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Topic # 240964 4-Oct-2018 09:31
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This week/month  has not been good for the Leader of the Opposition and yesterdays ummm mistake was yet another example of his unsuitability for Leadership. If National want to stand a chance in 2020 they need to review their leadership now in order to allow consolidation before the next election. The issue I see is the lack of plausible talent to take on the role. They let their best chance slip away when Bill English retired.





Mike
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  Reply # 2101838 4-Oct-2018 22:03
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I agree. What he said was inexcusable. Not the first time, he is not handling his leak issue well either even though its actually a non issue.

 

I like him. He can guide National, but he is young and is learning, exactly the same as the Labour haters say about JA who has apparently screwed up a lot. They are both the same, young talented but inexperienced. What I dont want is him to be couped in favour of the old brigade. Jk was fine, hopped in hopped out when he saw the end was nigh, BE was left with a dummy. SB is worth hanging into, he needs to learn a lesson as JA is now doing. Then we have real people not the boring do nothings competing for Govt.


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  Reply # 2101847 4-Oct-2018 22:28
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tdgeek:

 

I like him. 

 

 

I don't.

 

I'd be interested to see what his popularity ratings are based on age / demographics.  I get the feeling that the generation he's supposed to appeal to don't, but pearl-clutchers probably think that he's a nice young man. 


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  Reply # 2101855 4-Oct-2018 22:47
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Fred99:

 

tdgeek:

 

I like him. 

 

 

I don't.

 

I'd be interested to see what his popularity ratings are based on age / demographics.  I get the feeling that the generation he's supposed to appeal to don't, but pearl-clutchers probably think that he's a nice young man. 

 

 

I had to google pearl clutcher

 

He has a good background and a good set of morals. Clearly his venture into leader has become flavourless, oppose for the sake of it. But he has very good potential, and like JA will learn by mistakes. She has been good, and faltered, but is solid. He was solid, then faltered. It all depends if he wants to be the new National the 2018 variety or carry on the old flavour.


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  Reply # 2101899 5-Oct-2018 08:00
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tdgeek:

 

Fred99:

 

tdgeek:

 

I like him. 

 

 

I don't.

 

I'd be interested to see what his popularity ratings are based on age / demographics.  I get the feeling that the generation he's supposed to appeal to don't, but pearl-clutchers probably think that he's a nice young man. 

 

 

I had to google pearl clutcher

 

He has a good background and a good set of morals. Clearly his venture into leader has become flavourless, oppose for the sake of it. But he has very good potential, and like JA will learn by mistakes. She has been good, and faltered, but is solid. He was solid, then faltered. It all depends if he wants to be the new National the 2018 variety or carry on the old flavour.

 

 

That's pretty much all Labour did for the bulk of the time they were in opposition; oppose for the sake of opposing. People seem to have short memories here. No one will knife him this far out from an election, and let's be honest, the media is never going to hold Jacinda to the same standard they'll hold the National Party leader to, whoever it is. 


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  Reply # 2101904 5-Oct-2018 08:15
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GV27:

 

tdgeek:

 

Fred99:

 

tdgeek:

 

I like him. 

 

 

I don't.

 

I'd be interested to see what his popularity ratings are based on age / demographics.  I get the feeling that the generation he's supposed to appeal to don't, but pearl-clutchers probably think that he's a nice young man. 

 

 

I had to google pearl clutcher

 

He has a good background and a good set of morals. Clearly his venture into leader has become flavourless, oppose for the sake of it. But he has very good potential, and like JA will learn by mistakes. She has been good, and faltered, but is solid. He was solid, then faltered. It all depends if he wants to be the new National the 2018 variety or carry on the old flavour.

 

 

That's pretty much all Labour did for the bulk of the time they were in opposition; oppose for the sake of opposing. People seem to have short memories here. No one will knife him this far out from an election, and let's be honest, the media is never going to hold Jacinda to the same standard they'll hold the National Party leader to, whoever it is. 

 

 

All Oppositions oppose for the sake of opposing, no short memories at all. My point is he is new, he needs to rebuild National, but all he seems to do is oppose at every opportunity with little to offer except the oppose. Nothing else

 

JA will and has been held to far more account than SB or whoever leads National, that's quite obvious. She is running the show, and is exposed. SB isnt running anything, very little to hold to account


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  Reply # 2101913 5-Oct-2018 08:37
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tdgeek:

 

All Oppositions oppose for the sake of opposing, no short memories at all. My point is he is new, he needs to rebuild National, but all he seems to do is oppose at every opportunity with little to offer except the oppose. Nothing else

 

JA will and has been held to far more account than SB or whoever leads National, that's quite obvious. She is running the show, and is exposed. SB isnt running anything, very little to hold to account

 

 

That's not the case - look at the bizarre coverage of the leak issue; first he was wrong to spend the money, then he was weak because someone leaked it, then he was wrong to call for an enquiry when the leaker supposedly outed themselves as being mentally fragile. 

 

Meanwhile, there was almost no scrutiny of Mallard's call to can the full investigation, and everyone had exceptionally short memories when Arden's 'training flight' to Naru racked up eight times the amount for a four day conference. 


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  Reply # 2101916 5-Oct-2018 08:43
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GV27:

 

tdgeek:

 

All Oppositions oppose for the sake of opposing, no short memories at all. My point is he is new, he needs to rebuild National, but all he seems to do is oppose at every opportunity with little to offer except the oppose. Nothing else

 

JA will and has been held to far more account than SB or whoever leads National, that's quite obvious. She is running the show, and is exposed. SB isnt running anything, very little to hold to account

 

 

That's not the case - look at the bizarre coverage of the leak issue; first he was wrong to spend the money, then he was weak because someone leaked it, then he was wrong to call for an enquiry when the leaker supposedly outed themselves as being mentally fragile. 

 

Meanwhile, there was almost no scrutiny of Mallard's call to can the full investigation, and everyone had exceptionally short memories when Arden's 'training flight' to Naru racked up eight times the amount for a four day conference. 

 

 

The accountability of JA is as long as your arm. Nauru was in the news often in that period. Its not that SB is not accountable, he is, but as he is the leader of the Opposition there is not a lot he will do in his day job to warrant accountability.


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  Reply # 2101931 5-Oct-2018 09:20
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GV27:

 

That's not the case - look at the bizarre coverage of the leak issue; first he was wrong to spend the money, then he was weak because someone leaked it, then he was wrong to call for an enquiry when the leaker supposedly outed themselves as being mentally fragile. 

 

 

I have a different opinion. 

 

Firstly, he was not wrong to spend the money.  It was a trifling amount, and it's something that all new leaders tend to do.  Completely normal behaviour.  He made a bad misstep when it was initially leaked - he response should have been, "Yeah - so what?"  (especially given the fact that the expenses were going to be released officially in a matter of weeks regardless.)

 

Calling for an inquiry just made him look fragile, untrusting of his colleagues, lacking confidence, and worst of all, guilty of having done something wrong.

 

I think that National made a mistake electing him as leader.  It seems to me that they simply decided they needed a fresh, new up-and-comer to go head-to-head with JA.  I do hope that their thinking isn't quite that shallow.


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  Reply # 2101948 5-Oct-2018 09:31
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6FIEND:

 

GV27:

 

That's not the case - look at the bizarre coverage of the leak issue; first he was wrong to spend the money, then he was weak because someone leaked it, then he was wrong to call for an enquiry when the leaker supposedly outed themselves as being mentally fragile. 

 

 

I have a different opinion. 

 

Firstly, he was not wrong to spend the money.  It was a trifling amount, and it's something that all new leaders tend to do.  Completely normal behaviour.  He made a bad misstep when it was initially leaked - he response should have been, "Yeah - so what?"  (especially given the fact that the expenses were going to be released officially in a matter of weeks regardless.)

 

Calling for an inquiry just made him look fragile, untrusting of his colleagues, lacking confidence, and worst of all, guilty of having done something wrong.

 

I think that National made a mistake electing him as leader.  It seems to me that they simply decided they needed a fresh, new up-and-comer to go head-to-head with JA.  I do hope that their thinking isn't quite that shallow.

 

 

I agree on both counts. JA has been hammered for her inexperience and issues, SB the same but for far less as he is less exposed. All a learning curve for both of them. If they chose one of the old boys brigade, that creates a big gap between the two major parties, old school vs young. Plus it doesn't help the young vote

 

Time will tell, I feel both will succeed, and thats good for NZ




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  Reply # 2101949 5-Oct-2018 09:33
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6FIEND:

 

GV27:

 

That's not the case - look at the bizarre coverage of the leak issue; first he was wrong to spend the money, then he was weak because someone leaked it, then he was wrong to call for an enquiry when the leaker supposedly outed themselves as being mentally fragile. 

 

 

I have a different opinion. 

 

Firstly, he was not wrong to spend the money.  It was a trifling amount, and it's something that all new leaders tend to do.  Completely normal behaviour.  He made a bad misstep when it was initially leaked - he response should have been, "Yeah - so what?"  (especially given the fact that the expenses were going to be released officially in a matter of weeks regardless.)

 

Calling for an inquiry just made him look fragile, untrusting of his colleagues, lacking confidence, and worst of all, guilty of having done something wrong.

 

I think that National made a mistake electing him as leader.  It seems to me that they simply decided they needed a fresh, new up-and-comer to go head-to-head with JA.  I do hope that their thinking isn't quite that shallow.

 

 

 

 

The list of viable alternatives is sadly lacking. I am a National voter but I cannot think of anyone in the current line up I would like to see as leader.





Mike
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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 2101952 5-Oct-2018 09:36
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I think making Simon Bridges leader of National was a reaction to Jacinda Ardern.

 

I personally don't like him, to me he comes across as a bit smarmy and not very genuine. But I obviously don't know the man, so my assessment from just seeing him on TV may be way off base.

 

It does seem true that all he, and National as a whole, offers is opposition for oppositions sake. I know this is nothing new, but isn't the point of fresh leadership to offer something new?

 

I'd be far more inclined to support an opposition party (or any party for that matter) who is willing to admit when the other party does something well or has a good idea.

 

Again, this is nothing new, but I'd just like to see our politicians be more concerned with the welfare of the country than simply staying in power, or trying to get back into power.


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  Reply # 2101963 5-Oct-2018 09:43
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GV27:

 

No one will knife him this far out from an election, and let's be honest, the media is never going to hold Jacinda to the same standard they'll hold the National Party leader to, whoever it is. 

 

 

What's the term called when someone does that? States "let's be honest" - then immediately issues forth a heavily biased statement of opinion.


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  Reply # 2102002 5-Oct-2018 09:47
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Paul1977:

 

I think making Simon Bridges leader of National was a reaction to Jacinda Ardern.

 

I personally don't like him, to me he comes across as a bit smarmy and not very genuine. But I obviously don't know the man, so my assessment from just seeing him on TV may be way off base.

 

It does seem true that all he, and National as a whole, offers is opposition for oppositions sake. I know this is nothing new, but isn't the point of fresh leadership to offer something new?

 

I'd be far more inclined to support an opposition party (or any party for that matter) who is willing to admit when the other party does something well or has a good idea.

 

Again, this is nothing new, but I'd just like to see our politicians be more concerned with the welfare of the country than simply staying in power, or trying to get back into power.

 

 

Bolds

 

1. I agree

 

2. Can't do that as public will stick to the current party

 

3. Yep, that's always an issue. rarely will you see, "you wont like this. you wont want to vote for this, but we have to"  and the usual pre election bribes. If we found a true statesman, who doesnt need the vote buying strategy, it could happen then, but thats very rare


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  Reply # 2102010 5-Oct-2018 10:00
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tdgeek:

 

Paul1977:

 

I think making Simon Bridges leader of National was a reaction to Jacinda Ardern.

 

I personally don't like him, to me he comes across as a bit smarmy and not very genuine. But I obviously don't know the man, so my assessment from just seeing him on TV may be way off base.

 

It does seem true that all he, and National as a whole, offers is opposition for oppositions sake. I know this is nothing new, but isn't the point of fresh leadership to offer something new?

 

I'd be far more inclined to support an opposition party (or any party for that matter) who is willing to admit when the other party does something well or has a good idea.

 

Again, this is nothing new, but I'd just like to see our politicians be more concerned with the welfare of the country than simply staying in power, or trying to get back into power.

 

 

Bolds

 

1. I agree

 

2. Can't do that as public will stick to the current party

 

3. Yep, that's always an issue. rarely will you see, "you wont like this. you wont want to vote for this, but we have to"  and the usual pre election bribes. If we found a true statesman, who doesnt need the vote buying strategy, it could happen then, but thats very rare

 

 

I disagree. You can (and should) give credit where credit is due, and still oppose other policies that you have valid reasons to oppose.

 

 


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  Reply # 2102015 5-Oct-2018 10:10
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Fred99:

 

GV27:

 

No one will knife him this far out from an election, and let's be honest, the media is never going to hold Jacinda to the same standard they'll hold the National Party leader to, whoever it is. 

 

 

What's the term called when someone does that? States "let's be honest" - then immediately issues forth a heavily biased statement of opinion.

 

 

What's the word for it when senior political reporters express frustration at National's polling not dropping, no matter what they report?

 

How is it heavily biased to say the media bought into Jacindamania? It was in their interest to hype it up and they did.


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