Jacinda Ardern - our new PM

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Forums › Politics › Jacinda Ardern - our new PM

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Networkn
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#1889371 25-Oct-2017 16:06

elpenguino:

The free market economy rules say you have to put your prices up or cut your expenses.

So put your prices up and see if I still buy your product. As a consumer I have a choice to support your business. As a taxpayer I do not,

If you can't sell your product then those workers will go and find other jobs at a business that can make money - according to the free market rules.

Or, sit on a benefit drawing on the tax payer anyway.

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#1889472 25-Oct-2017 18:03

elpenguino:

if your business relies on extremely low paid workers to remain solvent, you don't have much of a business going on.

If your workers have to receive taxpayer top ups to survive, your business is being subsidised by the taxpayer.

It is likely they will just employ less staff, and get those staff to do more work. Wages have to be paid by someone. Increasing minimum wages potentially increases inflation, which means interest rates rise. This means people will be paying more to service their mortgage. Any changes often have knock on effects.

elpenguino

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#1889601 25-Oct-2017 21:47

Of course they have knock on effects - the economy is a money go round. On the other hand, those workers (and everyone else) will be paying lower taxes because they are not subsidising those under paid workers. Are you in favour of lower taxes?

You can't get those workers to do more work because the capacity of a human is limited - unless you invest in your business and increase productivity.

What we have seen in NZ is business owners rely on cheap labour to make their businesses viable - instead of investing to increase productivity.

Most of the posters in this thread are just like chimpanzees on MDMA, full of feelings of bonhomie, joy, and optimism. Fred99 8/4/21

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#1889610 25-Oct-2017 21:56

Knows nothing about economics -

Perhaps this is targeting corporations where directors and CEOs getting millions while the bottom struggle to feed the family.

Small business owners? SOrry don't know ...

Pumpedd

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#1889613 25-Oct-2017 22:02

networkn:

elpenguino:

The free market economy rules say you have to put your prices up or cut your expenses.

So put your prices up and see if I still buy your product. As a consumer I have a choice to support your business. As a taxpayer I do not,

If you can't sell your product then those workers will go and find other jobs at a business that can make money - according to the free market rules.

Or, sit on a benefit drawing on the tax payer anyway.

As I said in another post..most of the WINZ money other than National Super goes to working for families....so not many sitting at home....

networkn

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#1889687 26-Oct-2017 09:05

Pumpedd:

networkn:

elpenguino:

The free market economy rules say you have to put your prices up or cut your expenses.

So put your prices up and see if I still buy your product. As a consumer I have a choice to support your business. As a taxpayer I do not,

If you can't sell your product then those workers will go and find other jobs at a business that can make money - according to the free market rules.

Or, sit on a benefit drawing on the tax payer anyway.

As I said in another post..most of the WINZ money other than National Super goes to working for families....so not many sitting at home....

And? I wasn't making any statement about that, I was saying that some people who lose their jobs sit on unemployment.

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networkn

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#1889758 26-Oct-2017 11:16

I can't look, she is being sworn in :(

And in a new low in NZ reporting, apparently, her deserves headlines. /facepalm

tdgeek

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#1889809 26-Oct-2017 13:02

Dingbatt:
PhantomNVD: I think them agreeing to be accountable is the one thing politicians will all agree NOT to do!

Peters has already stated (in his coalition announcement) that what ever happens, it's not his fault.

The economist who predicted a global down turn said it wasnt the fault of whatever Govt was in power. Im unsure why that is always left out...

gzt

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#1889842 26-Oct-2017 14:55

networkn: Two full time working parents on minimum wage (today) will bring in $1300 a week pre Tax. What is the average rental price for a 2 bedroom house in NZ right now? What about a 3 Bedroom ?

I expect the rent to own scheme will get some of that instead of contributing to continuing house price inflation.

networkn

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#1889846 26-Oct-2017 15:04

gzt:
networkn: Two full time working parents on minimum wage (today) will bring in $1300 a week pre Tax. What is the average rental price for a 2 bedroom house in NZ right now? What about a 3 Bedroom ?

I expect the rent to own scheme will get some of that instead of contributing to continuing house price inflation.

Price houses aren't what I was referring to when I was talking inflation.

I think Labours plans to sell these 100K new houses (which I will donate $100 to charity if they get done in the 10 years they promise because they have no show) cheaply to people who can't afford them now, is flawed in lots of ways. It's admirable from a fairy dust perspective, but

ultimately, without controlling how much you can resell them for, or ensuring that the people who buy them can afford the maintenance, rates, insurance, and upkeep of a property, so many things could go wrong, including only temporarily cooling the housing market and then having it go through the roof and making it worse in the long term.

Despite what some people here might believe, it's not achievable for everyone in an economy like ours, to own houses. Anyone who says differently has no idea how economics works.

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#1890904 26-Oct-2017 18:00

Aucklanders are going to get billions of tax dollars to fix things Councils have failed to do since Sir Dove Meyer Robinson(not sure on spelling).

In fact most Councils need to good kick...National planned to do it but piked out.

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#1890957 26-Oct-2017 19:40

Dratsab:

gulfa:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11936065

Bill English is moving on some of our posters need to do this as well

Fat chance of that happening! :-D

These sort of MMP results (minority government) have happened before in other countries. It's actually quite humorous to see the the intensity of some of wailing that's going on over the result. I don't give a toss either way - all politicians lie all the time (moving lips is the give-away) it's just a matter of which particular broom-load of crap they're going to peddle. It's far easier to get on with life but there is a bit of fun to be had along the way.

Edit: missing word

I agree. Its just a Govt, both are centrist, its not a riot. Both sides have positives, one side (Nats) have a negative, the other side (Labour) we are waiting to see if there is a negative. This thread should have waited 6 months. Then we can discuss. When there is a trend. Other than that its a Trump bashing thread, NZ style

wsnz

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#1890958 26-Oct-2017 19:40

tdgeek:

Dingbatt:
PhantomNVD: I think them agreeing to be accountable is the one thing politicians will all agree NOT to do!

Peters has already stated (in his coalition announcement) that what ever happens, it's not his fault.

The economist who predicted a global down turn said it wasnt the fault of whatever Govt was in power. Im unsure why that is always left out...

The GFC wasn't Labour's fault, but then neither was the period of massive economic expansion that preceded it. You can't take credit for one, but not the other and that goes for any government.

What most concerns me is Winston talking down the economy before even officially taking power, that's not a good move and Winston knows better than that. The words of politicians have profound effects on the market and consequently the fortunes of the citizens.

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#1890959 26-Oct-2017 19:44

elpenguino:
Of course they have knock on effects - the economy is a money go round. On the other hand, those workers (and everyone else) will be paying lower taxes because they are not subsidising those under paid workers. Are you in favour of lower taxes?

You can't get those workers to do more work because the capacity of a human is limited - unless you invest in your business and increase productivity.

What we have seen in NZ is business owners rely on cheap labour to make their businesses viable - instead of investing to increase productivity.

Productivity is also driven by how productive a worker is.

The more breaks, leaning on shovels, playing on social media etc etc a worker does, the lower productivity will be.

For example, when I first moved here I was astonished to find office staff actually knocking off for morning and afternoon tea, something that I had never come across in nearly 20 years working in professional services overseas.

Shutting the economy down for 2 or 3 weeks every Christmas is also a pretty outdated concept and deleterious to productivity.

It's not just about investing money - and, indeed, the sort of productivity gains obtained by spending money are as likely to result in reduced staff levels as a result of automation as anything else.

tdgeek

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#1890960 26-Oct-2017 19:48

Fred99:

Wow - someone must have spiked Mike Hosking's sour grape juice with some MDMA:

Maybe the new Government's not the end of the world after all

Probably had a one on one with his boss. Its not about you, its about ratings

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