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dafman

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#205617 19-Nov-2016 19:38
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I don't normally post non-tech subjects, but when it comes to [censored] [censored] of the vulnerable...

 

I signed.

 

https://www.change.org/p/john-key-strip-destiny-church-from-tax-free-status

 

 


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Stu

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  #1674297 19-Nov-2016 19:41
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 Why stop at Destiny? Every other money making outfit in the country needs to pay tax, so why not religious groups? Most things seem to have evolved over time, but not this crazy law/rule/whatever.





It’s not that I’m agoraphobic, it’s just not safe to go out anymore.

 

Keep calm, and carry on posting.

 

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dafman

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  #1674304 19-Nov-2016 19:56
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Stu:

 

 Why stop at Destiny? Every other money making outfit in the country needs to pay tax, so why not religious groups? Most things seem to have evolved over time, but not this crazy law/rule/whatever.

 

 

I wholeheartedly agree. For me, next cab of rank of rank after Destiny would be Sanitarium; a coprorate hiding behind the pretense of religion and charity to avoid paying their fair share of tax


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  #1674319 19-Nov-2016 21:06
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Add Sanitarium to that list as well please

Linux



blakamin
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  #1674320 19-Nov-2016 21:09
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Sanitarium, Scientology... We got Louis Theroux's "My Scientology Movie" on BBC knowledge here in OZ this week... faaaaaarrrrrr****... They should be locked up


Stan
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  #1674324 19-Nov-2016 21:26
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Stu:

 

 Why stop at Destiny? Every other money making outfit in the country needs to pay tax, so why not religious groups? Most things seem to have evolved over time, but not this crazy law/rule/whatever.

 

 

 

 

Some religious groups like the sallies should be kept tax free IMHO


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  #1674325 19-Nov-2016 21:29
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Also add givealittle too


hio77
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  #1674326 19-Nov-2016 21:32
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Stan:

 

Stu:

 

 Why stop at Destiny? Every other money making outfit in the country needs to pay tax, so why not religious groups? Most things seem to have evolved over time, but not this crazy law/rule/whatever.

 

 

 

 

Some religious groups like the sallies should be kept tax free IMHO

 

 

Recently was talking with a good friend who was moving, So going through all her clothes and such getting rid of whats not wanted..

 

 

 

Was actually surprised to hear her response, The local sallies turned away her with a few friends because they were Quite obviously of the, Pro gay sort.

 

While not totally unsurprising for a to the book christian group, was rather astonishing to hear in this day and age...

 

 





#include <std_disclaimer>

 

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

 

 




blakamin
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  #1674327 19-Nov-2016 21:34
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Stan:

 

Stu:

 

 Why stop at Destiny? Every other money making outfit in the country needs to pay tax, so why not religious groups? Most things seem to have evolved over time, but not this crazy law/rule/whatever.

 

 

 

 

Some religious groups like the sallies should be kept tax free IMHO

 

 

 

 

How much of what they're given do you think makes it to the needy? I saw some numbers once, and it wasn't good.


mattwnz
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  #1674329 19-Nov-2016 21:43
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What is the reason that churches and religions are tax free currently? Personally I believe if everyone paid their share of taxes we would have little need for charity.

Technofreak
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  #1674336 19-Nov-2016 22:07
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mattwnz: ....Personally I believe if everyone paid their share of taxes we would have little need for charity.

 

I don't see payment or not of taxes having anything to do with whether or not there'd be any need for charity.

 

When you talk of fair share of taxes that's another matter. I suspect the amount raised by taxing bona fide religious organisations would probably be not worth the effort. However there's plenty of big business (mainly multi nationals) who need the light shone on their taxation dealings, the outcome of which would produce worthwhile returns.

 

As for stripping the Destiny church of their tax free status, I think that is a dangerous slope. I don't have much time for Mr Tamaki and his type of operation and think his operation pushes the boundaries so far as using the tax free status goes.  I think the work that nearly all religious organisations do in the community deserves some recognition in the form of tax free status or the likes. Once you start picking on one then where do you stop.

 

Sometimes you need to "Swallow a Dead Rat".

 

Re the comment about the Sallies not accepting old clothes based on certain perceived values/beliefs, I suspect the decision not to accept the goods was one persons and probably doesn't represent the official line. I've never had any involvement with them so my assumption might be wrong.





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  #1674346 19-Nov-2016 23:07
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hio77:

Stan:


Stu:


 Why stop at Destiny? Every other money making outfit in the country needs to pay tax, so why not religious groups? Most things seem to have evolved over time, but not this crazy law/rule/whatever.



 


Some religious groups like the sallies should be kept tax free IMHO



Recently was talking with a good friend who was moving, So going through all her clothes and such getting rid of whats not wanted..


 


Was actually surprised to hear her response, The local sallies turned away her with a few friends because they were Quite obviously of the, Pro gay sort.


While not totally unsurprising for a to the book christian group, was rather astonishing to hear in this day and age...


 



Well go back, and educate them. Sallies welcome the pro gay sort.

http://www.salvationarmy.org.nz/research-media/media-centre/local-news/earthquakes-and-sinners




Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


hio77
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  #1674347 19-Nov-2016 23:14
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joker97:

Well go back, and educate them. Sallies welcome the pro gay sort.

http://www.salvationarmy.org.nz/research-media/media-centre/local-news/earthquakes-and-sinners

 

 

 

Was not my fight, I will say that the particular branch in question didn't really seem all that nice last time i was personally there though...





#include <std_disclaimer>

 

Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

 

 


geocom
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  #1674348 19-Nov-2016 23:30
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mattwnz: What is the reason that churches and religions are tax free currently? Personally I believe if everyone paid their share of taxes we would have little need for charity.

 

Its part of the legislation

 

 

In this Part, unless the context otherwise requires, the term charitable purpose means every purpose which in accordance with the law of New Zealand is charitable; and includes the following purposes, whether or not they are beneficial to the community or to a section of the community:

 

(a)the supply of the physical wants of sick, aged, destitute, poor, or helpless persons, or of the expenses of funerals of poor persons:
(b)the education (physical, mental, technical, or social) of the poor or indigent or their children:
(c)the reformation of offenders, prostitutes, drunkards, or drug addicts:
(d)the employment and care of discharged offenders:
(e)the provision of religious instruction, either general or denominational:
(f)the support of libraries, reading rooms, lectures, and classes for instruction:
(g)the promotion of athletic sports and wholesome recreations and amusements:
(h)contributions towards losses by fire and other inevitable accidents:
(i)encouragement of skill, industry, and thrift:
(j)rewards for acts of courage and self-sacrifice:
(k)the erection, laying out, maintenance, or repair of buildings and places for the furtherance of any of the purposes mentioned in this section.

 

 

Personally i think the entire act needs a redo the requirements are quite weak and open to hidden abuse. There was an additional act in 2005 that is voluntary that requires more open accountability but it is optional.

 

Also they should just remove part e of the above. If the church want to do good in the community then separate the 2 entities one that is tax exempt and works to help those in the community and one that is a business(the provision of religious instruction). Then the business(the church) can donate to the charity and can reclaim the Tax from this amount. The same as any business can do.





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  #1674350 19-Nov-2016 23:36
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hio77:

 

Stan:

 

Stu:

 

 Why stop at Destiny? Every other money making outfit in the country needs to pay tax, so why not religious groups? Most things seem to have evolved over time, but not this crazy law/rule/whatever.

 

 

 

 

Some religious groups like the sallies should be kept tax free IMHO

 

 

Recently was talking with a good friend who was moving, So going through all her clothes and such getting rid of whats not wanted..

 

 

 

Was actually surprised to hear her response, The local sallies turned away her with a few friends because they were Quite obviously of the, Pro gay sort.

 

While not totally unsurprising for a to the book christian group, was rather astonishing to hear in this day and age...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not really any more astonishing than all the stuff about miracles and people coming back from the dead and supreme beings etc etc...!






Stan
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  #1674352 19-Nov-2016 23:44
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I have had friends on the receiving end of the salvation army charitable trust. I had a friend who was addicted to drugs and had been for 10 years he asked the salvation army for help and they helped him 3 years later he is still clean.

 

They do alot of good in the community and alot of people in the church are very passionate about helping others, some churches like destiny are money grabbing but not all should be put under the same banner. 


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