Sound/Vision, and Home Theatre in a new two storied house (or How to Correctly Wire Your House)

Forums › Home Theatre (including HTPC and EPG Collector) › Sound/Vision, and Home Theatre in a new two storied house (or How to Correctly Wire Your House)

1 | 2 | 3 | 4

16 posts

Geek

#106525 24-Jan-2008 15:02

I just built a house in tauranga with similar reqs to yours.

Our sparky knew nothing re this stuff but gave it a go and stuffed up a couple of things. eg, he ran speaker wire for the subwoofers.

I assume you will have an electrician at some stage - apparently guild & spence are good at the home data/video / audio and they can also do your electricals. I wish I had have used them now although we have largely solved all of our electrician generated probs.

My main advice, would be to have a detailed plan up front. Specify every outlet, and every cable up front. It's a pain in the arse but well worthwhile.

Make sure whoeever wires knows about minimising interference between signal cabling and electrical wiring (there are some rules about running wires parallel to each other).

the benefits of cat-6 are great. eg, you can hook an xbox as a media extender in another room from your pc. The xbox will attach to your tv and stream music/video. tech is still basic (eg, can't easily stream dvd from harddrive via mce) but the next couple of years should show promise.

If you want IR distribution, be wary of mysky/sky boxes. some ir dist systems don't work well with mysky, and i heard normal sky too. google blue eye IR NZ for some info.

good luck. we are very happy with our system ,people are generally blown away - houses should be made at the least to feed cat5 or 6 through their houses.

richms

28187 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#106539 24-Jan-2008 15:54

I have found more problems are ground loop related rather then interference being picked up by cables - cat5 and coax are well equipped to deal with the tiny field that you will get around a power cable, when driven properly, if you just solder RCA plugs onto a cat5 you loose the benefit of twisted pair so you will get noise, and lots of it. For twisted pair to work, both pairs must have the same impedance to ground (in the case of Ethernet its isolated) and they also need to be differential at the receive and transmit end. Both are easily achieved with a transformer which is what Ethernet does and the balun do.

ebay for baluns - they are a rip at the likes of jaycar etc, and if you get one that is for 4 cctv cameras it will be the same electrically as the component + spdif ones, just without the coloured RCA plugs and price premium.

Richard rich.ms

jpwise

590 posts

Ultimate Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#106552 24-Jan-2008 16:42

Not forgetting if it's using BNC's you'll probably need BNC to RCA adapters - ~$5.50 each.

Jp.

Working for Service Plus - www.serviceplus.co.nz

Authorised Service Agent for Apple, BenQ, Sony, and Toshiba - warranty & non-warranty repairs.

richms

28187 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#106569 24-Jan-2008 18:14

Only $5.50 if you get it from the shop of despiration - aka dse or jaycar. Once again, ebay to the rescue - there are some $5 buy now for 20 of them on there with $10 shipping to NZ - with the current exchange rate thats only NZ$1 each landed to your door. I have also seen them in the $2 shop in the past, but their stock varies so much you cant count on it.

I am amazed that so many people pay dse's over inflated prices for cables and plugs but thems the breaks when you need something now.

Richard rich.ms

jpwise

590 posts

Ultimate Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#106667 25-Jan-2008 09:10

Agreed, but there is also the convenience and 'crap, I need xyz, right now!' factor. ;p

Working for Service Plus - www.serviceplus.co.nz

Authorised Service Agent for Apple, BenQ, Sony, and Toshiba - warranty & non-warranty repairs.

Warrenz

15 posts

Geek

#108364 3-Feb-2008 21:36

Hi Guys
Many thanks for all your input into my wiring query.
It is very much work in progress and will know doubt have queries, but I am a lot wiser .
Thanks
Warrenz

lyonrouge

1993 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#109413 9-Feb-2008 09:17

Warrenz: Hi Guys

Many thanks for all your input into my wiring query.

It is very much work in progress and will know doubt have queries, but I am a lot wiser .

Thanks

Warrenz

my 2 cents. Where possible run ducting with draw wires (although I have used the exising cable to draw through new cable). If you have a deck close to your living area you may want to consider a 2 zone amp (most 7.1 amps are dual zone), I have installed in-ceiling speakers in the eaves for music on the deck, running of the second zone (stereo) from the amp.

don't forget to consider cabling for projectors, including power for both the projector and screen (unless you get the luxury of a fixed screen).

Sharesies

Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

Regs

4066 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Snowflake

#110569 14-Feb-2008 11:40

cyril7: Search on some of my threads you will find comments on this in the past. But basic points provide a entral comms closet to place a RJ45 patch panel logical places are in the garage if its part of the lower floor, or in a cupboard under the stairs. Run plenty of Cat5e, I recommend a minumum of 12 ethernet points in a 3bedroom house, ideally more. A 4-5bed house I normally feed 24points into. Dont install BT phone sockets anywhere, do the whole thing on Cat5e with RJ45s. Dont forget power to the comms cupboard. The secuty will go there aswell.

I normally mount a wall rackmounting patch panel in the comms closet, in the same rack mount install a 16 way FastEthernet Switch. This is also where your ADSL router will go and your phone circuits terminate direct from the Demarc. I have designed a phone termination panel that has an integral wired DSL filter and RJ45s for patching phone circuits to the patch panel along with a security loop and test sockets.

going with a rackmounting patch panel is all well and good in a house with lots of spare room but when you have limited space, like me, you need to consider something more suited.

I want something flushmounted and I've been looking at the options and these are what i have found so far:

PDL: Lexcom LCH14 or LCH22 distribution cabinets
http://www.pdl.co.nz/products-nav.aspx?id=1048

Hills: Hills Home Hub
http://www.homeintegratedsystems.com/cattleprod/products/A1101ENC

Clipsal: Clipsal StarServe
http://www.clipsal.com.au/consumer/products/data_communications/Clipsal_StarServe

Signet ST2000
http://www.mastertrade.co.nz/MAG_CURRENT/index.php?edition=9&article=141
http://sigtech.co.nz/

Vynco: Logix VCC40 Communications Board
http://www.vynco.co.nz/logixvcomms

Some of these seem to be quite expensive solutions - PDL Lexcom and Clipsal, for example. So far I think I like the Vynco for (a) price (which includes a bunch of modules) and (b) there is a matching electrical distribution board which will make the installation in a visible wall nicer looking.

Anyone have any comments or tips on the above? I'm looking for something to distribute mainly data and telephone and tv/sat aerials. I intend to use media center extenders to bring tv/music/video to rooms that need it so video distribution is not a biggie for me.

Thanks
Regan

Sales Engineer
Snowflake
www.snowflake.com

about.me/nzregs
Twitter: @nzregs

sbiddle

30853 posts

Uber Geek

Retired Mod

Trusted

Biddle Corp

Lifetime subscriber

#110576 14-Feb-2008 12:09

I've installed a couple of Signet systems and am actually writing a little bit about these in Part II of my blog post about home wiring which I should hopefully finish tonight.

I haven't played with any other systems apart from the Signet and Hills but they all seem to suffer from two basic problems with their entry level system. A lack of data jacks and the days of running Sky and a DVD player or VCR around your house using a modulated UHF signal are long gone so one of the big selling points of these systems is actually now obsolete. With people moving to large flat screen TV's you really need to start distributing component or HDMI video around your house and HDMI will be essential if you want HD since it's likely that the ICT flat will be used in NZ for HD transmissions. To distribute component or HDMI your best bet is to use baluns to send this over cat5e and HDMI requires dual cat5e which means you really need to look at a minimum or 4 RJ45 sockets next to every TV.

The cabinets they all have are very nice and Signet do sell their cabinets individually so you can just buy one of these and install a 24 port patch panel in it and one of their phone modules. This gives you a lot of room to add other equipment as needed.

cyril7

9058 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

Subscriber

#110579 14-Feb-2008 12:17

You are spot on with those points steve. A basic hills or signet flush box with a 24way patch panel mounted vertically on the side facig across the cavity with standoffs is a good compromise, that leaves the rest of the cavity for modems/routers, and coax splitters etc.

I see little sense in modern digital TV systems that preserve the component video aspect of broadcasts to the clarke belt and back and then reduce them down to 1950's composite to go 10meters through your home.

Cyril

jpwise

590 posts

Ultimate Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#110591 14-Feb-2008 12:56

I looked at similar options aswell, but for what I want I think I'm going to go with a hinged 4U patch panel, standard 19". Then use standard 19" Patches on it. It doesn't accomodate the TV distribution aswell, but you can always attach the amplifier/splitter to an adjacent wall and it's unlikely to be changed much from there. Plus it appears my cupboard can 'just' fit it. :)

So my current plan is along the lines of a 4U from:
http://www.cablemax.co.nz/Home/tabid/66/List/1/CategoryID/83/Level/a/Default.aspx

Then some patches. ie:
http://www.cablemax.co.nz/Home/tabid/66/List/1/CategoryID/129/Level/a/Default.aspx

You can buy them cheaper elsewhere, these were just links I had handy as examples.

Then it's all standard 19" stuff. If you look on Trademe or have friends in industry you can get ahold of old patches as they're removed and upgraded etc. I've already got 2 Cat5 patches there I was gifted a few years back that I'll probably use for Voice stuff, and I'll look at getting some decent Cat6 ones for gigabit ethernet. You can also use 19" switches and hubs with it keeping it nice and tidy.

Jp.

Working for Service Plus - www.serviceplus.co.nz

Authorised Service Agent for Apple, BenQ, Sony, and Toshiba - warranty & non-warranty repairs.

thekiwi

295 posts

Ultimate Geek

#111037 16-Feb-2008 21:23

cyril7: You are spot on with those points steve. A basic hills or signet flush box with a 24way patch panel mounted vertically on the side facig across the cavity with standoffs is a good compromise, that leaves the rest of the cavity for modems/routers, and coax splitters etc.

I see little sense in modern digital TV systems that preserve the component video aspect of broadcasts to the clarke belt and back and then reduce them down to 1950's composite to go 10meters through your home.

Cyril

Awesome ... this is exactly what Im doing at the moment with our new house. Phew. Signet 2000 box, with just the Phone Dist module and then my own 19inc patch panel self mounted into it. just got ti find a nice way ti actually fix it into the box. Actually had to get hold of them on how to wire it, but all good with two incoming lines. On that point, anyone know where one can get access to the Splitters typically used by Telecom installers? Would like to have one of those in before the line gets to the distribution module.

I'll post up some photos soon, as we have actually done appears to be suggested above.

* Ive got two centralised areas, one for the bedrooms, lounge etc. THis area is central to the house and under the stairs. Ive got a patch panel in there, switch and Media Centre Server
* The second point which will look after my office and servers, is based in the Garage. Again patchpanel, Signet flushbox, switch and ADLS router / servers
* Got a run from the Signet box to the kitchen for Phone as well as to the Patch panel for office. Also got a couple of runs from the Stirwell to the Garage for joining the two together.
* Every bedroom has 2 x Cat5e and 1 RG6 pulled back to stairwell
* Lounge has 4 Cat5e pulled back to stairwell
* Lounge also has ceiling speakers wired as well as inwall for 4 speakers. All bought of TradeME ... got a love TradeME :)

CYaBro

4586 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

#111050 16-Feb-2008 23:24

thekiwi: On that point, anyone know where one can get access to the Splitters typically used by Telecom installers? Would like to have one of those in before the line gets to the distribution module.

Do you mean one of these?
http://www.cdlnz.com/cdl.html?VS=p&G=ADSLMASTER&P=TEL&ID=5713820

Opinions are my own and not the views of my employer.

thekiwi

295 posts

Ultimate Geek

#111077 17-Feb-2008 07:03

CYaBro:
thekiwi: On that point, anyone know where one can get access to the Splitters typically used by Telecom installers? Would like to have one of those in before the line gets to the distribution module.

Do you mean one of these?
http://www.cdlnz.com/cdl.html?VS=p&G=ADSLMASTER&P=TEL&ID=5713820

Hmmm says its Telecom approved as well.
Can buy it online without having to get a Trade Account:
http://www.acquire.co.nz/acquire/default.asp?PageID=ProductDetail&pf_id=689902

But I thought what I needed was a Splitter, not a filter?
eg
http://www.marque-magnetics.co.nz/telcoproducts.htm

cyril7

9058 posts

Uber Geek

ID Verified

Trusted

Subscriber

#111084 17-Feb-2008 08:07

Signet make a pair of ears that carry a 1U patch panel, you may need to drill some holes in the rear of the box to mount it. It ends up that the patch panel sits at an angle, this is fine the patch leads will fit in fine with that arrangement.

The filter linked above is the one you want, there is only one, and thats its. Mastertrade, Coreys, Russels etc have them, you dont need an account with any of them but they will charge full price over the counter (around $70) trade is around $45-50. There is no real such thing as a splitter, there is simply a filter that all pots devices must connect via, the ADSL modem connects directly to the inbound line. When you get a splitter with a BT phone outlet and RJ11 modem outlet, the BT is via the filter, the RJ11 is infact just the input line.

I recommend that you mount a BT 2Wire socket in the Signet box, the inbound line wires to that, also wire to that the filter, and the output of filter wires to the phone distribution panel or alternatevly directly to 2or3 spare jacks on the patch panel and forget the phone distribution panel. The DSL modem plugs into the BT.

Cyril

1 | 2 | 3 | 4