Our new coalition government.

To post in this sub-forum you must have made 100 posts or have Trust status or have completed our ID Verification

Forums › Politics › Our new coalition government.

1 | ... | 163 | 164 | 165 | 166 | 167 | 168 | 169 | 170 | 171 | 172 | 173 | ... | 182

BDFL - Memuneh
80661 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 41081

Administrator

ID Verified

Trusted

Geekzone

Lifetime subscriber

#2458192 9-Apr-2020 12:58

Technofreak:

I'd suggest that if those 601 people had read this article prior to answering that poll the results would have been very different.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/120912415/coronavirus-how-tindall-morgan-and-fyfe-worked-to-ready-country-for-covid19-fight

It would seem where we are today in our readiness to respond was't exactly due to the governments actions.

There was also the headline behind the NZHerald paywall where Shamubeel Eaqub said we needed some adults in the room with respect to the governments Covid-19 response.

The leadership in this government is very much lacking. They are sleep walking their way to possible success and certainly don't deserve to be re-elected on current efforts.

I don't understand your point. That's what people do. The government can't do everything so people that can help, help.

""A number of us guys had a meeting with the prime minister and Grant Robertson on the Sunday before lockdown," said Tindall. "Some of us, Sam Morgan and I in particular, realised there was a lot of stuff not getting done. We basically took the bull by the horns along with the guys from Zuru, and used our own money and ordered up a whole heap of PPE gear. There's actually seven planeloads coming. Two have arrived already.""

They have done their civic duty. We are all in this together. But some people just like to complain.

This is nothing but grasping at straws, trying to discredit the government's coordination work.

Referral links: Quic Broadband (free setup code: R587125ERQ6VE) | Samsung | AliExpress | Wise | Sharesies

Support Geekzone by subscribing (browse ads-free), or making a one-off or recurring donation through PressPatron.

Technofreak

6657 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3477

Trusted

#2458194 9-Apr-2020 13:03

freitasm:

GV27:

Voters at election time might have strong opinions on the government's lack of delivery and bumbling, possibly corrupt coalition partners as well. The Covid-19 crisis doesn't mean that stuff didn't happen.

I find projecting your personal opinions as the will of the great unwashed masses to be a tad presumptive.

Bumbling? I think we are watching different press conferences. Are you sure you aren't watching Trump on Fox?

I think GV27 is referring to the lack of delivery and bumbling on things like the 1000's of promised houses that have never and will never be built, the fiasco of the drug dealing martial arts expert, etc etc.

He makes the point that just because the government might come out of the Covid-19 event looking like they did an OK job it doesn't mean the voters will forget all their lack of delivery and bumbling on other matters.

Sony Xperia XA2 running Sailfish OS. https://sailfishos.org The true independent open source mobile OS
Samsung Galaxy Tab S6
Dell Inspiron 14z i5

freitasm

BDFL - Memuneh
80661 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 41081

Administrator

ID Verified

Trusted

Geekzone

Lifetime subscriber

#2458197 9-Apr-2020 13:04

Technofreak:

I think GV27 is referring to the lack of delivery and bumbling on things like the 1000's of promised houses that have never and will never be built, the fiasco of the drug dealing martial arts expert, etc etc.

He makes the point that just because the government might come out of the Covid-19 event looking like they did an OK job it doesn't mean the voters will forget all their lack of delivery and bumbling on other matters.

Thanks, makes sense.

Referral links: Quic Broadband (free setup code: R587125ERQ6VE) | Samsung | AliExpress | Wise | Sharesies

Support Geekzone by subscribing (browse ads-free), or making a one-off or recurring donation through PressPatron.

dejadeadnz

2394 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2287
Inactive user

#2458203 9-Apr-2020 13:11

Technofreak:

It would seem where we are today in our readiness to respond was't exactly due to the governments actions.

Oh yeah because getting the country ready for an unprecedented crisis like this involves just getting PPE, ventilators and the other laudable efforts those private individuals engaged themselves in. Genuine question here: did you really engage a bit of critical faculties before typing that?

As a socially progressive political moderate who has nonetheless only ever voted National or mostly conscientiously abstained (I am laying this card out to avoid the likely BS attack that I am some kind of hard left coalition lover), who's had a direct family view of how this government has handled the crisis (my partner's an ER consultant and she's on her hospital's crisis management team) and have been able to contrast this response with the place of my birth -- which has been yo-yoing between different levels of determination to control the disease -- I beg to differ with your assessment. There have been two approaches that have broadly been proven to work in slowing COVID-19 down: the first is an early, decisive, and severe social lockdown and the second is lots of testing, advanced surveillance, and contact tracing (e.g. South Korea, Germany, Taiwan). This government has clearly executed (1) and is now looking to combine that with aspects of (2). Just based on that alone and the fact that our statistics are nowhere near as grim as that of many other comparable countries, the notion that this government has somehow sleepwalked its way to success is just laughable.

Again, feel free to hold the powers that be to account. But don't be a dick in assessing/critiquing people's good faith efforts.

Technofreak

6657 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3477

Trusted

#2458229 9-Apr-2020 13:31

freitasm:

Technofreak:

I'd suggest that if those 601 people had read this article prior to answering that poll the results would have been very different.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/120912415/coronavirus-how-tindall-morgan-and-fyfe-worked-to-ready-country-for-covid19-fight

It would seem where we are today in our readiness to respond was't exactly due to the governments actions.

There was also the headline behind the NZHerald paywall where Shamubeel Eaqub said we needed some adults in the room with respect to the governments Covid-19 response.

The leadership in this government is very much lacking. They are sleep walking their way to possible success and certainly don't deserve to be re-elected on current efforts.

I don't understand your point. That's what people do. The government can't do everything so people that can help, help.

""A number of us guys had a meeting with the prime minister and Grant Robertson on the Sunday before lockdown," said Tindall. "Some of us, Sam Morgan and I in particular, realised there was a lot of stuff not getting done. We basically took the bull by the horns along with the guys from Zuru, and used our own money and ordered up a whole heap of PPE gear. There's actually seven planeloads coming. Two have arrived already.""

They have done their civic duty. We are all in this together. But some people just like to complain.

This is nothing but grasping at straws, trying to discredit the government's coordination work.

My point was these are the sorts of critical things that should have been already been thought about and organised.

"A lot of stuff not getting done". Why not? The government has a whole suite of agencies to deal with getting stuff done. The ministers don't actually have to do it themselves, but they do need to drive things along.

It would appear from the way that article was written the government weren't really on top of things. Perhaps the reality is different.

True the government cannot do everything. Kudos to those guys for doing what they did, putting up their own money and working with the government. However in this case it certainly seems the co-ordination effort came from the business men not the government.

Sony Xperia XA2 running Sailfish OS. https://sailfishos.org The true independent open source mobile OS
Samsung Galaxy Tab S6
Dell Inspiron 14z i5

freitasm

BDFL - Memuneh
80661 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 41081

Administrator

ID Verified

Trusted

Geekzone

Lifetime subscriber

#2458234 9-Apr-2020 13:35

Perhaps instead of trying these shots you could help support what's being done then? Have you followed these people's examples?

Referral links: Quic Broadband (free setup code: R587125ERQ6VE) | Samsung | AliExpress | Wise | Sharesies

Support Geekzone by subscribing (browse ads-free), or making a one-off or recurring donation through PressPatron.

Samsung

Shop now on Samsung phones, tablets, TVs and more (affiliate link).

freitasm

BDFL - Memuneh
80661 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 41081

Administrator

ID Verified

Trusted

Geekzone

Lifetime subscriber

#2458236 9-Apr-2020 13:36

From CNN today:

Referral links: Quic Broadband (free setup code: R587125ERQ6VE) | Samsung | AliExpress | Wise | Sharesies

Support Geekzone by subscribing (browse ads-free), or making a one-off or recurring donation through PressPatron.

MikeB4

MikeB4
18776 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 12768

ID Verified

Trusted

Subscriber

#2458351 9-Apr-2020 14:03

In my flawed opinion I believe the effectiveness of the government's response and the response of New Zealand's as a whole to the Covid-19 crisis will be known this time next year. To date I believe we and I mean the government and vast majority of New Zealanders have responded to the best of their abilities considering New Zealand and the World was in all new unknown territory. There is no doubting that the level 4 lockdown has saved probably thousands of lives. Mistakes have no doubt been made but this crises is as new to the Prime Minister, you, me and the other 4.7 million Kiwis.

Right now in the mid point of this level 4 alert is not the time to politicise this, it is time to stay on track so we continue to save lives. So that's my opinion warts and all.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

GV27

5978 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4212

#2458368 9-Apr-2020 14:16

MikeB4:

There is no doubting that the level 4 lockdown has saved probably thousands of lives. Mistakes have no doubt been made but this crises is as new to the Prime Minister, you, me and the other 4.7 million Kiwis.

It shouldn't be new. We have pandemic plans and a ministry of health to plan for these eventualities. I would argue it's a core responsibility. It should be reach into the draw, break the 'In Case of Emergency' seal and follow step by step.

However what I think we'll find is our experience is hugely similar to other places: our pandemic plans were last seriously looked at when Swine Flu rolled around and probably envisaged a far worse outbreak of something that didn't get a head-start in the community (people can't write off bleeding eyeballs as 'just a cold). The world is a far more interconnected place since SARS and NZ tourism has blown up massively since then.

And in that regard, I think the PM's response has probably been entirely and logically consistent with a framework that probably wasn't fit for purpose to begin with. I don't think that can be seen as a political issue, it will be more a question for MoH to answer than anything else.

MikeB4

MikeB4
18776 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 12768

ID Verified

Trusted

Subscriber

#2458377 9-Apr-2020 14:20

GV27:

MikeB4:

There is no doubting that the level 4 lockdown has saved probably thousands of lives. Mistakes have no doubt been made but this crises is as new to the Prime Minister, you, me and the other 4.7 million Kiwis.

It shouldn't be new. We have pandemic plans and a ministry of health to plan for these eventualities. I would argue it's a core responsibility. It should be reach into the draw, break the 'In Case of Emergency' seal and follow step by step.

However what I think we'll find is our experience is hugely similar to other places: our pandemic plans were last seriously looked at when Swine Flu rolled around and probably envisaged a far worse outbreak of something that didn't get a head-start in the community (people can't write off bleeding eyeballs as 'just a cold). The world is a far more interconnected place since SARS and NZ tourism has blown up massively since then.

And in that regard, I think the PM's response has probably been entirely and logically consistent with a framework that probably wasn't fit for purpose to begin with. I don't think that can be seen as a political issue, it will be more a question for MoH to answer than anything else.

The plan being used now was developed by the Key government. It was largely untested. This out break was new territory given its speed of spread, globalisation and global dependance on air transport.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

GV27

5978 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4212

#2458405 9-Apr-2020 14:48

MikeB4:

The plan being used now was developed by the Key government. It was largely untested. This out break was new territory given its speed of spread, globalisation and global dependance on air transport.

The New Zealand Influenza Pandemic Action Plan has been in existence since 2002, but
has undergone substantial revision since then due to the evolving threat from H5N1
influenza, the influenza A (H1N1) 2009 pandemic and the subsequent all-of-government
programme of pandemic planning and exercises that have been implemented.

Looks like it gets a lick of paint now and then.

Samsung

Shop now on Samsung phones, tablets, TVs and more (affiliate link).

Handle9

11927 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 9683

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2458410 9-Apr-2020 14:53

Technofreak:
I'd suggest based on recent events he would be very stupid to use Zoom.

The he is very stupid.

He drives to Wellington. Then uses Zoom.

MikeAqua

8031 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3822

#2458413 9-Apr-2020 14:55

Technofreak:

I think a delay for the election makes a tremendous amount of sense.

In all seriousness I agree.

But ... Peters and NZ First have more to lose than anyone. They are in all likelihood toast if we go to the polls. He has the least credibility of anyone in govt, on this issue.

Mike

MikeB4

MikeB4
18776 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 12768

ID Verified

Trusted

Subscriber

#2458427 9-Apr-2020 14:59

GV27:

The New Zealand Influenza Pandemic Action Plan has been in existence since 2002, but
has undergone substantial revision since then due to the evolving threat from H5N1
influenza, the influenza A (H1N1) 2009 pandemic and the subsequent all-of-government
programme of pandemic planning and exercises that have been implemented.

Looks like it gets a lick of paint now and then.

And I believe its a 100% certainty that the plan will be thoroughly reviewed after this crisis is over. There is time to reap and a time to sow, right now is not the time to review. Tweak and adjust as we go is best at this time and that is what we are seeing.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

Technofreak

6657 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3477

Trusted

#2458436 9-Apr-2020 15:10

MikeAqua:

Technofreak:

I think a delay for the election makes a tremendous amount of sense.

In all seriousness I agree.

But ... Peters and NZ First have more to lose than anyone. They are in all likelihood toast if we go to the polls. He has the least credibility of anyone in govt, on this issue.

Can't disagree with your comments about Peters and New Zealand First. Because of Peters they have the most to lose. In my opinion Winston Peters is the most untrustworthy politician we have. The sooner he has no influence in the running of this country the better.

Sony Xperia XA2 running Sailfish OS. https://sailfishos.org The true independent open source mobile OS
Samsung Galaxy Tab S6
Dell Inspiron 14z i5

1 | ... | 163 | 164 | 165 | 166 | 167 | 168 | 169 | 170 | 171 | 172 | 173 | ... | 182