I'm not sure. I'll try to remember to ask next time I see her (might be tomorrow).

Behodar:

 

I think there's a lot of misinformation floating around, including ISPs either not understanding, or individual helpdesk staff not saying the right things. I know someone who had her active copper connection disconnected last week with no warning, although the impression I got from her description was that the ISP "decided" that copper was no longer available, rather than it being actual Chorus withdrawal. I shudder to think how many people throughout the country have run into similar issues.

 

Chorus is exiting copper where possible (UFB areas) 
But ISPs also dont want to be dealing with copper anymore - it has a higher cost in customer support manpower. 

So we picked up a few new fixed wireless customers in the last couple of months who all parroted common line - Mercury / Trustpower were discontinuing copper services. 

raytaylor:

 

But ISPs also dont want to be dealing with copper anymore - it has a higher cost in customer support manpower. 

 

I concur with Ray here and furthermore there is a clear relationship between customers which contribute in any way towards the bottom line and UFB.

I could count on less then one hand the number of clients I know who are on copper who would call us up for something else more lucrative.

Simply put, copper contributes almost nothing to our bottom line but it comes with additional risks.

People may not be aware but if an ISP gets Chorus out to resolve a fault and they can't find something or is an issue at the client's place the ISP gets billed for this whether or not the client thinks its fair, let alone wants to pay.

Whereas with UFB it is self-diagnostic and even shows us if a device is plugged into the port. While this is not perfect - we have like twice its reported OK and its not - we still don't receive a bill. Those rare exceptions invariably affects others in the same street and Chorus (etc) accept the fault as their responsibility.

UFB is also easy to provision. None of this fluffing about over whether there is an intact pair or we need to order a more expensive 'full install'. We know which addresses we can offer service to and we know the level of service its going to be. No more of the sliding scale where I get ~93mbps in a speed test and someone else - on the same exchange - gets 6mbps because they are a lot further.

Last of all its simply a great technology. My connection is run in excess of 20km and its rock solid. I am getting a Hyperfibre upgrade and the only (minor) pain is the wait on a xgs-pon linecard. There is no ifs, buts or maybes over what I have or can get.

From every view its a no-brainer. There is no future in copper.

For those who are caught out by the HFC issue I suggest writing to your MP in support of Chorus 95% coverage proposal

Behodar:

 

I'm not sure. I'll try to remember to ask next time I see her (might be tomorrow).

 

raytaylor:

 

Mercury / Trustpower were discontinuing copper services. 

 

Actually she did say Mercury. So not a One issue.

bfginger:

Newtown:

I've been looking at https://wificonnect.co.nz/fibre/ and their 500/100 at $79 looks favourable and comes with a fixed IP. Anyone got any intel on WifiConnect and if they're any good?

There are scores of small ISPs in NZ with a user base no bigger than GZ so you're not likely to get any responses. Usually at a low price point they're Devoli or 2Degrees resellers. But in this case the uncharged static IP, no indigenous DNS server, fibre limitation to Chorus and simple billing setup are not suggestive of a typical reseller operation. They've been in business for over a decade and offering fibre for 7 years if that counts. If you give them a go I suggest you try quad9 instead of cloudflare for the DNS.

bfginger:

 

There are scores of small ISPs in NZ with a user base no bigger than GZ so you're not likely to get any responses. Usually at a low price point they're Devoli or 2Degrees resellers. But in this case the uncharged static IP, no indigenous DNS server, fibre limitation to Chorus and simple billing setup are not suggestive of a typical reseller operation. They've been in business for over a decade and offering fibre for 7 years if that counts. If you give them a go I suggest you try quad9 instead of cloudflare for the DNS.

 

I work for a "smaller ISP" so can talk to this.

We are not resellers. We have our own gear, transit, peering, IP resources, yada yada. But in context internet access is not our core business. We don't even look for internet access only accounts. And that is why the others are resellers. Internet access as a standalone simply doesn't stack up due to the costs involved. So for the constant posting on this forum from people looking for an 'angle', myself and others are being honest when we say there isn't one and you get what you pay for.

Small players have 3 options:

 

1. Buy off someone else who has scale (ie: VISP, reseller, affiliate, white label) - this is what most do. There is a hidden pitfall here and its why VISP's tend to leave the industry frequently with their illusions of easy money shattered. Often who they are buying from is invariably making so little on the deal (or even a loss) supporting VISP's is a low priority compared to their retail customers. Of all the options being a VISP can rapidly became a case of rock and hard place, meat in the sandwich. If someone still wants to try it my suggestion is hop on the back of one of the business grade players even though the buy cost is higher.
2. Hope to get scale quickly and burn a bunch of money getting there (or not) - not common but I have seen it tried. It does not have a high success rate.
3. Sell stuff which is technically harder to deploy and maintain but makes more money and the internet clients can ride on the back of this - a smaller number including ourselves. Often players who have been around awhile and were always niche. Some have been in the industry since the early days.

In regards to Chorus only, there is reason for this.

Chorus are not only the biggest LFC by far, they are also the only LFC to offer central interconnection. So an ISP can have their gear at a Datacentre in Auckland (or other major centre) and service all Chorus connections from here, even DSL.

The others don't do this. Every POI (point of interconnect) region requires a separate interconnection. This not only incurs costs at each POI, it also adds back haul costs to where the ISP's core network is situated (usually Auckland). And unless the ISP is very large and has their own fibre cables or dark strands, they will be buying that backhaul off someone else and its not cheap.

Whereas with Chorus they can handle the backhaul and they have massive economies of scale and the intercity fibre is theirs.

This also has the added bonus for the end client they have a lot greater choice of ISP's if they are at a Chorus serviced address.

Also a smaller ISP may choose to only go with Chorus, or their local LFC, or both, on the basis their target market is regional and this is all they need to reach them.

Just a quick query - One advise that moving from HFC to Fibre Everyday, my max download speed will reduce from 867 mbps to 500 mbps.

Will this still be sufficient for streaming 2 x HD videos simultaneously (say Netflix & Apple TV)?

Our experience with HFC has been patchy last year and on occasions has struggled to stream without buffering - I'm assuming this is unreliability of our HFC rather than insufficient download?

@dafman Yes without breaking a sweat you could stream 4 x 4k with no issues and still browse the web and watch YouTube on a 500Mbp/s connection

You could stream 2 x HD on the 100/20 plan and still watch YouTube and browse the web

dafman:

 

Just a quick query - One advise that moving from HFC to Fibre Everyday, my max download speed will reduce from 867 mbps to 500 mbps.

 

Will this still be sufficient for streaming 2 x HD videos simultaneously (say Netflix & Apple TV)?

 

Our experience with HFC has been patchy last year and on occasions has struggled to stream without buffering - I'm assuming this is unreliability of our HFC rather than insufficient download?

 

500mbs will be ample for two HD streams, TBH 100mbs should be able to do this without breaking a sweat....

End of an era – HFC has been turned off and fibre is now up and running. Look forward to one fewer overhead cable. I didn't bring up the removal of the cable with One.nz, but if we don't hear anything about it when the network shuts down, we'll do it ourselves. 

Just a reminder that SuperWifi is only $5 per unit for 12 months, and the unit is a Deco BE28 (WiFi7) which seems quite good actually. Considering adding 3x to my plan. 

Newtown:

End of an era – HFC has been turned off and fibre is now up and running. Look forward to one fewer overhead cable. I didn't bring up the removal of the cable with One.nz, but if we don't hear anything about it when the network shuts down, we'll do it ourselves. 

Just a reminder that SuperWifi is only $5 per unit for 12 months, and the unit is a Deco BE28 (WiFi7) which seems quite good actually. Considering adding 3x to my plan. 

Newtown:

 

End of an era – HFC has been turned off and fibre is now up and running. Look forward to one fewer overhead cable. I didn't bring up the removal of the cable with One.nz, but if we don't hear anything about it when the network shuts down, we'll do it ourselves. 

 

Just a reminder that SuperWifi is only $5 per unit for 12 months, and the unit is a Deco BE28 (WiFi7) which seems quite good actually. Considering adding 3x to my plan. 

 

The number of people I've seen cut the HFC Cable from their house and roll it up and attach it to the power pole not realising it can affect the network quality for their neighbours still on HFC (since it's not correctly terminated). Since removing any cables is going to affect both One NZ customers and non-customers, I'm guessing in a few months' time (if they have everyone off the network) there is going to be door knocks or letterbox drops from One NZ / Downer advising they will be removing the cable from properties. How long that process takes across the entire network will be anyone's guess.

If you didn't want to wait, you should contact One NZ and ask them to log a job to Downer requesting the HFC cable is removed from your property, as it is their ownership. (Make sure they are clear its Downer and the HFC cable, if they say something about Chorus, you know it's going in the wrong direction).

Should we be concerned that no one has yet contacted us regarding when HFC will end and a new offer of fibre? 

Eva888:

 

Should we be concerned that no one has yet contacted us regarding when HFC will end and a new offer of fibre? 

 

Not at all you will get contacted

Eva888:

 

Should we be concerned that no one has yet contacted us regarding when HFC will end and a new offer of fibre? 

 

Maybe just call them. Our deal was $30 discount on Fibre Everyday + smart wifi ($96 + $5 - $30 = $71 per month). Plus a $200 credit on top.

We already had fibre installed, just had never turned it on - so a simple changeover.

If you need the fibre installed, it will be a bit more work. More the reason to call them now before the bottleneck of HFC changeover stalls fibre installs.