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Topic # 60441 26-Apr-2010 11:49
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Wondering if anyone here knows a lot about Sony AV receiver setup - specifically use of the HDMI inputs?

I recently purchased a Sony STR-DA3500ES receiver and BDP-S760 blue-ray player. The receiver has a host of RCA, digital coax, optical, etc. inputs, all associated with a specific a source. For example, I can connect a CD player to the RCA plugs labelled SA-CD/CD on the back of the receiver, and when I select the SA-CD/CD source by pressing the CD button on the remote, I can hear the CD. However, the HDMI inputs don't appear to be associated with specific sources though - they're just called HDMI 1,2,3,4. So I have connected the blu-ray player to HDMI 3 on the receiver via a single HDMI cable, and when I press the HDMI3 button on the receiver remote I get great sound and picture.

Now, there is also a setup menu option to assign different input signals to the various receiver sources, so I can go into this menu, select the BD source, press an Option button, select Input Assign, and then assign HDMI 3 as the input video signal. But there is no HDMI option for the input audio signal. So when I press BD on the remote, I get a great picture, but no sound.

Call me old fashioned, but I want to be able to watch a blu-ray movie by pressing BD on the remote. Isn't that what it's for? If I fill up the other HDMI inputs (with MY SKY HDi, a games console, etc.) is it up to me to remember which HDMI button to press to see and hear the right signal, instead of just selecting SAT for satellite TV, etc? Isn't HDMI the "preferred" connection type for BD and other high definition media? Surely Sony haven't designed a range of receivers where it expects you to connect a BD player, but you can't use the BD-named source unless using RCA cables?

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  Reply # 322975 26-Apr-2010 12:20
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If your 3500ES is similar to a 2400ES I helped set up then it automatically assesses the audio inputs from an assigned source in the following hierachy hdmi, optical, digital coax, RCA stereo. It then chooses the highest available. So if you have hdmi3 assigned to BD in the setup menu it should use hdmi if it is available. One of the other things you may want to check is that the hdmi audio setting is to 'receiver' and not 'TV' otherwise it is trying to pass the audio to the TV instead of decoding it.

Additionally there are normally default hdmi sockets for particular sources, it would surprise me if your Sony doesn't have the same, either labelled on the rear panel or in the Owners Manual.




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  Reply # 322984 26-Apr-2010 12:36
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Do you have an optical connection for your sound?  On my receiver (not a sony) I have all my connections (hdmi) feeding into the reciever and then hdmi out to the TV, so I only have to use the one HDMI channel on the tv. For my sound, I use optical connections from PS3 (for blu ray) to the receiver and have set it up that way, and same for my DVD Hard Drive Recorder.



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  Reply # 322995 26-Apr-2010 13:04
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@Dingbatt: I believe the 3500ES is very much like the 2400ES. So if HDMI is selected as the input video signal, it should "automatically" select as the audio signal as well? Interesting. It's not, so I must have something else in the setup that's throwing it off.

I think HDMI Audio Out on the receiver was set to "Amp+TV", but I'd have to check that when I get home tonight. Maybe setting it to just "Amp" would be a better choice.

I am following the operating instructions which say to use HDMI IN 2 for DVD, 3 for BD, and 4 for satellite TV set top box. I had an old Samsung DVD player connected to HDMI IN 2 and that had the same problem, but there was a message from the Samsung on the TV screen saying "HDMI audio output not supported" when selecting DVD as the source instead of HDMI2. I didn't bother with it too much, knowing the BD player was going to replace it in a matter of days.

@semigeek: Your setup is like what I am going towards: BD and a MY SKY decoder HDMI-ed into the receiver and a single HDMI cable from the receiver to the TV. The receiver does have an optical digital input, but surely HDMI should carry both audio and video signals without any additional cables?

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  Reply # 323001 26-Apr-2010 13:10
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semigeek: Do you have an optical connection for your sound?  On my receiver (not a sony) I have all my connections (hdmi) feeding into the reciever and then hdmi out to the TV, so I only have to use the one HDMI channel on the tv. For my sound, I use optical connections from PS3 (for blu ray) to the receiver and have set it up that way, and same for my DVD Hard Drive Recorder.

Why would you use optical as well as HDMI?  For a start, optical can't carry the full lossless audio tracks of BD.

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  Reply # 323004 26-Apr-2010 13:16
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semigeek: Do you have an optical connection for your sound?  On my receiver (not a sony) I have all my connections (hdmi) feeding into the reciever and then hdmi out to the TV, so I only have to use the one HDMI channel on the tv. For my sound, I use optical connections from PS3 (for blu ray) to the receiver and have set it up that way, and same for my DVD Hard Drive Recorder.


Sorry for asking, but why would you use optical from your PS3 to your receiver for Blu-ray audio? You won't be receiving the Blu-ray HD audio formats via optical if you have your receiver and PS3 to input and output audio over optical, you only get them via HDMI.

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  Reply # 323005 26-Apr-2010 13:16
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AFAIK HDMI should carry both audio and video without requiring an optical cable. My receiver (Onkyo) in the sound set up menu only has Opt 1 and Opt 2 and Coax for the sound input, I haven't actually tried it using just HDMI. Will have a look at that tomorrow.

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  Reply # 323012 26-Apr-2010 13:32
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bazzer:
semigeek: Do you have an optical connection for your sound?  On my receiver (not a sony) I have all my connections (hdmi) feeding into the reciever and then hdmi out to the TV, so I only have to use the one HDMI channel on the tv. For my sound, I use optical connections from PS3 (for blu ray) to the receiver and have set it up that way, and same for my DVD Hard Drive Recorder.

Why would you use optical as well as HDMI?  For a start, optical can't carry the full lossless audio tracks of BD.


Because that is the only way that I can get audio it seems.

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  Reply # 323014 26-Apr-2010 13:36
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not all receivers can receive audio thru HDMI. the cheaper ones usually can't.

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  Reply # 323015 26-Apr-2010 13:37
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AND lossless audio CAN be bitstreamed over optical i'm pretty sure



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  Reply # 323026 26-Apr-2010 13:53
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joker97: not all receivers can receive audio thru HDMI 


The 3500ES itself is definately receiving audio through HDMI, as I can hear it just fine if I select HDMI3 as the input source on the receiver. It's only when selecting the actual BD source on the receiver that there is no audio.

It just seems strange that Sony would have a specific input source on a 7.1 channel receiver that is called "BD" if it can't utilise HDMI for both video and audio. Isn't the whole true HD thing the reason we go to BD over DVD in the first place? 

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  Reply # 323031 26-Apr-2010 14:05
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andrew027: The 3500ES itself is definately receiving audio through HDMI, as I can hear it just fine if I select HDMI3 as the input source on the receiver. It's only when selecting the actual BD source on the receiver that there is no audio.

It just seems strange that Sony would have a specific input source on a 7.1 channel receiver that is called "BD" if it can't utilise HDMI for both video and audio. Isn't the whole true HD thing the reason we go to BD over DVD in the first place? 


If you can't set it up how want, ie using the BD on the remote and you are going to get MySky HDi as you mentioned above, then I would highly recommend getting a universal remote - it will save a lot of hassles.
Our Harmony 785 has been one of the best things for a multiple component AV setup, they are great.

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  Reply # 323045 26-Apr-2010 14:21
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andrew027: @Dingbatt: I believe the 3500ES is very much like the 2400ES. So if HDMI is selected as the input video signal, it should "automatically" select as the audio signal as well? Interesting. It's not, so I must have something else in the setup that's throwing it off.

I think HDMI Audio Out on the receiver was set to "Amp+TV", but I'd have to check that when I get home tonight. Maybe setting it to just "Amp" would be a better choice.

I am following the operating instructions which say to use HDMI IN 2 for DVD, 3 for BD, and 4 for satellite TV set top box. I had an old Samsung DVD player connected to HDMI IN 2 and that had the same problem, but there was a message from the Samsung on the TV screen saying "HDMI audio output not supported" when selecting DVD as the source instead of HDMI2. I didn't bother with it too much, knowing the BD player was going to replace it in a matter of days.

@semigeek: Your setup is like what I am going towards: BD and a MY SKY decoder HDMI-ed into the receiver and a single HDMI cable from the receiver to the TV. The receiver does have an optical digital input, but surely HDMI should carry both audio and video signals without any additional cables?


I am wracking my brain to remember if that is the problem initially with the 2400ES (set up was 18 months ago), set it to Amp only and see if that helps.  I have a feeling that when 'TV' comes into play the blu-ray player looks through the amp to the TV and only sends stereo audio.




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  Reply # 323057 26-Apr-2010 14:35
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Thanks Dingbatt - I'll certainly give that a crack at home tonight.

Following your first post I've been looking at the receiver operating instructions (which I have at work with me for a little light reading over lunch). It does say that when Amp+TV is selected:

"The sound quality of the playback component depends on the TV's sound quality, such as the number of channels, the sampling frequency, etc. When the TV has stereo speakers, the sound output from the receiver is also stereo as that of the TV, even if you play multi channel source."

But wouldn’t that mean I would still hear some sound – just not 5.1 channel audio? At the moment I’m getting no sound at all when assigning HDMI as the video signal for the BD source…

 

 

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  Reply # 323073 26-Apr-2010 15:12
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andrew027: Thanks Dingbatt - I'll certainly give that a crack at home tonight.

Following your first post I've been looking at the receiver operating instructions (which I have at work with me for a little light reading over lunch). It does say that when Amp+TV is selected:

"The sound quality of the playback component depends on the TV's sound quality, such as the number of channels, the sampling frequency, etc. When the TV has stereo speakers, the sound output from the receiver is also stereo as that of the TV, even if you play multi channel source."

But wouldn’t that mean I would still hear some sound – just not 5.1 channel audio? At the moment I’m getting no sound at all when assigning HDMI as the video signal for the BD source…

 



Sorry I was just amending my post when your reply came in (wouldn't take it because 15 minute edit limit was up).  I have found the PDF of the UM for the 2400ES that I keep on hand to provide phone support to my mate.  I interpretted it the same way when I helped with the install, but in reality it doesn't seem to work like that.  In the end I just set it to 'AMP' and viola! there was the sound. 
There is also the ability to switch between digital and analogue (under Switching between digital and analogue audio (INPUT MODE)) in the 2400ES manual.  From memory it retains that setting for that source.  The problem I had where all this was discovered was trying to get MySkyHDi to play nice and provide DD5.1 via optical which wouldn't happen because the Receiver would 'see' the hdmi connection and prefer to use it.  (And before anyone jumps in, yes I know MySky DD5.1 is available via hdmi now but this was pre the firmware update enabling it).  However you actually want the Receiver to 'see' the hdmi audio and use it so Auto and Digital are the appropriate settings for you.

I put it down to the attitude at Sony where the engineers know best and try and protect the consumers from themselves (and limit their setting options).  Companies that specialise in Receivers (Yamaha, Onkyo, Pioneer, Denon, etc) definately make things easier.

I can't remember what your display is (darn not being able to review the thread while posting!) but if it is a Sony or Panasonic or Samsung you should be able to get the CEC control fuction (called Bravia Synch, Vieralink or AnyNet+ respectively) to operate so that the Receiver turns on and off with your TV and adjusts the volume as well.  Sorry a little off topic, I'll let you solve the audio problem firstLaughing.




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  Reply # 323087 26-Apr-2010 15:41
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under audio setup options is there "digital Assign" its usually used for assigning coax\opt connections to a video source but on this model it may also have HDMI audio sources. just a guess.




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