Housing crisis in Auckland

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#1619916 30-Aug-2016 21:05

I would probably use the term 'strong demand' rather than crisis. As with all things in economics, supply often lags demand, and I suspect substitution might be in the form of moving to cities or regions where prices are lower and in the longer term forms of transport such as urban rail that allow external populations into city centres for work more easily.

What I would like to see though is a national medium density housing plan that factors in environmental concerns such as green space, trees, wild gardens, rental accomodation with adiquate multi-vehicle garaged parking and allowance for animals, urban rail from surrounding suburbs and towns and adiquate parking at the rail stops and in the inner cities. It doesn't need to happen over night, but if all of the cities and towns were flying in formation with the same vision I think in 10 to 15 years time much of the issues would be solved.

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thestokes

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#1619934 30-Aug-2016 21:30

mattwnz:

MikeB4:

Not just Auckland. We were in Christchurch recently and there seemed to be more homeless compared to a few months back. There is also an increase in Wellington.

I am guessing one reason people don't want to do much about the housing crisis, is that the home owners and developers have a lot of clout. And as house prices go up, people feel richer, and can borrow more against their house. So for many, they feel far better off. But even the CEO of the ANZ has spoken out against the problem. IMO something is going to crash as the bubble can't continue. I don't think a Labour/Greens coalition party coming in is going to be able to fix this either, as their policies aren't much better.

I do not think it is a bubble I think it is supply and demand, we might see slight corrections but popping ain't going to happen unless there is (the wrong type of) intervention

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#1619938 30-Aug-2016 21:35

Received this today

Geektastic

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#1619983 30-Aug-2016 22:33

mattwnz:

tdgeek:

I agree. Immigrants should be required to build their own house. Or a means of housing that creates a new home. Cater for themselves. Leave the housing issues for us to manage, but provide your own housing from NOT our house supply. Sorted.

They do in at least some Australian states. It just makes so much sense. But many coming into NZ will initially be renting and not buying, and they will likely remain renting forever due to the high cost of houses. Although it is a rental, it is also a rental that a NZer misses out on, which is why people are living in cars. But a significant problem is also overseas buyers buying NZ houses, who aren't actually living here, as they are buying for both capital gain and the increasing rent, and that money then heads off overseas. Housing can be a great investment in NZ due to all the advantages it offers, but it is not great for first home buyers. a 1 million dollar house in Auckland is actually going to end up costing nearly 2 million over the life of a loan. 2 million is an insane amount of money, for a often poorly insulated low spec timber house.

It would make more sense if building houses did not take so +%^@#$ long in this country!! And if they could be built without leaking, falling apart etc, under regulations where councils were actually financially liable if they approved things that turned out to be wrong.

I saw one on Fair Go a few months ago where a lady had saved and bought her first house. Only to find a few months later that the house sewer was not connected to the main sewer in the street.

Council had signed. Drain layer had signed. Builder had signed.

And not one of them would accept responsibility for the cock up.

If we had 20,000 immigrants, all of whom had to build, we would have no builders available for anyone else within a few years, the backlog would be enormous.

Aredwood

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#1619995 30-Aug-2016 23:58

webwat:

If you try to drive teh house prices down too much you will find banks have lent money on houses that are worth less than the mortgages. When this happens banks can become bankrupts. Not good.

Its easy to react against "immigration" but I think we need to take a sensible approach. Possibly create incentives for immigrants to look at provincial towns. Definitely create disincentives for anyone at all to sit on undeveloped land or under-utilised buildings waiting for years expecting prices to rise automatically. Maybe part of the solution is for Auckland Council to shift to rates calculated on land value and cost of infrastructure/services to encourage more development.

The law that created the Auckland council. Also says that the council must use capital value for calculating rates - not land value. A conspiracy theorist would say some large property developers or land bankers lobbied the government to include that in law.

It personally benefited me. My section that only has 1 house on it is big enough to be subdivided. When the Auckland council came into existence. My rates went down by $500 per year. While all my neighbours got rates rises. It would have gone down even more if there hadn't been a rates rise at the same time.

Apartment owners would have been hurt the most by the change to capital value rating. As apartment normally have a low land value and high capital value in comparison. Due to value of land that apartment building is built on divided by number of apartments in that building.

For the record - I still want to see a return to land value rating. Even though I would have to pay more in rates.

And if that guy is actually getting people to pay him rent for his paddock. I should probably put up the rent I charge my flatmates. (maybe after I finish installing the insulation)

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#1619999 31-Aug-2016 00:21

thestokes:

Wow, just wow...

http://carsleepers.com

Domain Registered On: 2016-08-20

Can you say publicity stunt?

mattwnz

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#1620003 31-Aug-2016 00:39

Aredwood:

webwat:

If you try to drive teh house prices down too much you will find banks have lent money on houses that are worth less than the mortgages. When this happens banks can become bankrupts. Not good.

Its easy to react against "immigration" but I think we need to take a sensible approach. Possibly create incentives for immigrants to look at provincial towns. Definitely create disincentives for anyone at all to sit on undeveloped land or under-utilised buildings waiting for years expecting prices to rise automatically. Maybe part of the solution is for Auckland Council to shift to rates calculated on land value and cost of infrastructure/services to encourage more development.

The law that created the Auckland council. Also says that the council must use capital value for calculating rates - not land value. A conspiracy theorist would say some large property developers or land bankers lobbied the government to include that in law.

It personally benefited me. My section that only has 1 house on it is big enough to be subdivided. When the Auckland council came into existence. My rates went down by $500 per year. While all my neighbours got rates rises. It would have gone down even more if there hadn't been a rates rise at the same time.

Apartment owners would have been hurt the most by the change to capital value rating. As apartment normally have a low land value and high capital value in comparison. Due to value of land that apartment building is built on divided by number of apartments in that building.

For the record - I still want to see a return to land value rating. Even though I would have to pay more in rates.

And if that guy is actually getting people to pay him rent for his paddock. I should probably put up the rent I charge my flatmates. (maybe after I finish installing the insulation)

There are councils that still rate on LV. Christchurch being one of them. Rating on CV is essentially a wealth tax. LV is far more fair, and also means that landbankers get rated more, so there is more of an incentive for their land to be devloped. So Auckland council can go back to LV rating , it is their choice, as other councils rate on LV

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dickytim

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#1620009 31-Aug-2016 06:39

Why are we not moving long term unemployed out of Auckland?

The cumulative effect is more homes in Auckland available and moving people out provides more jobs in the provincial areas = win-win.

Should anyone in a state house have the right to demand they live in the most expensive city in Auckland?

We talk about a crisis, a crisis needs drastic action, drastic action like moving people who don't need to be in an area out of that area.

If we are not willing to look as something like this we need to stop whinging about the crisis.

BTW is Melbourne my brother lives 55+km from the CBD via a toll road. That is the equivalent to living in Pukekohe, Pokeno etc. he lives there because it was where a first home buyer could afford to buy, he didn't look to live in the inner suburbs (Manukau inwards) as it simply is out of the scope of reality.

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#1620010 31-Aug-2016 06:49

dickytim:
Why are we not moving long term unemployed out of Auckland?

The cumulative effect is more homes in Auckland available and moving people out provides more jobs in the provincial areas = win-win.

Should anyone in a state house have the right to demand they live in the most expensive city in Auckland?

We talk about a crisis, a crisis needs drastic action, drastic action like moving people who don't need to be in an area out of that area.

If we are not willing to look as something like this we need to stop whinging about the crisis.

BTW is Melbourne my brother lives 55+km from the CBD via a toll road. That is the equivalent to living in Pukekohe, Pokeno etc. he lives there because it was where a first home buyer could afford to buy, he didn't look to live in the inner suburbs (Manukau inwards) as it simply is out of the scope of reality.

Wow, I am at a loss for words.

thestokes

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#1620034 31-Aug-2016 07:53

dickytim:

Why are we not moving long term unemployed out of Auckland?

The cumulative effect is more homes in Auckland available and moving people out provides more jobs in the provincial areas = win-win.

Should anyone in a state house have the right to demand they live in the most expensive city in Auckland?

We talk about a crisis, a crisis needs drastic action, drastic action like moving people who don't need to be in an area out of that area.

If we are not willing to look as something like this we need to stop whinging about the crisis.

BTW is Melbourne my brother lives 55+km from the CBD via a toll road. That is the equivalent to living in Pukekohe, Pokeno etc. he lives there because it was where a first home buyer could afford to buy, he didn't look to live in the inner suburbs (Manukau inwards) as it simply is out of the scope of reality.

Yeah, nah... As maybe breaking up families and communities because of someones employment status isn't the most enlightened option?

frankv

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#1620047 31-Aug-2016 08:12

dickytim:

Why are we not moving long term unemployed out of Auckland?

Because they are people.

Should anyone in a state house have the right to demand they live in the most expensive city in Auckland?

We talk about a crisis, a crisis needs drastic action, drastic action like moving people who don't need to be in an area out of that area.

Why is state housing a criterion for people being allowed to live where they want? It would be much more efficient if the Govt (or employers?) were allowed to tell people where they have to live.

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#1620058 31-Aug-2016 08:34

Nowhere in the world that I know of (ok my world is not very big) allows non residents to own property. This snowball started way back in the 90s, the year after Sept 11. I watched the house prices climb, presumably because NZ is a safe haven. Since the 90s the economists have been predicting a housing crash. They say the same thing every year. The truth is, there are a lot of very rich people out there (legal or not) who want to invest or live in NZ's 'oh so pure and beautiful' country.

When's it going to end? WHen those with no reason to own property or with no legal money be eliminated, or willingly exclude themselves (ie find another foreign paradise to play in).

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#1620059 31-Aug-2016 08:38

Re carsleepers - they are real, some Australians sleep in cars too

networkn

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#1620074 31-Aug-2016 09:14

UHD:

thestokes:

Wow, just wow...

http://carsleepers.com

Domain Registered On: 2016-08-20 Can you say publicity stunt?

Nice catch.

Geektastic

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#1620099 31-Aug-2016 09:58

joker97:

Nowhere in the world that I know of (ok my world is not very big) allows non residents to own property. This snowball started way back in the 90s, the year after Sept 11. I watched the house prices climb, presumably because NZ is a safe haven. Since the 90s the economists have been predicting a housing crash. They say the same thing every year. The truth is, there are a lot of very rich people out there (legal or not) who want to invest or live in NZ's 'oh so pure and beautiful' country.

When's it going to end? WHen those with no reason to own property or with no legal money be eliminated, or willingly exclude themselves (ie find another foreign paradise to play in).

USA, UK for starters have no restrictions.

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