Prius C is frugal on Gas, planned V2H Solution, EV Range Anxiety is not for us for now

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RUKI

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Topic # 201460 19-Aug-2016 11:59

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Prius C is frugal on gas, planned V2H Solution, EV Range Anxiety is not for us for now

It was over a month since I've poured another 30L of gas into my 36L tank in Prius C.

It is over 530 Kms since and more than 1/3 of the tank is still full.. averaging 4.6L/100 Km...based on the computer readings.

@ $1.70 /L after BP or P&S (6Cents) discount it is equal to $7.82 / 100 km in Prius C.

If I were driving Leaf then $7.82 would be equivalent to about 15.6KW at the Fast Chargers in NZ. 15.6Kw would give me somethig about 75kms more or less and non-predictable. Maybe 100 km if lucky and Leaf is new.

That makes Prius C cheaper to buy and cheaper to run ("gas"-wise) vs second hand Gen 2 Leaf from Japan (if charged at fast chargers).

Prius C is comparable in "gas" price to Leaf charged at home. I am not even trying to compare with the Gen 1 Leafs with their battery issues and lower range.

Visiting gas pump once every 2 months vs remembering to charge EV every second day and not having range anxiety when driving anywhere in NZ - that is it for the timebeing. Prius Prime is promising to be 3 times better on gas.

One really BIG thing considering recent few power outages at home:

People are talking about Vehicle to Home Back Up (V2H). Using EV is "double trouble" - first you are out of power at home and in few hours you have no car to drive anymore.

I just finished R&D in "Prius to House Back Up Generator" - so easy to build (found out that I have everything I need) and so cool to be able to run essentials in your house (e.g. fridge, lights, computers, etc) (~3-6KWH) for a few days on Prius. Gas wise efficiency was confirmed to be comparable to commercial Honda Power Generator but Prius is much more quiet .... People were running Prius To House for 4 days non-stop with no issues....

Batman

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Reply # 1614290 19-Aug-2016 12:25

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Excellent stuff. Never understood why people like charging umpteen things everyday and then find that half those things can't even last the day, and then they go and buy a car for twice the price with the same problem!

dickytim

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Reply # 1614318 19-Aug-2016 12:47

A very interesting comparison.

I am genuinely interested in your driving style, are you in stop start traffic? What speed do you sit on when on the motorway?

Do you think that you could see even better statistics with small changes life tyre pressure, driving style etc?

I drive a 5.7l V8 and can see a variation as much as 2l/100km from week to week depending on my mood.

i.e. 14.5l/100km average to 12.5l/100km average just by accelerating slower and limiting my top speed to 95 - 100km/h

RUKI

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Reply # 1615361 21-Aug-2016 21:49

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dickytim:

......I am genuinely interested in your driving style, are you in stop start traffic? What speed do you sit on when on the motorway?

Do you think that you could see even better statistics with small changes life tyre pressure, driving style etc?

I drive a 5.7l V8 and can see a variation as much as 2l/100km from week to week depending on my mood....

Car has cruise control and I've tried that within 50 and 80 and 100 Speed limit zones.

My driving style is "not Rush'n around", stay within speed limit and be there in time...

dickytim

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Reply # 1615404 22-Aug-2016 06:37

RUKI:

dickytim:

......I am genuinely interested in your driving style, are you in stop start traffic? What speed do you sit on when on the motorway?

Do you think that you could see even better statistics with small changes life tyre pressure, driving style etc?

I drive a 5.7l V8 and can see a variation as much as 2l/100km from week to week depending on my mood....

Car has cruise control and I've tried that within 50 and 80 and 100 Speed limit zones.

My driving style is "not Rush'n around", stay within speed limit and be there in time...

Interesting, I have found that cruise control is generally less efficient than manual control, the human control can see a hill coming and apply a little more accelerator before it is needed where as cruise control acts when the speed and momentum is dropping.

RUKI

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Reply # 1615592 22-Aug-2016 11:01

dickytim:

..... I have found that cruise control is generally less efficient than manual control, the human control can see a hill coming and apply a little more accelerator before it is needed where as cruise control acts when the speed and momentum is dropping...

If by "efficient" you mean reaction to the road condition up the hill - I have not noticed any problems with that. If by "efficient" you mean less gas consumption - can't tell as there is no easy way to test that apart from trusting on-board computer which displays 3 metrics and overall score of how "economical" you were since last stop on a) Starting b) Cruising c) Stopping

I can only guess that "stopping" efficiency in the ECO Monitor has something to do with the regenerative braking.

Linuxluver

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Reply # 1636680 20-Sep-2016 16:57

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joker97: Excellent stuff. Never understood why people like charging umpteen things everyday and then find that half those things can't even last the day, and then they go and buy a car for twice the price with the same problem!

A simple, easy answer: climate change. (and most EV owners charge just once / day.....at home....for about $1).

Now you know. :-)

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Reply # 1636718 20-Sep-2016 18:11

What about the alleged child slavery / labour in the mining of lithium (, or is it some other thing need for the battery)

Linuxluver

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Reply # 1636886 20-Sep-2016 21:42

joker97: What about the alleged child slavery / labour in the mining of lithium (, or is it some other thing need for the battery)

The Koch brothers will allege anything to undermine electric cars. They've lied about everything else.

Lithium is "mined" by evaporating water that contains it in the sun.

I hope you don't shop at the Warehouse. Bad labour practices abound in China, where it all comes from.

Point being.....people who don't like a thing will just make stuff up.....and some people fall for it.

Even it if was true somewhere...it doesn't mean Musk uses child labour manufacturing batteries at his Tesla Gigafactory in the US.....which is now the largest battery-making plant on the planet. Similarly Samsung and LG and Panasonic...the other global scale battery makers.

Maybe it just means one is morally bound to buy a Tesla.....just in case.

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RUKI

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Reply # 1637042 21-Sep-2016 09:21

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joker97: What about the alleged child slavery / labour in the mining of lithium (, or is it some other thing need for the battery)

Prius C and all other Toyota Hybrids (except PHEV) traction batteries do not use lithium. Different chemistry - NIMH.

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Reply # 1637048 21-Sep-2016 09:32

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A plug-in hybrid is a great option. It's possible for most people to avoid using petrol almost all of the time. But it's there if you need it.

It will help fill the gap over the next 5 years until most cars are EVs and can do 500km on a charge. Today, that is a Tesla P100D. But more will follow. New battery tech points to many times more power being storable in the same physical space and faster charging...and smaller battery packs. The nano-wire filaments in gel that can be charged 200,000+ times and retain 95% of capacity look very promising. Certainly 10 years from now there will be no range anxiety and zero emissions.....for cheap.

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RUKI

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Reply # 1639586 23-Sep-2016 18:01

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Toyota NZ advertises Prius C consumption to be 3.9L/100km.

Round trip Greenlane - Piha showed 4.1 - 4.0 L/100km at the 99 km round trip. In our opinion that is awesome!
At today's price at Gull / Mobil on the way to Piha $1.729/L:
4.05 * $1.729 that is equal $7 / 100 km

Screenshots from the dash board of both ways are here:

https://www.facebook.com/toyotahybridbatteryexperts/

LostBoyNZ

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Reply # 1639605 23-Sep-2016 20:19

Agreed! I've got a normal Prius, 2009 model, and average 4.3L/100km but about half of my travel is on a highway (Prius are more economical in the city, the opposite of regular cars).

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Reply # 1639720 24-Sep-2016 09:41

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Linuxluver:

joker97: Excellent stuff. Never understood why people like charging umpteen things everyday and then find that half those things can't even last the day, and then they go and buy a car for twice the price with the same problem!

A simple, easy answer: climate change. (and most EV owners charge just once / day.....at home....for about $1).

Now you know. :-)

Agree with the sentiment LL, but to be fair, if it's e.g. a one car family, a Prius C is an excellent middle-ground: better than full petrol and Leaf re climate change and range, respectively.

RUKI

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Reply # 1640036 24-Sep-2016 21:46

paulchinnz:

.....to be fair, if it's e.g. a one car family, a Prius C is an excellent middle-ground: better than full petrol and Leaf re climate change and range, respectively.

The choice of Prius C is very much specific to my business needs. It is not the only car I use and not an alternative to or a "middle-ground";

It is the number of modules in the pack - #20 which is the perfect fit for my invention. The top-of-the-line is my 20-channel HV Battery Analyser.

That makes Prius C the best hybrid for tests and further R&D.

Going forward I can rebuild that pack easily from many failed regular Prius (28 modules) or Camry (34 modules). And 20-module pack is lighter than 28, 34, 38 or 40 in other hybrids. I can lift it easily myself.