Tivo CGA Claim October 2017

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#1746606 23-Mar-2017 20:28

tdgeek:

You have told all of us what your due on this issues, now your still working it out?

From what I recall of those days, you will get dealt with by Spark or referred to Hybrid, depending if the issue was the box or the service. Its a two piece arrangement, packaged into one for you, the customer, but its still two piece. Yes, you call one 0800, convenient, but still two piece.

Fisrtly I dont know why you think i am obligated to move at your speed on this issue. It is entirely my issue and I will choose what to do and when I want to do it. I have posted earleir on some scenarios.

And after 26 pages its time for me to call for evidence from you. Please point to where it is very clearly a two piece arrangement. Point to where I have agreed to those two pieces with Terms and conditions agreed at the time the contract was formed.

As far as I am concerned when I look at the terms of tivo media device use I think I can see at least 6 pieces - and I have already pointed out what licences are required and where.

Handle9

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#1746607 23-Mar-2017 20:28

minimoke:

quickymart:

Handle9: If the OP is so convinced what is the holdup with taking action? I'm confused why this has gone on for 26 pages.

I'd like to know too. Nothing stopping him taking action right now.

It has gone on for 26 pages because people are asserting without evidence there is this mysical Tivo Service Licence that I have bought for free and there are terms and conditons attahced to it whcih I agreed to when I bought this licence which I didnt actually buy because it was provided with the device or maybe it was provided after I got the device and agreed to some other terms wich wernt provided by the seller of the media device and isnt represented in the screen that says its a life time when its five years or maybe its as long as hybrid thinks but telecom has no idea. It is so no wonder I am left confused

You're going to get lots of opinions either way but after this number of replys why bother arguing with everyone? Either get on with taking action or move on. You're not going to get a consensus opinion here so just do whatever you want to do.

MikeB4

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#1746609 23-Mar-2017 20:35

when you activated your TiVo Services you did so knowing that the terms and conditions of the service apply. Those T & Cs are detailed on the page immediately following the big "Welcome" page in the TiVo book that came with your TiVo. It is not Sparks, Hybrids fault if you did not read the T&Cs

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

minimoke

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#1746610 23-Mar-2017 20:38

tdgeek:

I don't see how its buried in the T+C's. No one buys a product and gets furnished a hard copy of T+C;s to sign, but they are freely available on the website of any company that you purchase from.

I have never been furnished any T+C's on any product prior to purchase. Landline, broadband, phone, iron and so on.

This is the subject of another thread. But it is really the most basic of all consumer law which is taught in high school. A contract (which may be verbal or in writing) requires an offer, it requires acceptance and it requires consideration. All terms and conditions relating to that contract must be sorted at the time the contract is formed.

Fine print is frowned upon, terms and conditions bought up after the contract are not enforceable. Advertising cannot be misleading and any tricky terms need to be spelt out in the advertisement.

If people cannot, will not or are unable to get their heads around this most simple of concepts then clearly anything to do with the CGA is going to be difficult.

minimoke

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#1746658 23-Mar-2017 20:53

MikeB4:

when you activated your TiVo Services you did so knowing that the terms and conditions of the service apply. Those T & Cs are detailed on the page immediately following the big "Welcome" page in the TiVo book that came with your TiVo. It is not Sparks, Hybrids fault if you did not read the T&Cs

This thing you refer to is the Terms of Use of Tivo Media Device and Tivo Service.

gregmcc

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#1746659 23-Mar-2017 20:55

tdgeek:

gregmcc:

Jaxson:

Telecom doesn't provide the service. They can't be held responsible for the license holder opting not to renew 5 years later. Good luck.

The law says otherwise - CGA. If Telecom didn't pay attention to the fine print from their supplier it doesn't give them a get out of jail free card for their legal responsibilities.

What are the legal responsibilities? To provide a working Tivo box and Hybrids service for how long? 5 years appears to be the line in the sand. The Tivo box is an 8yo device. It will have services most users for 8 years, CGA appears to have a 5 year guide, so on 1 Nov that is covered. 5 years isn't the line in the sad for everything, but Hybrid have settled on that, and not as a guess you would imagine. If CGA felt that 5 years was acceptable for the box and the service, what then?

"product lifetime service", Hybrid are long gone so I doubt you have read anything official recently from them (Prove me wrong and show me a recent official comment/statement)

If a Tivo box had suffered a natural hardware failure then that would meet the end of "product lifetime service", the hardware is still fully functional as has been pointed out many, many times - this is a service issue

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gregmcc

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#1746661 23-Mar-2017 20:59

MikeB4:

when you activated your TiVo Services you did so knowing that the terms and conditions of the service apply. Those T & Cs are detailed on the page immediately following the big "Welcome" page in the TiVo book that came with your TiVo. It is not Sparks, Hybrids fault if you did not read the T&Cs

And those T&C's also mention a product lifetime service, thanks for reminding me.

MikeB4

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#1746674 23-Mar-2017 21:10

minimoke:

MikeB4:

when you activated your TiVo Services you did so knowing that the terms and conditions of the service apply. Those T & Cs are detailed on the page immediately following the big "Welcome" page in the TiVo book that came with your TiVo. It is not Sparks, Hybrids fault if you did not read the T&Cs

This thing you refer to is the Terms of Use of Tivo Media Device and Tivo Service.

Incorrect, it covers the service and it says so starting on the 4th line of the document, it also states there that when you activate your device you are required to agree to the terms of service.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

MikeB4

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#1746675 23-Mar-2017 21:10

gregmcc:

MikeB4:

when you activated your TiVo Services you did so knowing that the terms and conditions of the service apply. Those T & Cs are detailed on the page immediately following the big "Welcome" page in the TiVo book that came with your TiVo. It is not Sparks, Hybrids fault if you did not read the T&Cs

And those T&C's also mention a product lifetime service, thanks for reminding me.

Not that I can see

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

minimoke

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#1746678 23-Mar-2017 21:16

gregmcc:

"product lifetime service", Hybrid are long gone so I doubt you have read anything official recently from them (Prove me wrong and show me a recent official comment/statement)

For a start I will point you to the terms of use that were last updated 1 march 2017. see here:https://www.mytivo.co.nz/abouttivo/termsandconditions/termsofuse/

minimoke

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#1746680 23-Mar-2017 21:19

MikeB4:

Incorrect, it covers the service and it says so starting on the 4th line of the document, it also states there that when you activate your device you are required to agree to the terms of service.

Actually it is about activating the service which suggests it has already been supplied. This is what it says at line 2"" These Terms govern your use of any TiVo® media device or other associated TiVo equipment, including your activation and use of the TiVo service". It say nothing about buying or licencing or supplying. The supply is already there - it just needs activating. A bit like buying a car - but it wont work until you are handed the keys.

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gregmcc

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#1746681 23-Mar-2017 21:20

minimoke:

gregmcc:

"product lifetime service", Hybrid are long gone so I doubt you have read anything official recently from them (Prove me wrong and show me a recent official comment/statement)

For a start I will point you to the terms of use that were last updated 1 march 2017. see here:https://www.mytivo.co.nz/abouttivo/termsandconditions/termsofuse/

And the CGA also states that by changing the T&C's after purchase amounts to a new contract, as such I reject the new contract, refund please

minimoke

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#1746683 23-Mar-2017 21:22

gregmcc:

MikeB4:

when you activated your TiVo Services you did so knowing that the terms and conditions of the service apply. Those T & Cs are detailed on the page immediately following the big "Welcome" page in the TiVo book that came with your TiVo. It is not Sparks, Hybrids fault if you did not read the T&Cs

And those T&C's also mention a product lifetime service, thanks for reminding me.

You can probably tell I'm not very tech savy. But I do know how to use Ctrl F, stick the word "lifetime" in and see how many hits I get. How many did I get. Zero.

I think we can put this post down to a Trumpesk attempt at misinformaiton

tdgeek

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#1746692 23-Mar-2017 21:49

minimoke:

tdgeek:

I don't see how its buried in the T+C's. No one buys a product and gets furnished a hard copy of T+C;s to sign, but they are freely available on the website of any company that you purchase from.

I have never been furnished any T+C's on any product prior to purchase. Landline, broadband, phone, iron and so on.

This is the subject of another thread. But it is really the most basic of all consumer law which is taught in high school. A contract (which may be verbal or in writing) requires an offer, it requires acceptance and it requires consideration. All terms and conditions relating to that contract must be sorted at the time the contract is formed.

Fine print is frowned upon, terms and conditions bought up after the contract are not enforceable. Advertising cannot be misleading and any tricky terms need to be spelt out in the advertisement.

If people cannot, will not or are unable to get their heads around this most simple of concepts then clearly anything to do with the CGA is going to be difficult.

I think the correct term is unenforceable. I have heard of Contract Law thanks. You agreed to the Telecom T+C's when you accepted the purchase, which was offered to you, for a consideration, and you accepted. You did not receive a hard copy of the T+C as you are deemed to have accepted them when you accepted the offer. As in order the Tivo.

T+C small print is not frowned upon, what I gather is frowned upon is misleading and confusing T+C's. Telecom is a big company, it has its own legal team, you would expect they would ensure that the T+C's are acceptable.

What I bolded. Are you serious?? I guess you are. Well,go for gold, and ignore what everyone apart from you and Greg have said. The basis of a simple contract, and what you determine is a small print conspiracy theory, is not what the CGA is about. IMHO I am sure that the CGA will determine there is a written contract here, that is no issue. The terms are quite clear. As have been posted here a few times.

minimoke

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#1746695 23-Mar-2017 21:57

gregmcc:

And those T&C's also mention a product lifetime service, thanks for reminding me.

Here is what happens happens. You agree to the terms of use and your device is activated and your account is updated with a Life Time Service. Even today my account shows a life time service.

Also when you activate your device you get other stuff other than a tivo service such as Broadband games including: Sudoku Wild Pair. Same Game. Wordsmith. Skull & Bones:. World clock and . Pixeleyes service - access to your Picasa or Photobucket online photos. Hybrid are only turning off the Tivo service - no mention of these things - nor the features in the Home Networking Package. Argue as you may, I should be able to get my great broadband games for as long as I have broadband.

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