Incandescent Downlights to LED

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scottr

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#230672 7-Mar-2018 22:36

Hey all, I'm looking to replace a bunch of ~20 year old downlights with LED downlights. This will be a full housing replacement, not just switching out to LED bulbs.

Most of the house's bulbs have been replaced with CFL other than the lounge which is on a dimmer switch. In the lounge I've got an array of 6 downlights with 100w bulbs which have the level of brightness I'm happy with. Apparently 100w bulbs sit around 1300-1600 lumens however most of the LED downlights I've seen seem to hit 900-1000 lumens at best. These are apparently 100w equivalents although I'm not convinced as I've had a poor experience with CFL 100w equivalents in the past.

Keen to hear anyone's experience of going from 100w downlights to led downlights, what the lumen output was of the LEDs they'd replaced them with, and how the brightness compared with the 100w incandescent bulbs.

Thanks in advance!

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#1970940 7-Mar-2018 23:03

If you have normal shaped lamps in a downlight than a lot of the light is going up into the roof so you are probably going to see an increse in light output. I did see a signifigant one going from 100w incandesents in downlights to 20w LED ones.

Richard rich.ms

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scottr

261 posts

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#1970942 7-Mar-2018 23:21

Great, thanks for the reply. I've looked at 20w leds which seem to have 1600+ lumens. These are fairly expensive and i'll need to cut bigger holes in the roof to accommodate (current hole size is ~120mm). Will go to them if I need to though as I'm not a fan of dim rooms.

I've got normal shaped bulbs in the downlights, although the top of the housing has a reflective dome. agree that i'm still losing light as it does escape up into the roof through the gaps.

mattwnz

19378 posts

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#1970954 8-Mar-2018 00:09

scottr:
Apparently 100w bulbs sit around 1300-1600 lumens however most of the LED downlights I've seen seem to hit 900-1000 lumens at best. These are apparently 100w equivalents although I'm not convinced as I've had a poor experience with CFL 100w equivalents in the past.

Not sure where you have been looking, but there have been B22 and E27 LEDs with 1400 lumens for quite some time. Here is one for example that you can just buy at a supermarket https://shop.countdown.co.nz/Shop/ProductDetails?stockcode=420503&name=philips-bayonet-light-bulb-led-13w-1400-lumen-warm&searchString=philips%20light%20bulb

Very few of the inbuilt ones I have seen are that powerful. Also I wouldn't bother comparing the power with CFL, as they thrown the light all over teh place, whereas LED, most will go down. I have never used a 1400lm bulb, my most powerful one is 1000lm, but I have found that is more powerful than 100watt incandescent ones I have used.

scottr

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#1970960 8-Mar-2018 00:16

Hi, yup have seen the 1400lumen e27 led's (have a couple in the garage and agree they kick out a fair amount of light).

It's the downlight unit's i'm after as i'll need to replace my dimmer to something that can handle LEDs. My concern is I want avoid a potential situation in the future where someone puts in 100w bulbs without realising the dimmer's not designed for those bulbs or that load (most modern LED dimmers seem to go to 450w max and the array currently runs 600w on a 1000w dimmer).

mattwnz

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#1970961 8-Mar-2018 00:26

scottr: Hi, yup have seen the 1400lumen e27 led's (have a couple in the garage and agree they kick out a fair amount of light).

It's the downlight unit's i'm after as i'll need to replace my dimmer to something that can handle LEDs. My concern is I want avoid a potential situation in the future where someone puts in 100w bulbs without realising the dimmer's not designed for those bulbs or that load (most modern LED dimmers seem to go to 450w max and the array currently runs 600w on a 1000w dimmer).

As Labour is now in government, it probably won't be long before incandesents of that type are banned. They were going to bring in that legislation last time before national got back in. So you may not be able to buy normal B22 and E27 incandescents in the distant future, and they have been phased out in other countries. So if that happens that may solve that problem. I supposed you could also put a warning label on the light fitting to only use LEDs in the fitting.

timmmay

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#1971003 8-Mar-2018 07:06

I have Ledlux downlights from Lighting Direct in my bathroom, non-dimmable. I like them. They're about 1/4 the price I paid now.

I have larger Lons downlights from Lighting plus in my office. I don't like them as much. They're meant to be dimmable but none of the dimmers work properly with them. If you want dimmable make sure you a brand where they supply the light, driver, and dimmer. Even then test one yourself first. I wouldn't get the larger ones again, much smaller range so more difficult to replace in future.

Make sure you get downlights rated for insulation covering them.

shk292

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#1971025 8-Mar-2018 08:48

I replaced a lot of the standard downlight fittings in my house with these LED units: http://www.switch-lighting.co.nz/product/e-lightz/

They were quite expensive (~ 4 years ago), but give more and nicer light than the mix of 75w reflectors and CFLs they replaced. They also eliminate the "chimney effect" draughts, and are dimmable.

kryptonjohn

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#1971080 8-Mar-2018 10:36

We put nondescript LED downlights from LD all through our house. Somehow we ended up majorly over-ordered and had about 20 left over. We sent them back and they happily refunded them at the purchase price, despite the fact that the price had halved since they were purchased!

Happy with the lights other than they don't dim down to zero - they only dim to about 50%. They completely seal the hole in the ceiling and can have insulation laid on tiop, unlike halogens which have a massive draughty gap around them and will overheat if there's insulation on them.

Similar to these:

https://www.lightingdirect.co.nz/shop/Downlight+Lights/LED+Downlights/LEDlux+INFINITY+MINI+1+DIM+700LM+WW+ROUND+WHITE/x_sku/16476.html

1cloud

138 posts

Master Geek

#1971095 8-Mar-2018 10:46

scottr: Hey all, I'm looking to replace a bunch of ~20 year old downlights with LED downlights. This will be a full housing replacement, not just switching out to LED bulbs.

Most of the house's bulbs have been replaced with CFL other than the lounge which is on a dimmer switch. In the lounge I've got an array of 6 downlights with 100w bulbs which have the level of brightness I'm happy with. Apparently 100w bulbs sit around 1300-1600 lumens however most of the LED downlights I've seen seem to hit 900-1000 lumens at best. These are apparently 100w equivalents although I'm not convinced as I've had a poor experience with CFL 100w equivalents in the past.

Keen to hear anyone's experience of going from 100w downlights to led downlights, what the lumen output was of the LEDs they'd replaced them with, and how the brightness compared with the 100w incandescent bulbs.

Thanks in advance!

I have recent replaced 4 in lounge and 6 across the kitchen and dinning.

https://www.bunnings.co.nz/hpm-10w-90mm-white-led-downlight-kit_p00282190

they are brilliant, was going to install 8 across kitchen and dinning and builder said 6 are good enough.

BlueShift

1688 posts

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#1971135 8-Mar-2018 11:53

We're just about finished replacing all the incandescent downlights in our place with Lons from Lighting Direct. They are the same same size as the existing holes, and take literally 5 minutes to swap out and pop in. the first ones we install in our lounge nearly two years ago and they are still strong and bright. They give far more light than the 100W bulbs that were in there previously and use about 10% of the power. For less than $20 per light including driver when on sale, its been a no-brainer.

Next is replacing the halogens in the kitchen, that's trickier as the holes are a different size, so I need to do some drilling, and also crawl into the roofspace to remove the transformers and connect them up.

kryptonjohn

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#1971139 8-Mar-2018 12:00

BlueShift:

We're just about finished replacing all the incandescent downlights in our place with Lons from Lighting Direct. They are the same same size as the existing holes, and take literally 5 minutes to swap out and pop in. the first ones we install in our lounge nearly two years ago and they are still strong and bright. They give far more light than the 100W bulbs that were in there previously and use about 10% of the power. For less than $20 per light including driver when on sale, its been a no-brainer.

Next is replacing the halogens in the kitchen, that's trickier as the holes are a different size, so I need to do some drilling, and also crawl into the roofspace to remove the transformers and connect them up.

That's a bugger if you can't just pull the transformers out the hole the light was in!

Fred99

13684 posts

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#1971203 8-Mar-2018 13:20

kryptonjohn:

We put nondescript LED downlights from LD all through our house. Somehow we ended up majorly over-ordered and had about 20 left over. We sent them back and they happily refunded them at the purchase price, despite the fact that the price had halved since they were purchased!

Happy with the lights other than they don't dim down to zero - they only dim to about 50%. They completely seal the hole in the ceiling and can have insulation laid on tiop, unlike halogens which have a massive draughty gap around them and will overheat if there's insulation on them.

Similar to these:

https://www.lightingdirect.co.nz/shop/Downlight+Lights/LED+Downlights/LEDlux+INFINITY+MINI+1+DIM+700LM+WW+ROUND+WHITE/x_sku/16476.html

Not sure if perhaps they supplied LEDLux dimmers to go with the LEDLux lights.

If so, then there's an adjustment on the side of the clipsal type dimmer insert which can be used to set minimum brightness. Unfortunately it's only accessible by removing the faceplate from the flush box to get in behind, so if isolating the circuit as I expect one should do, it's trial and error to find the right setting. IIRC it's a clockwise turn for brighter minimum setting.

On minimum setting with this dimmer, where I've got several same type LEDs on the circuit, there's enough variation between the LEDs so that at minimum, some glow dimly - and others not at all. I adjusted them up a little from that setting, so that at minimum they're all glowing evenly but as dimly as possible.

mattwnz

19378 posts

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#1971212 8-Mar-2018 13:36

The OP may also be interested in these ones, which our electrican suggested to me. They they have some powerful ones, which aren't always available in standard lighting stores. They also do tiltable ones. The other thing you want to consider is the beam angle. Some go 120 degrees, while others are 60 degrees, so you end up with a more focused light https://www.halcyonlights.co.nz/products/interior-lighting/downlights/?view-all=1

Also IMO with these all in one lights and fittings, I would buy spares. If they fail, it is unlikely they will still be selling the same models, so you could otherwise end up with light fittings that don't match. That is one of the major benefits with E27 and B22 light fittings, where you can just switch out the bulbs. I have had many LEDs fail, mainly cheaper brand ones, but occasionally a good brand one has failed prematurely too.

BlueShift

1688 posts

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#1971278 8-Mar-2018 15:05

kryptonjohn:

BlueShift:

We're just about finished replacing all the incandescent downlights in our place with Lons from Lighting Direct. They are the same same size as the existing holes, and take literally 5 minutes to swap out and pop in. the first ones we install in our lounge nearly two years ago and they are still strong and bright. They give far more light than the 100W bulbs that were in there previously and use about 10% of the power. For less than $20 per light including driver when on sale, its been a no-brainer.

Next is replacing the halogens in the kitchen, that's trickier as the holes are a different size, so I need to do some drilling, and also crawl into the roofspace to remove the transformers and connect them up.

That's a bugger if you can't just pull the transformers out the hole the light was in!

Currently the hole is smaller than the transformer, and waaay smaller than my hand.

After making the holes big enough for the new lights, the transformers will fit, but my hand probably won't.

Luckily, I have a decent sized ceiling space, with only one tight spot to crawl through to get to the kitchen.

kryptonjohn

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#1971281 8-Mar-2018 15:10

I do anything I can to stay out of ceilings. Awfully hot and dusty up there. According to the DVS it's routinely 50+ degrees on summer days.

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