Changes to DLM Incoming

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885 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1907941 26-Nov-2017 12:07

After dDLM my sync rates eventually settled at 70/17 and stayed there. Then last week I checked my rates and saw...

> vdsl status
---------------------- ATU-R Info (hw: annex A, f/w: annex A/B/C) -----------
Running Mode : 17A State : SHOWTIME
DS Actual Rate : 70015000 bps US Actual Rate : 25065000 bps
DS Attainable Rate : 80103480 bps US Attainable Rate : 25240000 bps
DS Path Mode : Interleave US Path Mode : Interleave
DS Interleave Depth : 300 US Interleave Depth : 739
NE Current Attenuation : 11 dB Cur SNR Margin : 8 dB
DS actual PSD : -3.-2 dB US actual PSD : 14. 5 dB
NE CRC Count : 1 FE CRC Count : 1721
NE ES Count : 1 FE ES Count : 773
Xdsl Reset Times : 0 Xdsl Link Times : 1
ITU Version[0] : b5004946 ITU Version[1] : 544e0000
VDSL Firmware Version : 05-07-06-0D-01-07 [with Vectoring support]
Power Management Mode : DSL_G997_PMS_L0
Test Mode : DISABLE
-------------------------------- ATU-C Info ---------------------------------
Far Current Attenuation : 13 dB Far SNR Margin : 5 dB
CO ITU Version[0] : b500494b CO ITU Version[1] : 4e530101
DSLAM CHIPSET VENDOR : < IKNS >

Cool!

Then yesterday a Chorus guy came to fix a fault with one of my neighbours, and for some reason needed to dig around in the termination box outside my house. No change yesterday, but this morning:

> vdsl status
---------------------- ATU-R Info (hw: annex A, f/w: annex A/B/C) -----------
Running Mode : 17A State : SHOWTIME
DS Actual Rate : 70015000 bps US Actual Rate : 29970000 bps
DS Attainable Rate : 84394984 bps US Attainable Rate : 30264000 bps
DS Path Mode : Interleave US Path Mode : Interleave
DS Interleave Depth : 279 US Interleave Depth : 883
NE Current Attenuation : 11 dB Cur SNR Margin : 10 dB
DS actual PSD : -2.-6 dB US actual PSD : 14. 5 dB
NE CRC Count : 1 FE CRC Count : 1893
NE ES Count : 1 FE ES Count : 848
Xdsl Reset Times : 0 Xdsl Link Times : 2
ITU Version[0] : b5004946 ITU Version[1] : 544e0000
VDSL Firmware Version : 05-07-06-0D-01-07 [with Vectoring support]
Power Management Mode : DSL_G997_PMS_L0
Test Mode : DISABLE
-------------------------------- ATU-C Info ---------------------------------
Far Current Attenuation : 13 dB Far SNR Margin : 6 dB
CO ITU Version[0] : b500494b CO ITU Version[1] : 4e530101
DSLAM CHIPSET VENDOR : < IKNS >

Officially maxed out!

Finally, reposting my original pre-dDLM line stats from earlier in the thread for a direct comparison:

> vdsl status
---------------------- ATU-R Info (hw: annex A, f/w: annex A/B/C) -----------
   Running Mode            :       8B       State                : SHOWTIME
   DS Actual Rate          : 51342000 bps   US Actual Rate       : 7762000 bps
   DS Attainable Rate      : 47823368 bps   US Attainable Rate   : 7432000 bps
   DS Path Mode            :        Fast    US Path Mode         :        Fast
   DS Interleave Depth     :        1       US Interleave Depth :        1
   NE Current Attenuation :        8 dB    Cur SNR Margin       :        7 dB
   DS actual PSD           :   -16.-4 dB    US actual PSD        :    14. 8 dB
   NE CRC Count            :       52       FE CRC Count         :      185
   NE ES Count             :       21       FE ES Count         :      181
   Xdsl Reset Times        :        0       Xdsl Link Times     :        2
   ITU Version[0]          : b5004946       ITU Version[1]       : 544e0000
   VDSL Firmware Version   : 05-07-06-0D-01-07   [with Vectoring support]
   Power Management Mode   : DSL_G997_PMS_L0
   Test Mode               : DISABLE
-------------------------------- ATU-C Info ---------------------------------
   Far Current Attenuation :        9 dB    Far SNR Margin       :        7 dB
   CO ITU Version[0]       : b500494b       CO ITU Version[1]    : 4e530101
   DSLAM CHIPSET VENDOR    : < IKNS >

All I can complain about is my interleaving, which got heftier with every speed bump. However I hardly play games anymore so this is more than a worthwhile trade. Well done Chorus - for those of us left waiting another two years for UFB this is a meaningful improvement to my quality of life!

allio

885 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1911408 1-Dec-2017 07:25

So turns out they had a bit more digging around to do before they packed up and left. And now I've got:

> vdsl status
---------------------- ATU-R Info (hw: annex A, f/w: annex A/B/C) -----------
Running Mode : 17A State : SHOWTIME
DS Actual Rate : 67471000 bps US Actual Rate : 5324000 bps
DS Attainable Rate : 67654472 bps US Attainable Rate : 5672000 bps
DS Path Mode : Interleave US Path Mode : Interleave
DS Interleave Depth : 284 US Interleave Depth : 157
NE Current Attenuation : 11 dB Cur SNR Margin : 6 dB
DS actual PSD : -8.-5 dB US actual PSD : 14. 5 dB
NE CRC Count : 1 FE CRC Count : 2129
NE ES Count : 1 FE ES Count : 1059
Xdsl Reset Times : 0 Xdsl Link Times : 1
ITU Version[0] : b5004946 ITU Version[1] : 544e0000
VDSL Firmware Version : 05-07-06-0D-01-07 [with Vectoring support]
Power Management Mode : DSL_G997_PMS_L0
Test Mode : DISABLE
-------------------------------- ATU-C Info ---------------------------------
Far Current Attenuation : 13 dB Far SNR Margin : 11 dB
CO ITU Version[0] : b500494b CO ITU Version[1] : 4e530101
DSLAM CHIPSET VENDOR : < IKNS >

From 70/25 before they came on to my property, to 67/5 after they left.

What can I do here? I lodged a ticket with Bigpipe, who replied saying 5mbps was acceptable and Chorus would reject a request to come back and fix it.

The unexpected speed boosts are the fun part of VDSL, but this really sucks. Your speed can drop to 1/6th of it was overnight and it's apparently completely acceptable.

smalltrader

174 posts

Master Geek

#1911413 1-Dec-2017 08:00

allio:

So turns out they had a bit more digging around to do before they packed up and left. And now I've got:

> vdsl status
---------------------- ATU-R Info (hw: annex A, f/w: annex A/B/C) -----------
Running Mode : 17A State : SHOWTIME
DS Actual Rate : 67471000 bps US Actual Rate : 5324000 bps
DS Attainable Rate : 67654472 bps US Attainable Rate : 5672000 bps
DS Path Mode : Interleave US Path Mode : Interleave
DS Interleave Depth : 284 US Interleave Depth : 157
NE Current Attenuation : 11 dB Cur SNR Margin : 6 dB
DS actual PSD : -8.-5 dB US actual PSD : 14. 5 dB
NE CRC Count : 1 FE CRC Count : 2129
NE ES Count : 1 FE ES Count : 1059
Xdsl Reset Times : 0 Xdsl Link Times : 1
ITU Version[0] : b5004946 ITU Version[1] : 544e0000
VDSL Firmware Version : 05-07-06-0D-01-07 [with Vectoring support]
Power Management Mode : DSL_G997_PMS_L0
Test Mode : DISABLE
-------------------------------- ATU-C Info ---------------------------------
Far Current Attenuation : 13 dB Far SNR Margin : 11 dB
CO ITU Version[0] : b500494b CO ITU Version[1] : 4e530101
DSLAM CHIPSET VENDOR : < IKNS >

From 70/25 before they came on to my property, to 67/5 after they left.

What can I do here? I lodged a ticket with Bigpipe, who replied saying 5mbps was acceptable and Chorus would reject a request to come back and fix it.

The unexpected speed boosts are the fun part of VDSL, but this really sucks. Your speed can drop to 1/6th of it was overnight and it's apparently completely acceptable.

Copper technology is inherently much more variable than Fibre technology. Yes. Chorus could well argue that it is is within "operating parameters". A sympathetic RSP may push your case on your behalf but you may be hit with a hefty No Fault Found Fees.

In September this year, my VDSL download speed drops from mid 50 to 27. Logged a case with Spark and they can see my historical speed was in the 50 and accepted that that was likely to be a fault somewhere. So I guess it depends on whether your RSP looks at the historical record and how severe the drop is.

xpd

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#1911415 1-Dec-2017 08:05

Looks like mine isn't budging anymore after sitting on 60/30 for quite a while but then dropping to 49/16......

============================================================================
VDSL Training Status: Showtime
Mode: VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL Profile: Profile 17a
G.Vector: Disable
Traffic Type: PTM Mode
Link Uptime: 7 days: 9 hours: 25 minutes
============================================================================
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Line Rate: 16.497 Mbps 49.213 Mbps
Actual Net Data Rate: 16.411 Mbps 49.137 Mbps
Trellis Coding: ON ON
SNR Margin: 4.7 dB 6.4 dB
Actual Delay: 8 ms 8 ms
Transmit Power: 6.3 dBm 14.5 dBm
Receive Power: -26.5 dBm -10.4 dBm
Actual INP: 0.5 symbols 0.0 symbols
Total Attenuation: 32.8 dB 24.9 dB
Attainable Net Data Rate: 15.088 Mbps 49.362 Mbps
============================================================================
VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 D1 D2 D3
Line Attenuation(dB): 43.0 26.4 33.5 N/A 23.7 28.6 40.4
Signal Attenuation(dB): 43.4 26.2 33.3 N/A 23.4 28.4 40.4
SNR Margin(dB): 4.5 5.0 4.7 N/A 6.1 6.4 6.5
Transmit Power(dBm):-11.9 - 9.0 6.1 N/A 12.5 7.5 6.8
============================================================================

Gavin / xpd / FastRaccoon / Geek of Coastguard New Zealand

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allio

885 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1911428 1-Dec-2017 08:37

smalltrader:

Copper technology is inherently much more variable than Fibre technology. Yes. Chorus could well argue that it is is within "operating parameters". A sympathetic RSP may push your case on your behalf but you may be hit with a hefty No Fault Found Fees.

In September this year, my VDSL download speed drops from mid 50 to 27. Logged a case with Spark and they can see my historical speed was in the 50 and accepted that that was likely to be a fault somewhere. So I guess it depends on whether your RSP looks at the historical record and how severe the drop is.

My upload speed has been 17mbps since dDLM came in in April and my line switched to 17a. It boosted again to 25mbps a few weeks ago after my SNR improved, and then to 30mbps last week after another improvement. That's at the least a 2/3 drop, which seems pretty severe to me.

Unfortunately from Bigpipe's response to my ticket, it seems like download speeds are treated more seriously than upload, and I haven't had a big drop in that. As it happens upload speeds are much more important to me.

Isn't 67/5 a weird/lopsided enough sync that it would ring some alarm bells? As would the fact that it happened after Chorus came and dug around in my termination box (and there are now wires sticking out of it that weren't there before)?

This sucks :(

smalltrader

174 posts

Master Geek

#1911433 1-Dec-2017 08:51

allio:

smalltrader:

Copper technology is inherently much more variable than Fibre technology. Yes. Chorus could well argue that it is is within "operating parameters". A sympathetic RSP may push your case on your behalf but you may be hit with a hefty No Fault Found Fees.

In September this year, my VDSL download speed drops from mid 50 to 27. Logged a case with Spark and they can see my historical speed was in the 50 and accepted that that was likely to be a fault somewhere. So I guess it depends on whether your RSP looks at the historical record and how severe the drop is.

My upload speed has been 17mbps since dDLM came in in April and my line switched to 17a. It boosted again to 25mbps last week. That's at the least a 2/3 drop, which seems pretty severe to me.

Unfortunately from Bigpipe's response to my ticket, it seems like download speeds are treated more seriously than upload, and I haven't had a big drop in that. As it happens upload speeds are much more important to me.

Isn't 67/5 a weird/lopsided enough sync that it would ring some alarm bells? As would the fact that it happened after Chorus came and dug around in my termination box (and there are now wires sticking out of it that weren't there before)?

This sucks :(

67/5 is definitely weird. I am currently on 62/20 for nearly a month now with the good weather. I wonder a sympathetic RSP helpdesk personnel might champion your cause. Suspect it has something to do with Chorus digging around the neighborhood as you have said and affected your line.

hio77

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#1911450 1-Dec-2017 09:17

I'd log that one if you contacted me as an agent.

Disclosure would be highly likely. But end of the day that's a large drop. Your margins are still low.

One thing i would caution is please triple check isolation tests first. Upstream is typically internal.

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allio

885 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1911731 1-Dec-2017 15:51

hio77: I'd log that one if you contacted me as an agent.

Disclosure would be highly likely. But end of the day that's a large drop. Your margins are still low.

One thing i would caution is please triple check isolation tests first. Upstream is typically internal.

Thanks hio. I'll replug everything and clean the contacts on the cable to be sure. I only have a single connected jackpoint so there's not a lot of other testing I can do. If that doesn't change anything I will try begging the Bigpipe CSR to send it through to Chorus.

The upstream is running at 10 SNR so there's room for it to improve a bit as DLM reoptimises the line, but there's clearly been a significant decrease in absolute line quality. If the downstream hadn't been maxed out (attainable was 84-87 mbit) I'm sure it would have seen a similar drop to the upstream.

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#1920286 15-Dec-2017 16:19

Crowdsourcing time, i need a few test cases.

hopefully before about 6pm today... Looking for Spark connections which have had what you suspect to be ddDLM changes (eg snr adjustments) over the last month period.

Trying to run through some statistical analysis that doesn't have the messy line fault situations in it - Easier to look here than deep dives!

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Tracer

343 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1920600 16-Dec-2017 16:26

Sadly don't have old numbers. :(

-e- MyRepublic

> vdsl status
vdsl status
---------------------- ATU-R Info (hw: annex A, f/w: annex A/B/C) -----------
Running Mode : 17A State : SHOWTIME
DS Actual Rate : 90768000 bps US Actual Rate : 43176000 bps
DS Attainable Rate : 90819200 bps US Attainable Rate : 43178000 bps
DS Path Mode : Fast US Path Mode : Fast
DS Interleave Depth : 0 US Interleave Depth : 0
NE Current Attenuation : 15 dB Cur SNR Margin : 5 dB
DS actual PSD : 6. 6 dB US actual PSD : 14. 5 dB
NE CRC Count : 0 FE CRC Count : 0
NE ES Count : 0 FE ES Count : 0
Xdsl Reset Times : 0 Xdsl Link Times : 1
ITU Version[0] : b5004946 ITU Version[1] : 544e0000
VDSL Firmware Version : 05-04-08-00-00-06
Power Management Mode : DSL_G997_PMS_L0
Test Mode : DISABLE
-------------------------------- ATU-C Info ---------------------------------
Far Current Attenuation : 0 dB Far SNR Margin : 5 dB
CO ITU Version[0] : b5004244 CO ITU Version[1] : 434db1ad
DSLAM CHIPSET VENDOR : < BDCM >

freakngeek

356 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1920603 16-Dec-2017 16:46

Tracer:

Sadly don't have old numbers. :(

-e- MyRepublic

What version Firmware you running ?
Don't think you have Vectoring supported Firmware
It should say this under firmware version
'VDSL Firmware Version : 05-07-06-0D-01-07 [with Vectoring support]'
This is from latest FW 3.8.1.2 modem 4

When vectoring comes in (supposedly shortly) you'll be all set to take advantage

Tracer

343 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1920607 16-Dec-2017 17:11

freakngeek:

Tracer:

Sadly don't have old numbers. :(

-e- MyRepublic

What version Firmware you running ?
Don't think you have Vectoring supported Firmware
It should say this under firmware version
'VDSL Firmware Version : 05-07-06-0D-01-07 [with Vectoring support]'
This is from latest FW 3.8.1.2 modem 4

When vectoring comes in (supposedly shortly) you'll be all set to take advantage

Thanks! So modem4 is the version to use? I currently have 3.8.1.2 but probably STD I think.

Tracer

343 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1920608 16-Dec-2017 17:16

Flashed and all is well. Thanks again. :)

> vdsl status
vdsl status
---------------------- ATU-R Info (hw: annex A, f/w: annex A/B/C) -----------
Running Mode : 17A State : SHOWTIME
DS Actual Rate : 94465000 bps US Actual Rate : 42194000 bps
DS Attainable Rate : 94471512 bps US Attainable Rate : 42195000 bps
DS Path Mode : Interleave US Path Mode : Fast
DS Interleave Depth : 199 US Interleave Depth : 13
NE Current Attenuation : 16 dB Cur SNR Margin : 6 dB
DS actual PSD : 6. 6 dB US actual PSD : 14. 5 dB
NE CRC Count : 0 FE CRC Count : 312576
NE ES Count : 0 FE ES Count : 25642
Xdsl Reset Times : 0 Xdsl Link Times : 1
ITU Version[0] : b5004946 ITU Version[1] : 544e0000
VDSL Firmware Version : 05-07-06-0D-01-07 [with Vectoring support]
Power Management Mode : DSL_G997_PMS_L0
Test Mode : DISABLE
-------------------------------- ATU-C Info ---------------------------------
Far Current Attenuation : 17 dB Far SNR Margin : 5 dB
CO ITU Version[0] : b5004244 CO ITU Version[1] : 434db1ad
DSLAM CHIPSET VENDOR : < BDCM >

freakngeek

356 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1920619 16-Dec-2017 18:03

STD FW doesn't show any details of your connection and also doesn't support vectoring
In your status now there are more details of your connection, did find it odd that you had no Attenuation
MDM4 is for NZ, others work too, but 4 seems to work best.

AidanP

76 posts

Master Geek

#1922993 21-Dec-2017 10:18

Anyone from slingshot that can take a look at my line? I have noticed my speeds getting gradually worse and my error getting higher, after about 2 months of being stable at around 70mbps downstream the last couple of weeks my line has been getting more and more CRC errors.

Here are modem stats from 2 days ago

Here are my stats from today

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