2015/16 NZ Holiday Toll in double figures

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roopam

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#189556 4-Jan-2016 13:09

As of yesterday it was 10! Just reducing the speed tolerance limit...is it enough? I guess there needs to be an active check on driving habits. I recently passed my practical test and am amazed to see how many people do not follow basic driving rules.

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#1461004 4-Jan-2016 13:17

I'm often surprised that the road toll ain't higher, considering the stupid things many people do on the roads just because they're impatient, etc.

How many of us have witnessed near-accidents averted by sheer dumb luck?

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dclegg

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#1461008 4-Jan-2016 13:23

I understand what you mean. I'm currently teaching my daughter how to drive. It's not an easy task, considering the unpredictability of so many other drivers, and their inability to apply the road rules she is trying to learn.

So many drivers also don't seem to understand exactly what the L plates we have on prominent display actually mean, as no tolerance is given for someone who is very much in the infancy of their driving career.

networkn

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#1461011 4-Jan-2016 13:27

Well it does show that having a 4KM limit isn't really solving the issue the way it's been claimed.

I think wild wet weather didn't help.

Slow drivers cause just as many issues.

Coil

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#1461023 4-Jan-2016 13:59

I think i have just accepted that no one in this country knows how to drive but thinks they do, and that our roads are dangerous and poorly designed.
Its really down to the attitude of the drivers and their skill. Many crashes are caused by frustrated and impatient people.

I was in a crash a week ago with a friend. Low speed rear ended someone due to brake failure.
Asian lady, Went absolutely berserk. Had zero patience and couldnt understand my friend was on the phone to his parents for insurance details. She called the police cause she thought he was withholding information. Police came and told her to get her head straight and left.

Aredwood

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#1461036 4-Jan-2016 14:34

The road toll will always be high until the govt grows some balls and introduces mandatory practical testing to renew drivers licences. This would mean a test every 10 years. As there are alot of people on the roads who were taught by their mum/dad/cussie/uncle ect. And the only practical test they have ever done is a drive around the block with an MOT officer. (back when the traffic police were separate from the actual police)

But this would cause alot of middle aged / older people to fail. And since the older you are the more likely you are to vote. So the govt wont do it for that reason.

Myself - Got my full licence around the year 2000. Was still 16 at the time as I did the defensive driving course to reduce the time on restricted licence by 6 months. Remember walking out of the AA office with my full licence thinking that it would be at least 50 years before the law would next require me to do a practical driving test.

surfisup1000

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#1461044 4-Jan-2016 15:02

Aredwood: The road toll will always be high until the govt grows some balls and introduces mandatory practical testing to renew drivers licences.

People know the rules, they just choose not to follow them. Best way is to get people to follow the rules they already know is through more enforcement.

Also, police reducing speed tolerances may increase the road toll -- I know I spend much more time looking at my speedo than the road now. And, each time I pass slow vehicle who speeds up in a passing lane I am usually breaking the tolerance.

Maybe, is it possible to have a dual speed limit on passing lanes --- left lane 70kph, right 100kph. But, given general intelligence level of some people maybe it would be too difficult a concept to master .

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#1461051 4-Jan-2016 15:17

I look at my speedo more than the road. Thanks to stupid spongy pedal called "electronic throttle control".

Yesterday i was behind a car doing 80. Every time the sign 400m to passing lane appears it pulled away. At the passing lane, i was at 104 (Corrected for as speedo read error) and it was still pulling away. The rule doesn't do nothing to this cohort of people.

tehgerbil

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#1461057 4-Jan-2016 15:24

surfisup1000:
Aredwood: The road toll will always be high until the govt grows some balls and introduces mandatory practical testing to renew drivers licences.

People know the rules, they just choose not to follow them. Best way is to get people to follow the rules they already know is through more enforcement

I respectfully disagree. The threat of being caught shouldn't/doesn't be the primary factor behind people following the law.

Having to keep up with your knowledge, and demonstrate that knowledge under pressure or lose your license no questions would be a significantly higher persuasive force!

Sit at any stop sign around Chch for instance for even around 5 minutes, it provides an eye opening experience. I have and found at least 8/10 failed to stop. If drivers can't take the effort to obey perhaps the most insignificant but crucial intersection rules, why would they obey any others? (And of course, they don't.)

Again, let's look at the most basic of driving rules "only a fool forgets the 2 second rule." Next time you're driving, count one Mississippi two Mississippi. If you can't get those 4 words out you're driving to close! Again, driving around Chch I would hazard around at least 60 to 70 percent drive too close to the car in front.

I force myself to drive as if there's an instructor in the car, I have my full license coming up and so while I come across as arrogant, I frankly don't care, I have to obey the rules to pass my test, why didn't everyone else?

Just because you sat your full twenty, thirty forty years ago doesn't make you a good driver, it means you used to know the rules. Nothing more.

/rant.

l43a2

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#1461071 4-Jan-2016 15:47

this might sound extreme. but i believe the ACC system of "no fault" causes a ton of people not to give many "sh*t's" while driving because they dont pay a penny if they cause a crash or hurt people.

surfisup1000

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#1461075 4-Jan-2016 16:19

tehgerbil:
surfisup1000:
Aredwood: The road toll will always be high until the govt grows some balls and introduces mandatory practical testing to renew drivers licences.

People know the rules, they just choose not to follow them. Best way is to get people to follow the rules they already know is through more enforcement

I respectfully disagree. The threat of being caught shouldn't/doesn't be the primary factor behind people following the law.

You are welcome to your opinion but you are generally wrong.

Take the opposite approach to demonstrate -- if you removed traffic enforcement, there would be a considerable increase in people breaking driving laws.

And, you say people who sat their test 20/30/40 years ago no longer know the rules. I beg to differ, most of the important rules have not changed one bit. You keep left (as in the last 40 years and more), you stop at stop signs, giveway at giveway signs. You give way to the right. Orange light means to stop if you can do so safely. Use your indicators when turning/changing lanes.

And so on-- the most important basic rules that some people continually ignore have not changed. You can teach people the rule again but it will not make them know the rule any better than they did previously.

Perhaps after people have been driving for a long time they become wilfully ignorant, or in too much of a rush sometimes.

tehgerbil

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#1461117 4-Jan-2016 18:29

surfisup1000:
tehgerbil:
surfisup1000:
Aredwood: The road toll will always be high until the govt grows some balls and introduces mandatory practical testing to renew drivers licences.

People know the rules, they just choose not to follow them. Best way is to get people to follow the rules they already know is through more enforcement

I respectfully disagree. The threat of being caught shouldn't/doesn't be the primary factor behind people following the law.

You are welcome to your opinion but you are generally wrong.

Take the opposite approach to demonstrate -- if you removed traffic enforcement, there would be a considerable increase in people breaking driving laws.

No offence, but your argument "Best way is to get people to follow the rules they already know is through more enforcement" doesn't really hold water as that's pretty much the point of OP's post - it hasn't worked.

Furthermore, quite a bit has changed since 2012 - And the roads are full of people who still forget "Top of the T goes before me", and still believe turning right gives them the right of way over people turning left.

I've seen it all too often that people still break these rules, however these rules have been changed since 2012.

We need enforcement. However I also am arguing that traffic enforcement alone is not the best answer.

I like Aredwood's idea - A little lateral thinking is required.
Neither a lowered speed tolerance, or a lowered drinking tolerance has been able to stop people drinking, or people speeding on the roads (and killing themselves and others).

Will enforcing a mandatory driving license re-sit every 10 years?

I have no idea, but our current way of thinking isn't 100% effective in lowering the road toll.

mentalinc

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#1461128 4-Jan-2016 19:02

It is really a problem? NZ is ranked 139/172. http://www.worldlifeexpectancy.com/cause-of-death/road-traffic-accidents/by-country/
Doesn't seem that bad?

Sure every preventable death is one to many but let's put this in context.

I'm sure there are far more things that killed more than 10 people during this holiday period.
At the start start of the holiday period the death rate was so low the headlines were focused on the number of accidents as the large sensational click bait headlines.

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Geektastic

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#1461136 4-Jan-2016 19:23

This is easily solved.

Your parents are not driving instructors. They should not be teaching you to drive.

MikeB4

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#1461139 4-Jan-2016 19:46

Geektastic: This is easily solved.

Your parents are not driving instructors. They should not be teaching you to drive.

I think its more than that, too many just do not take driving seriously and believe the rules are optional guidelines and if they get caught
it is the police who are to blame.

alasta

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#1461145 4-Jan-2016 20:13

Aredwood: The road toll will always be high until the govt grows some balls and introduces mandatory practical testing to renew drivers licences. This would mean a test every 10 years. As there are alot of people on the roads who were taught by their mum/dad/cussie/uncle ect. And the only practical test they have ever done is a drive around the block with an MOT officer. (back when the traffic police were separate from the actual police)

But this would cause alot of middle aged / older people to fail. And since the older you are the more likely you are to vote. So the govt wont do it for that reason.

I have always supported this in principle, but in practice I think the biggest problem with it is that the government would use it as a cash cow. Existing fees around driver licensing already seem like a case of taxing by stealth.

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