New Home Automation Setup

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surferguy

15 posts

Geek

#191283 30-Jan-2016 18:15

Hi guys,

Im building a new house and exploring options with regards to automation. There is so much out there and am really struggling to figure out which way to go.

I have explored some of the package options out there like OneTouch and Control4 however am worried about how flexible these will be to add things in future as well as cost being prohibitive.

Must haves are:

Video 4x4 HDMI / HDBASET matrix with IR senders to send 2-3 sources (Sky, Apple TV, Blu-ray) to 4 TV zones. 4x8 or 8x8 would also be handy so can add TVs in bedrooms in future.

Audio Multi room audio amplifier x 4 rooms (8 ceiling speakers)... may change one room to full surround sound. Need to be able to play music from Spotify and would prefer volume control panels on walls in each of the 4 zones. In two zones would want the TV to be able to be played through speakers, so needs to connect with above matrix.

Lighting Control light circuits x 4, want to be able to upgrade this down the track to cover more of the house, but for now its just entertaining and living areas

Control Close curtains x 4 in main living all at once, remote open garage door, remote open front door, remote operate heatpump

Security Security system/DVR w 2-3 cameras, Doorbell/intercom, 4 PIR sensors

I don't mind having separate systems instead of itegrating everything into one... I've looked online at HDMI matrixes and multi zone audio amps which I could easily import and install, the challenge is controlling them to switch inputs. I'm not good with programming and would have to figure out how to use RS232 to do this easily. The audio would probably be ok if I can change the source from wall panels. OpenHAB looks complicated to be able to install and set up let alone program for something like this.

My budget is 10k excluding speakers and wiring.

Has anyone had any good experiences or any suggestions as to what to run with?

Thanks in advance!

Chris

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#1482027 30-Jan-2016 22:35

i think for 10k you would struggle to get what you want there.

your HDMI matrix is going to be at least 1k unless you are buying from aliexpress

think you will probably need to look at what you want to do, and then how much things cost, then either reevaluate what you want to do or increase your budget

Dunnersfella

4086 posts

Uber Geek

#1482030 30-Jan-2016 22:46

Yup - HD-BaseT matrix prices often exclude the receivers too...

And really, it's not somewhere that I'd look to save money to begin with.

overkill

222 posts

Master Geek

#1482054 30-Jan-2016 23:44

How are you planning on controlling your home, via iDevice/Android tablets and phones?

You can look into control systems like iRidium Mobile, iRule, Command Fusion, Bitwise, DemoPad (we use/install this brand) or Comfort Click and plenty more. These are relatively easy to DIY setup and can use multiple hardware controlled via one app. Global Cache do hardware controllers for IP to RS232, contact closure and IR, and now most new product have IP control, integration is very easy. DemoPad offer a unit that has RS232, contact closure, IR ports all in one unit, the Centro8.

As previous stated, don't skimp on the Matrix, I've installed dozens of cheap customer supplied units with very high failure rate. One brand Atlona comes with a 10 year hardware warranty for piece of mind, but you do pay a premium, an HDBaseT with POE receivers will set you back $4K if you get a great price from the dealer. Wirestorm are a solid brand as well with better pricing than Atlona but no 10 year warranty.

My advice if you don't go with a dedicated home automation (Control4, Lutron, Savant) company for a complete one piece control system and go down the DIY route will be to choose a sparky that has knowledge in the field, you will need them for lighting, blind and if registered security.

Read plenty and asked plenty of questions, you could do what you want for the price if you DIY and have the paid help of the electrician. The App based solutions have excellent online help sections, you can get all the codes needed to get things working.

"Setting the Standard in Quality and Commitment"

cza

27 posts

Geek

#1483294 2-Feb-2016 10:03

@overkill

Is there anywhere in NZ where I could buy Atlona HDBaseT products? wired.co.nz is the only place I have come across and they dont sell to the public.

Do you have any experience with hdanywhere products? I have been looking at these since they are a bit cheaper and I can get from Aus since the Atlona products seem to be hard to come across

surferguy

15 posts

Geek

#1486263 5-Feb-2016 21:22

Thanks for the advice guys. The budget is flexible, if I need to go over I can.

Im looking to control via tablets and phones but was also planning to mount a touchscreen/tablet somewhere if needed.

I was looking to get an HDBaseT matrix with receivers from Alibaba which should come in under 2k. I have heard the Atlona ones are good, where is the best place to get them from?

Was also looking at the below from Listening Post for the audio, has anyone had any experience with Aton multi room systems?

http://www.listeningpost.co.nz/Products/Custom-Installation-Products/Multi-Room-Audio-Multi-Room-Christchurch-Stereo-Music/DH44KT-__I.25113__C.27483__N.27756

cza

27 posts

Geek

#1487289 8-Feb-2016 09:40

surferguy:

Thanks for the advice guys. The budget is flexible, if I need to go over I can.

Im looking to control via tablets and phones but was also planning to mount a touchscreen/tablet somewhere if needed.

I was looking to get an HDBaseT matrix with receivers from Alibaba which should come in under 2k. I have heard the Atlona ones are good, where is the best place to get them from?

Was also looking at the below from Listening Post for the audio, has anyone had any experience with Aton multi room systems?

http://www.listeningpost.co.nz/Products/Custom-Installation-Products/Multi-Room-Audio-Multi-Room-Christchurch-Stereo-Music/DH44KT-__I.25113__C.27483__N.27756

Certainly this - if anyone knows where to get Atlona products from I would be interested to know.

Also the other thing I would be interested to hear from people that have a 4k hdbaset set up is how they find the quality - starting to second guess myself a little bit because hdmi 2.0a requires 18gbps and in theory to acheive 10gbps I would need to run cat 6a which I think would be big $$$$

Dunnersfella

4086 posts

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#1487294 8-Feb-2016 10:13

Cat 6a won't give you 18GBPS for the UHD Blu-ray standard.

The only way to achieve this is to run dual Cat6 cables. HDBaseT is yet to support this approach.

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DarthKermit

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#1487305 8-Feb-2016 11:06

^^^

With these increasing demands for bandwidth in consumer electronics, I wonder if we'll start to see fibre-optics replace fixed copper Ethernet cabling in homes?

Jase2985

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#1487324 8-Feb-2016 11:53

that would require a huge huge swing in the consumer appliance market, as essentially the whole market from switchs to routers, home theatre to tv's etc would need to change to fibre

jnimmo

1097 posts

Uber Geek

#1487383 8-Feb-2016 12:38

Has anyone looked at/used the Just Add Power HD over IP products?

Looks interesting, put in a transmitter for each source, a receiver for each TV and a managed switch (Cisco SG300) and it seems to control the managed switch to route traffic.

'Up to a maximum of 4000 transmitters' - which suggests maybe it creates a VLAN for each input and dynamically moves the receivers between VLANs depending on the source

Dunnersfella

4086 posts

Uber Geek

#1487390 8-Feb-2016 12:49

Video over IP is the future.

You're going to see some very confused installers out there soon...

surferguy

15 posts

Geek

#1492337 14-Feb-2016 23:37

There seem to be lots of systems out there claiming to be able to send 4k over a single Cat6 cable, is the quality likely to not be 4k?

Can anyone recommend where to get a good HDMI / HDBaseT matrix from?

Also keen to hear anyones experiences with any of the home automation systems mentioned above?

Cheers

Chris

richms

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#1492342 15-Feb-2016 00:05

surferguy:

There seem to be lots of systems out there claiming to be able to send 4k over a single Cat6 cable, is the quality likely to not be 4k?

Can anyone recommend where to get a good HDMI / HDBaseT matrix from?

Also keen to hear anyones experiences with any of the home automation systems mentioned above?

It will be HDMI 1.4 rates - so 24/25/30 Hz, 8 bit etc. HDMI 2.0 added 60Hz, and then you have to worry about if they start the 3d trend up again which will need even more, or perhaps decent framerates will become a thing and need even more. Copper is at its limit right now so I am just waiting to see what happens since if it starts needing 4 Cat-6a's to carry 120Hz 4k 3d or 8k or whatever comes next, then that is getting a little absurd.

Richard rich.ms

surferguy

15 posts

Geek

#1492884 15-Feb-2016 21:31

Heres an HDBaseT extender that claims to be able to send 4K at 60Hz up to 40m over one Cat6, which may not be that far but would still suit a house. And pretty affordable at USD$99...

http://www.amazon.com/AV-Access%C2%AE4K-Extender-Warranty-Bi-directional/dp/B019MADOS8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1455524652&sr=8-1&keywords=4k+hdbaset+matrix+hdmi2.0

surferguy

15 posts

Geek

#1492893 15-Feb-2016 21:53

I think I answered my own question above, looks like colour depth reduces as you go up to 60Hz.

Heres a pretty affordable 4K 4x4 matrix that might pair well with the above senders and make a pretty cost effective distribution system.

http://www.amazon.com/VoxLink-Matrix-Switch-supports-bandwidth/dp/B019YT79TM/ref=sr_1_1?srs=11458457011&ie=UTF8&qid=1455525890&sr=8-1&keywords=matrix+4k+hdmi2.0

Can anyone see any issues? It doesn't support IR control but can get a separate controller for that.

I think I will keep the blueray player separate in my main lounge as will easier to hook up 5.1 audio rather than sending it through the house, so would likely only be Sky HD and Apple TV playing through the matrix anyway, so not too concerned about 4K quality... most likely will be stuck with 1080p TV broadcasts for a few years to come.

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