So uplifting....I prefer French tho....such a beautiful language when wanting to describe love.

MikeB4

MikeB4
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#2019754 21-May-2018 13:08

rjt123:
MikeB4:

Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Whai-a te marama-tanga,
me te aroha - e ngā iwi!
Ki-a ko tapa tahi,
Ki-a ko-tahi rā
Tātou tātou e

Tā-tou tā-tou e E!!
Hi aue hei !!!

On a lighter note... Google translate gives some interesting results:

Customers,
we are
Customers,
we are
Afternoon,
and love - people!
So-and-one,
So-and-so
We are

Add your print to E !!
Hi how to !!

😂😂😂

It is this …..

Line up together people
All of us, all of us
Stand in rows people
All of us, all of us
Seek after knowledge
and love of others - everyone
Think as one
Act as one
All of us, all of us

All of us, All of us!!
Hi aue hei !!!

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

Geektastic

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#2020053 21-May-2018 20:07

MikeB4:
rjt123:
MikeB4:

rjt123:
MikeB4: It is a step in the right direction.

Virtue signalling.

What ever you want to call it, but waking up maybe useful to you.

Oh we all got the warm fuzzies when the government announced this policy, but let's just be clear that it doesn't actually reduce consumption, from what I have read about it, it's more about protection the ocean from accidental oil spills than about reducing emissions. It's easy to confuse it with what u expect to hear...

Every journey starts with a single step and without that first step you are going nowhere.

Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Tūtira mai ngā iwi,
tātou tātou e
Whai-a te marama-tanga,
me te aroha - e ngā iwi!
Ki-a ko tapa tahi,
Ki-a ko-tahi rā
Tātou tātou e

Tā-tou tā-tou e E!!
Hi aue hei !!!

Given the size of NZ, a far more practical and sensible approach would be to wait until someone with more money and resources has made the first several steps and then just adopt that.

6FIEND

774 posts

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#2020231 22-May-2018 10:28

Industrialized nations have been decarbonizing their energy sources for 150 years, meaning we are moving away from carbon toward hydrogen. In other words, the ratio of carbon to hydrogen decreases as you go from wood and hay (1:1) to coal to oil to gas (1:4). Here is an illustration from one of Jesse Ausubel's articles: (from the Rockerfeller Institute)

The Coalition's knee-jerk ban on future oil & gas exploration in NZ was a *MASSIVE* backwards step for the environment. (Given that current estimates on gas field supply run out in 6-7yrs, and we will need to burn greater amounts of coal and oil for generation capacity unless we can achieve 100% renewable energy in that timeframe)

Given that this was Ardern's nuclear moment... you'd think that she might have taken a modicum of advice or undertaken an ounce of research before she went off announcing policy with wide-reaching implications.

tdgeek

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#2020239 22-May-2018 10:44

Makes sense, they should increase gas exploration, try to increase the lifetime. using coal and oil for generation is a no go, there are green options that have hardly been touched

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GV27

5979 posts

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#2020261 22-May-2018 11:33

Geektastic:

Given the size of NZ, a far more practical and sensible approach would be to wait until someone with more money and resources has made the first several steps and then just adopt that.

We're already benefiting from everyone else's electric car subsidies. Not sure why we should be subsidising people buying Teslas.

Pumpedd

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#2020324 22-May-2018 13:09

MikeB4:

Pumpedd:

Just get real guys...including you Mike...NZ could stop using all fossil fuels tomorrow and the global effect will be zero. Technology is advancing at a huge pace and we know the global legislation has difficulty keeping up.

Technology to replace all our fossil driven devices is not yet available or affordable and will take many years yet to get in place. We need fossil fuels for our public transport and all things before then.

To mine the materials needed for batteries alone is not possible as the world does not have enough of these minerals/metals at this point.

Whilst it must feel wonderful to feel righteous, a dose of reality is still needed.

In the meantime you could lobby the Government to supply us with subsidies on electric vehicles and solar installations. That would be a start in the right direction.

Get real, that is a really stupid and selfish attitude.

Why is it stupid and selfish Mike....?

rjt123

517 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 157
Inactive user

#2020552 22-May-2018 18:26

6FIEND:

Given that this was Ardern's nuclear moment... you'd think that she might have taken a modicum of advice or undertaken an ounce of research before she went off announcing policy with wide-reaching implications.

While nuclear is extremely carbon friendly, for largely political reasons , we established ourselves as nuclear free. In the name of all things 'progressive', illogical, backward and nonsensical decisions can be twisted under the aura of public goodwill and sentiment to be seen as virtuous and beneficial. A ridiculous paradox, bit true nonetheless.

Jacinda's nuclear free moment? Did we envisage something practical? Did we suppose that the absurdity we call 'societal progress' would actually be a step forward. Admittedly for a moment I was lulled into thinking just that. And then reality struck. The gas we thought was the way of the future was condemned, prices rise, the people struggle ..... And our carbon emissions stay the same.

Just like NZ's nuclear free stance was merely virtue signalling, and the nuclear powers around the globe blithley carried on their greener way, while we tried to find some cold comfort by assuming a nuclear meltdown in the Auckland harbour by some carbon-friendly American warship was imminent, so to will we try to find some colder comfort in the higher power prices, the ugly dams making a blot on some once pristine valley, or horrible windmills destroying our natural landscapes when we realise that cutting of our gas supplies was a horrible mistake.

gzt

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#2020558 22-May-2018 18:38

rjt123: Just like NZ's nuclear free stance was merely virtue signalling, and the nuclear powers around the globe blithley carried on their greener way,

Actually no, NZ's nuclear free stance definitely created pressure to end testing in the region.

Also we have no coastal nuclear plants like Fukushima. Win.

I'm personally not against nuclear power in theory. But in practice there are so many problems and nz does not need it anyway.

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