Christopher Luxon, New Zealand Prime Minister 2023

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Forums › Politics › Christopher Luxon, New Zealand Prime Minister 2023

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#3435421 17-Nov-2025 21:07

SaltyNZ:
quickymart: I guess Mr-I'm-rich-and-sorted will be all good whenever he leaves office though, right?
Oh yeah, he'll go straight into CEO of Large Business Ltd.

After politics Luxon is very likely to become a company director on multiple boards + a healthy sideline in golf and real estate.

sen8or

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#3435947 19-Nov-2025 14:10

They were a little less respectful this time (and mostly from Seymour taking personal digs at Chloe)

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/video/herald-now/political-panel-david-seymour-and-chloe-swarbrick/TVI3TVRJ4SBAXGBDNUV4LMG4NY/

Again, she mostly held her own and kept pointing things back to their costed / verified policies with Seymour seemingly relying on soundbites and attention grabbing to form an argument. If last round was a draw, I'd give the points to Chloe this time.

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#3435951 19-Nov-2025 14:43

sen8or:

They were a little less respectful this time (and mostly from Seymour taking personal digs at Chloe)

Seymour: "When [they] said 'there will be no more oil and gas exploration permits' they didn't actually cancel any existing ones."

Well, yes, Dave, that's what "no more" means. Also, as Chloe pointed out, these permits have not been issued. Those ones had.

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#3436031 19-Nov-2025 17:12

quickymart:

And speaking of their beloved roads and more cars, how about this? https://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/360888930/its-about-get-cheaper-import-dirty-cars-climate-impact-negligible

🙄

The changes for the car standards are a) temporary and b) needed. There isn't the volume of clean car credits needed to offset the dirty ones, but there's still not a good EV/low-emission option for many commercial units. Slowly changing, more brands coming to market and electric everything is getting cheaper, but it's a very recent development as the post-rebate environment starts to become clearer.

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#3436043 19-Nov-2025 18:18

GV27:

The changes for the car standards are a) temporary and b) needed. There isn't the volume of clean car credits needed to offset the dirty ones, but there's still not a good EV/low-emission option for many commercial units. Slowly changing, more brands coming to market and electric everything is getting cheaper, but it's a very recent development as the post-rebate environment starts to become clearer.

Going to have to agree to disagree here. The reason there aren't enough clean car credits is because the government killed the clean car programme. You can make an argument that it wasn't generating enough revenue to cover itself; ok, that was true, but it wasn't in place long enough for a lot of the stuff that's coming onto the market now to really have an impact. It's entirely possible that it would be generating plenty of revenue now, if it had remained in place.

There have obviously been some economic issues - but they didn't make much of an impact on sales of utes that are as expensive or more than practically every EV on the market even in 2023, so you can't blame the drop in EV sales solely on that.

The changes to the standards are not needed; the charges need to stay. There's a very simple way for car importers to avoid the $264M in charges ... import cars that don't get hit with charges. That is the whole point of the scheme. Charges put pressure on importers. Importers put pressure on manufacturers. Consumers get better cars that will be cheaper to run, which is great even if you think climate change is a hoax.

These changes might save car dealers $264M but they are going to cost the buyers an extra $115M in more fuel according to the government's own advice.

You're right about it being temporary though, I assume they'll be back pretty soon after a change in government.

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#3436054 19-Nov-2025 19:07

New Zealand demand has zero impact influencing what gets made. New Zealand takes what it can get.

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#3436057 19-Nov-2025 19:20

I would not say zero. NZ is around the 4th largest importer of second hand Japanese cars believe it or not. NZ participation in that market affects resale value in that market. At some point resale value affects purchase decisions of new cars in Japan.

Likewise in following international standards for new cars NZ's influence is not zero.

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#3436074 19-Nov-2025 20:36

SaltyNZ:

There have obviously been some economic issues - but they didn't make much of an impact on sales of utes that are as expensive or more than practically every EV on the market even in 2023, so you can't blame the drop in EV sales solely on that.

Sort of. The thing that kills commercial vehicle sales is high interest rates. And up until relatively recently, the quality of EV commercial vehicles has been average. It's changing, which is great. But you still can't get an electric Hilux or Ranger, and that's what people wanted. Yes, we have the Shark and full BEV Riddara which is pretty cool (bias alert) but they're very, very recent developments.

Re: What gets sold here - new cars have to cross some serious hurdles before they're an option in our market - they have to be RHD, they have to be able to be sold down here and paid for by a distributor in Euros or USD or whatever and then still stack up at a decent price even allowing for a distributor margin, then a dealer margin and then still be affordable to customers. That's pretty difficult when your cross rates are down because your dollar is weakening and a hard sell in an economy where people are still inclined to throw every red cent at their mortgage even as rates drop.

So on top of all that, you then have the EV question, getting around the out-of-date (let's be charitable and assume it's not all misinformation) talking points, and at that point, you might have an option for our market.

But it's worth noting the logjam of cars at $79,990 were discounted down pretty heavily when the rebate ended and with far lower prices than the net effect of the rebate as distributors worked to clear stock. That kind of pricing wasn't sustainable. It's a shame because if it was possible to sell those units at those price from the get-go, they would have flown out the door. But that's not how it worked out.

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#3436077 19-Nov-2025 21:02

GV27: But you still can't get an electric Hilux or Ranger,

Electric Hilux announced for NZ, and the PHEV Ranger is available now. Feel free to join the EV thread ; ).

GV27

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#3436082 19-Nov-2025 21:37

Announced but not here yet. Ssangyong also has an electric ute. Riddaras starting to arrive in decent numbers.

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#3436108 20-Nov-2025 08:20

SaltyNZ:

GV27:

The changes for the car standards are a) temporary and b) needed. There isn't the volume of clean car credits needed to offset the dirty ones, but there's still not a good EV/low-emission option for many commercial units. Slowly changing, more brands coming to market and electric everything is getting cheaper, but it's a very recent development as the post-rebate environment starts to become clearer.

Going to have to agree to disagree here. The reason there aren't enough clean car credits is because the government killed the clean car programme. You can make an argument that it wasn't generating enough revenue to cover itself; ok, that was true, but it wasn't in place long enough for a lot of the stuff that's coming onto the market now to really have an impact. It's entirely possible that it would be generating plenty of revenue now, if it had remained in place.

There have obviously been some economic issues - but they didn't make much of an impact on sales of utes that are as expensive or more than practically every EV on the market even in 2023, so you can't blame the drop in EV sales solely on that.

The changes to the standards are not needed; the charges need to stay. There's a very simple way for car importers to avoid the $264M in charges ... import cars that don't get hit with charges. That is the whole point of the scheme. Charges put pressure on importers. Importers put pressure on manufacturers. Consumers get better cars that will be cheaper to run, which is great even if you think climate change is a hoax.

These changes might save car dealers $264M but they are going to cost the buyers an extra $115M in more fuel according to the government's own advice.

You're right about it being temporary though, I assume they'll be back pretty soon after a change in government.

Who do you think was going to pay that $264mio in charges, I'll give you a hint, it won't be the importers..... So the $115mio in fuel costs is still less than the $ 264mio in charges that the public would have paid.

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#3436554 22-Nov-2025 06:40

gzt: I would not say zero. NZ is around the 4th largest importer of second hand Japanese cars believe it or not. NZ participation in that market affects resale value in that market. At some point resale value affects purchase decisions of new cars in Japan.

Likewise in following international standards for new cars NZ's influence is not zero.

If that’s the case could you perhaps point to the JDM features which have been influenced by New Zealand demand for second hand cars?

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#3436560 22-Nov-2025 07:55

sen8or:

Who do you think was going to pay that $264mio in charges, I'll give you a hint, it won't be the importers..... So the $115mio in fuel costs is still less than the $ 264mio in charges that the public would have paid.

Nobody, if they imported cars that didn't attract the fees. Which is the point of the fees.

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#3436627 22-Nov-2025 13:24

Was it also that it encouraged importing newer vehicles that met later Japanese emission and efficency standards?

Side effect of reducing dumping of very old 'magically low milage' vehicles that have shorter life?

Understanding that we get to deal with disposal at end of life.
Plus unexpected cost to owner of extra maintenance, if the vehicle deems to need major maintenance or replacement early.

Making sure our fleet is more modern on fuel and safety standards and lasting a reasonable time.

We are not alone UK has vehicle license fees (VED) based on Co2 and other measures, EU. Japan and Australia have various taxes on cars imported or manufactured for low Co2 and electric.
Vehicle manufacturers are responding to a global demand and trend.

Except Merica, but you don't want to be sandwiched in a NZ carpark with those on each side. :-)

Encouraging newer imports has other benefits all around.

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#3437153 24-Nov-2025 15:52

And the latest from Luxon - "We are doubling contributions to Kiwisaver".

When he says "we", he really means employees and employers. So the public will end up with 3% less in the hand over the coming years and employers wage bill will go up 3%. Some employers will use the rising kiwisaver costs as an offset to wage growth, so expect slightly more pain at the cash till until things normalise again, whenever that may be

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