Advantage of fibre to the node?

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linw

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#61404 16-May-2010 14:50

All other things being equal (I know, they rarely are!), is it better to go broadband with Telecom because of their fibre cabinetisation?

If the answer is no, why did TC bother?

Or is it entirely dependant on your distance from the exchange?

nzbnw

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#330623 16-May-2010 15:04

linw:
If the answer is no, why did TC bother?

Are you referring to UCLL (un-bundling?)

linw: Or is it entirely dependant on your distance from the exchange?

That is relevant, however I don't think TCL offer UCLL connections in FTTN areas, rather placing customers on Telecom Wholesale equipment, but someone else may be able to confirm.

nzbnw

linw

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#330624 16-May-2010 15:07

Thanks. I was wondering about it for a 'normal' BB connection.

nzbnw

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#330628 16-May-2010 15:19

I'm not quite sure if you understand (forgive me if you do), UCLL is where TCL install their own equipment in a Chorus (Telecom) Exchange, which can be configured differently to the Telecom Wholesale equipment, and may or may not deliver you better sync speeds.

Distance will be the same.

Where FTTN, or cabinisation has occurred IIRC TCL do not offer UCLL from the Chorus Exchange, however as above happy to be proved incorrect or the finer details supplied.

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linw

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#330630 16-May-2010 15:33

In the case I am thinking of, my friend has his line with TCL, his tolls with Slingshot and he has dial-up through Paradise! He has just received a letter (from Telstraclear/Paradise) telling him they won't be providing dial-up from 12 June. His area has just got FTTN and his house would be a fair way from the exchange.

Just wondering if there would be advantages telling him to go to TCL for BB considering that this would give him access via the fibre link to the exchange instead of copper to the exchange.

Thanks for you replies.

Ragnor

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#330633 16-May-2010 15:43

linw: All other things being equal (I know, they rarely are!), is it better to go broadband with Telecom because of their fibre cabinetisation?

If the answer is no, why did TC bother?

Or is it entirely dependant on your distance from the exchange?

If you are connected to a cabinet your connection will be provided over Telecom wholesale equipment regardless of what ISP you use (currently no other ISP's have installed their gear in cabinets, apart from for trials).

This is in contrast to the exchanges where Orcon, Vodafone, Telstraclear and Slingshot have gear in some (but not all) exchanges.

So when connected to a cabinet:

In theory there should be no real noticiable performance difference between ISP's (including Telecom Retail/Xtra). Your data/traffic/connection travels Telecom Wholesales network to a handover point for the ISP's network. What happens after this then depends on the ISP's traffic management, peering arrangements and international capactity etc.

However, in practice the other ISP's (other than Telecom Retail) are sometimes hamstrung by handover link congestion/performance. Telecom Retail doesn't appear to have the same limitations or suffer the same problems in peak time.

So if you are connected to a cabinet and don't mind Telecom Retail's pricing and plans (which are largely less flexible than other ISP's, no data blocks etc) then yes Telecom Retail offers some advantage in peak time performance imo.

However other ISP's definately have more flexiable and more varied plan/package options.

linw

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#330635 16-May-2010 15:49

It's just that a Chorus engineer told me that the 'opposition' would not be able to use the fibre link because TCL was not obliged to install opposition gear in cabinets, only exchanges. I figured this was a cunning TCL plan to get a competitive advantage.

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Ragnor

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#330637 16-May-2010 15:55

That's wrong, Telstraclear/Orcon/Vodafone etc can install gear in cabinets, just the current pricing determination by the commerce commission is too expensive for it to be profitable.

If you are connected to a cabinet you can choose any ISP and performance will be around the same apart from the handover link in peak time issue I mentioned above which you may or may not notice.

linw

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#330648 16-May-2010 16:37

Thanks very much for the clarification - much appreciated.

maxzzz

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#330649 16-May-2010 16:39

Is the "handover" link between the cabinet/exchange and the ISP also affect national traffic?

In other words if the handover link was congested does the national traffic be affected as well during peak time?

sbiddle

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#330676 16-May-2010 17:32

What is presumably happening is that the customer is being moved onto a new TelstraClear ULL connection. They have installed their own equipment in a large number of exchanges and are moving customers across from Telecom Wholesale equipment to their own equipment.

This means that you will have to have your phone and internet with TelstraClear. Dialup is not supported because you're in effect getting a VoIP connection from the exchange into the TelstraClear IMS network. I'm unsure whether non coded toll access is available over these connections.

If you don't want your phone and internet with TelstraClear and/or want to keep dialup you'll have to move to Telecom or a provider that wholesales connections over Telecom's network.

This issue has nothing at all to do with fibre to the node.

Ragnor

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#330694 16-May-2010 17:57

Hmm he implied his friend was connected to a cabinet in one of his posts above, I doubt Telstra would be switching them to ULL if that was the case.

@linw, check your friends address on http://www.telecomwholesale.co.nz/maps

Are they connected to the exchange, a cabinet or scheduled to be connected to a cabinet?

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Ragnor

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#330698 16-May-2010 17:59

maxzzz: Is the "handover" link between the cabinet/exchange and the ISP also affect national traffic?

In other words if the handover link was congested does the national traffic be affected as well during peak time?

Yes this is congestion before it even gets into the ISP's network.

Your phone line > cabinet/exchange > backhaul network > handover links > isp's network > isp's national and international transit etc

sbiddle

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#330700 16-May-2010 18:07

Ragnor: Hmm he implied his friend was connected to a cabinet in one of his posts above, I doubt Telstra would be switching them to ULL if that was the case.

Yes - if he was connected to a cabinet he wouldn't be getting this letter however. TCL do not move any customers who are fed from (or will be fed from) a cabinet onto a ULL connection as they are smart and realise midpoint injection is a serious issue, unlike providers like Vodafone and Orcon who did this knowing the issues but put $$ ahead of the customer's wellbeing.

linw

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#330759 16-May-2010 23:26

Checked with the map reference and he is definitely on a cabinet.

Sorry to be such a nuisance - didn't expect you guys to have to go to so much trouble.

I will get to see his letter tomorrow or Tuesday so it may get clearer from that.

Ragnor

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#330775 17-May-2010 01:49

sbiddle:

Yes - if he was connected to a cabinet he wouldn't be getting this letter however. TCL do not move any customers who are fed from (or will be fed from) a cabinet onto a ULL connection as they are smart and realise midpoint injection is a serious issue, unlike providers like Vodafone and Orcon who did this knowing the issues but put $$ ahead of the customer's wellbeing.

I've heard of a few people being sent the letter from Telstraclear when they are on cabinets, TCL doesn't appear to be immune from the same mistakes as Orcon/Vodafone despite their intentions.

There have also been quite a few homeplan change over sagas, taking months, people being put onto the wrong plans etc etc.