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Scott3
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  #2809155 8-Nov-2021 08:18
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Zeon:

 

Interesting new perspective.... Was speaking with a friend who is a real estate agent in Auckland on Friday. She is holding out on getting her vaccine until the "incentive" reaches at least $500 worth. Since she doesn't really work from the office so vaccine mandates aren't affecting her. Not sure if its a unique thought pattern but perhaps an unintended consequence of the incentive scheme. The Australian one with a lottery may have been a better approach....

 

 

This is the reason aussie has strict requirements around vaccine incentives. By requiring new vaccination incentives to be claimed by those who are already vaccinated, There is no incentive to wait for a larger incentive to become available.

 

  • is made to people who have been fully vaccinated (i.e. two shots);
  • states that vaccination must be undertaken on the advice of a health practitioner;
  • refers to COVID-19 vaccines generically (i.e. without referencing a particular vaccine);
  • is made to all eligible people who have been fully vaccinated (before or after the offer is made);
  • does not include tobacco or medicines (other than listed medicines); and
  • does not contain an offer of alcohol that: (i) encourages excessive or rapid consumption of alcohol; and (ii) has a strong or evident appeal to minors.[1]

In terms of the real estate agent, I think their $500 target may be unrealistic. Most I have heard of is a $100 pack n save voucher per car (that was in the waikato. Being unvaccinated seems to have a reasonable correlation with being low income, so incentives are being pitched at the poor, not real estate agents.

 

 

 

Also a $500 incentive would be sufficient people would defraud it by getting vaccines under fake, or other identities. (So steps like requiring photo ID to claim the reward would be needed. - Which risks bad press, even if the vaccine without reward was available without ID).

 

Rewards seem to be declining, as we are moving to a stick approach. (vaccine mandates for industries, vaccine pass etc.)




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  #2809164 8-Nov-2021 08:54
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An interesting article here with modelling by Otago University showing the incredibly low risks there are abandoning MIQ for arrivals into Auckland

 

Management of Auckland’s external border with the world and internal boundary with NZ needs major changes to reflect the city’s shift from Covid-19 elimination to suppression – Public Health Expert, University of Otago, New Zealand

 

Last week Hendy threw his toys out of the cot and said he hoped those calling for an end to MIQ "had done their maths".. I guess they now have.

 

 


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  #2809169 8-Nov-2021 09:03
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From the same paper:

 

  • The boundary around Auckland needs to be strengthened to minimise the risk of infected people travelling to other parts of NZ which are still pursuing elimination, at least until such time as the entire country has reached an agreed vaccination target (90% fully vaccinated). These measures should include vaccination, pre-travel testing, and potentially an additional home quarantine requirement and a post-travel test on arrival in other parts of NZ.

I think it's time to question whether other parts of NZ who are taking so long to hit 90% for even their firsts are actually pursuing an elimination strategy at all.




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  #2809172 8-Nov-2021 09:06
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sbiddle:

 

An interesting article here with modelling by Otago University showing the incredibly low risks there are abandoning MIQ for arrivals into Auckland

 

Management of Auckland’s external border with the world and internal boundary with NZ needs major changes to reflect the city’s shift from Covid-19 elimination to suppression – Public Health Expert, University of Otago, New Zealand

 

Last week Hendy threw his toys out of the cot and said he hoped those calling for an end to MIQ "had done their maths".. I guess they now have.

 

 

 

 

If they give Aucklanders some form of freedom to travel over Xmas, MIQ for returning travellers will be history by February.

 

Double jabbed plus negative test is the way they will both go IMO.


SJB

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  #2809176 8-Nov-2021 09:10
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GV27:

 

From the same paper:

 

  • The boundary around Auckland needs to be strengthened to minimise the risk of infected people travelling to other parts of NZ which are still pursuing elimination, at least until such time as the entire country has reached an agreed vaccination target (90% fully vaccinated). These measures should include vaccination, pre-travel testing, and potentially an additional home quarantine requirement and a post-travel test on arrival in other parts of NZ.

I think it's time to question whether other parts of NZ who are taking so long to hit 90% for even their firsts are actually pursuing an elimination strategy at all.

 

 

Around my part of SC, Timaru and Geraldine, you see a lot of people wearing masks in the street and always in all types of shops and cafes. Scanning in and signing in is very common too.

 

Elimination is the mindset of almost everyone I know around here.


GV27
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  #2809178 8-Nov-2021 09:16
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SJB:

 

Double jabbed plus negative test is the way they will both go IMO.

 

 

There's no plausible way for everyone who wants to go away or go on a day trip to get a negative test between Xmas and NY, unless the point is to make it impossible for Aucklanders to leave while still insisting it's possible.

 

That's before you get into the logistics of a checkpoint to check for one for every single car passenger over the age of what, 12?


 
 
 

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  #2809181 8-Nov-2021 09:24
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cshwone:
James Bond:

 

I don't have NZH Premium, but this looks interesting: https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/covid-19-delta-outbreak-spark-subsidiary-mattr-wins-key-vaccine-pass-contract/WU3ABDBP5BDINVMITLHK5AI3GY/

 



That was announced last week. I believe Freitasm had the press release on one of the threads

 

 

This thread: COVID-19 vaccination record / certificates (geekzone.co.nz)





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  #2809184 8-Nov-2021 09:29
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GV27:

From the same paper:



  • The boundary around Auckland needs to be strengthened to minimise the risk of infected people travelling to other parts of NZ which are still pursuing elimination, at least until such time as the entire country has reached an agreed vaccination target (90% fully vaccinated). These measures should include vaccination, pre-travel testing, and potentially an additional home quarantine requirement and a post-travel test on arrival in other parts of NZ.


I think it's time to question whether other parts of NZ who are taking so long to hit 90% for even their firsts are actually pursuing an elimination strategy at all.



It's easy.

No double vax 90% no visitors so don't make any money over Christmas.

I think it's very sensitive people are thinking human rights etc but the govt needs to spell out that our hospitals are crap.

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  #2809187 8-Nov-2021 09:37
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GV27:

 

SJB:

 

Double jabbed plus negative test is the way they will both go IMO.

 

 

There's no plausible way for everyone who wants to go away or go on a day trip to get a negative test between Xmas and NY, unless the point is to make it impossible for Aucklanders to leave while still insisting it's possible.

 

That's before you get into the logistics of a checkpoint to check for one for every single car passenger over the age of what, 12?

 

 

Exactly.. I see two scenarios - either Xmas is cancelled (and the PM has doubled down again this morning saying people will be able to travel) or they simply remove border restrictions a week or so before Xmas.

 

 


Scott3
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  #2809191 8-Nov-2021 09:46
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In terms of MIQ, We are a bit of a cross roads, the status quo is hard to justify given the case numbers in Auckland, but what do we do instead:

 

  • Self isolation - Public will expect that this is tightly enforced (home detention style ankle bracelets etc.) - not sure we have the resources to do this on a large scale.
  • Allow isoltation free arrivals (for fully vaccinated NZ citizens / residents, coming from a low to medium risk country, bound for Auckland, and willing to agree to get tested at 12 days, and not leave Auckland until that result is back.) - Need big fines or prision time for breaches to get public acceptance.

 

 

Currently we have 2564 active cases, 39 of which is from the border.

 

To get rid of isoltation, we would need to be happy with a 1.5% increase in community case numbers if volumes stay the same. Potentially volumes of travelers will increase 10 fold, which would give around a 15% jump.

 

Not huge, but Given we are still seeing exponential growth, I'm not sure if adding more community cases is a good idea. (and international arrivals risk seeding outbreaks in different communities than the current outbreak).

 

 

 

Also the Prime Minister has now committed to lifting the Auckland boundary by Christmas. Once that happens it will be hard to justify constraining isolation free arrivals to Auckland.

 

 

 

Wouldn't like to be the person making the decision on this. Any outcome is going to piss off large numbers of people.


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  #2809192 8-Nov-2021 09:47
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The desire for people to be fed information non stop is sure not helping the amount of gloom or repetition the media produce as a result to feed that.

 

Today:

 

 

Bar any major developments today Auckland's slight easing of restrictions on Tuesday will likely go ahead, with case numbers still roughly within modelling and the Government balancing mounting pressure from businesses and fatigued residents.

 

But experts warn people should expect to see a rise in case numbers and hospitalisations as a result.

 

Now where have I heard that before. I could almost google the phrase and likely see it appear numerous times. As it did last week. It's like a 'we told you so' that is half pie expected. 

 

That said. The other headline they have 'It's not about case numbers now'. Which we also kinda figured here. It's management of those who have no protection going forward from here in.


 
 
 

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  #2809193 8-Nov-2021 09:48
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sbiddle:

 

Exactly.. I see two scenarios - either Xmas is cancelled (and the PM has doubled down again this morning saying people will be able to travel) or they simply remove border restrictions a week or so before Xmas.

 

 

Agreed. It's either no travel or no border. The fact we are a month and a half from Xmas and we still don't know what the plan is, people can't book flights, etc is going to become a real headache if clarity doesn't come sooner rather than later. 


Scott3
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  #2809200 8-Nov-2021 09:56
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sbiddle:

 

Exactly.. I see two scenarios - either Xmas is cancelled (and the PM has doubled down again this morning saying people will be able to travel) or they simply remove border restrictions a week or so before Xmas.

 

 

Pritty much.

 

We need our police back doing regular police work - Between MIQ & Auckland borders they must be seriously stretched at the moment. I don't think it is viable to scale up the border and put enough police on the Auckland border to do even vaccination checks on 30,000 vaccination a day.

 

Potentially their could be a vaccine mandate for recreational travel by Air, and some ferries (cook straight, Waiheke, Great Barrier and Stewart island). That would be fairly easy to put in place.

 

 

 

Again this is going to be a no win situation for the government. - People are going to be very upset what ever decision is made.


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  #2809201 8-Nov-2021 09:56
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GV27:

 

sbiddle:

 

Exactly.. I see two scenarios - either Xmas is cancelled (and the PM has doubled down again this morning saying people will be able to travel) or they simply remove border restrictions a week or so before Xmas.

 

 

Agreed. It's either no travel or no border. The fact we are a month and a half from Xmas and we still don't know what the plan is, people can't book flights, etc is going to become a real headache if clarity doesn't come sooner rather than later. 

 

 

I think this is becoming people's issue with the response.

 

This government seems to take forever to make a decision. It's not like they haven't had time to discuss and plan for this scenario - they have a plethora of advisers and experts and panels and commitees to help them.

 

The Vaccine Certificate should be out. Guidelines for businesses on how to use it (and staff for it) should be out. Christmas plans should be out.

 

I can sort of understand the delays around telling Auckland what they're going to be able to do while they are still trying to mop up some vaccine stragglers (for some, whats the point of hurrying to get the jab if we know what we'll be able to do?)


GV27
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  #2809202 8-Nov-2021 10:03
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The fact that the Government is supposedly still agonising over the border should tell you just how unworkable it really is, tbh. 

 

Ardern had two interviews with beltway TV shows this weekend, the only thing that came out of it was the same firm commitment to the border being open. 

 

I would like to see people asking about the time-frame for finding out how that's going to work, rather than just accepting continual doubling-down as the end of the matter.


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