When and why did TV2 go 1080i?

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cyril7

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#384137 24-Sep-2010 19:10

Looking forward to 5.1. Bring it on!!!

Yes please, sign of a modern broadcaster, good HD ability and DD, looking forward to it.

Cheers
Cyril

Mac2008

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#384866 27-Sep-2010 12:06

hdinsider:
Mac2008:
hdinsider: I wonder what brought on the change? Pressure from top management to go to "Full-HD" no doubt caused by TV sales hype...

Actually it was the fact that TVNZ finally completed their huge upgrade of their broadcast system and so they are now better able to broadcast in HD. We should now see more actual HD content broadcast. The old system made it hard to broadcast HD programs.

Their HD MPEG 4 encoders have always been capable of producing 1080i and regardless of source material and processing, cross conversion to 1080i was always possible from day 1.

Absolutely true, but it wasn't the encoders that were upgraded, it was a move to a fully computerized broadcast system.

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jol

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#384961 27-Sep-2010 14:44

I just hope that TVNZ still have the ability to use 720p temporarily when appropriate. That way we can still get free to air sporting events in 50 frames per second, e.g. for the Rugby World Cup next year.

TechnoGuy001

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#385076 27-Sep-2010 18:05

jol: I just hope that TVNZ still have the ability to use 720p temporarily when appropriate. That way we can still get free to air sporting events in 50 frames per second, e.g. for the Rugby World Cup next year.

I wouldn't hold your breath on that.

Jaxson

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#385346 28-Sep-2010 09:50

TechnoGuy001:
jol: I just hope that TVNZ still have the ability to use 720p temporarily when appropriate. That way we can still get free to air sporting events in 50 frames per second, e.g. for the Rugby World Cup next year.

I wouldn't hold your breath on that.

+1

I actually haven't really experienced the interlacing problem with high speed action etc that everyone seemed to worry about. Any full HD source programme, the likes of CSI / Lie to me etc, looks stunning in 1080i. I've only noticed a few issues with some SD programmes upscaled to 1080i, like nightline etc.

Point is I don't think it will be a problem either way with the rugby world cup etc.

mm1352000

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#385489 28-Sep-2010 14:45

Jaxson:
TechnoGuy001:
jol: I just hope that TVNZ still have the ability to use 720p temporarily when appropriate. That way we can still get free to air sporting events in 50 frames per second, e.g. for the Rugby World Cup next year.

I wouldn't hold your breath on that.
+1

I actually haven't really experienced the interlacing problem with high speed action etc that everyone seemed to worry about. Any full HD source programme, the likes of CSI / Lie to me etc, looks stunning in 1080i. I've only noticed a few issues with some SD programmes upscaled to 1080i, like nightline etc.

Point is I don't think it will be a problem either way with the rugby world cup etc.

Some cheaper video cards/receivers don't implement high quality motion/vector adaptive deinterlacing algorithms. As a result, the people that view interlaced material with these devices will often encounter jaggies/artifacts/blurring etc. You usually get what you pay for in that regard.
I think it is very unlikely that TVNZ would change back to 720p *just* for sporting events. You don't see TV3 doing it for motorsport etc.

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jol

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#385538 28-Sep-2010 16:10

Jaxson:
TechnoGuy001:
jol: I just hope that TVNZ still have the ability to use 720p temporarily when appropriate. That way we can still get free to air sporting events in 50 frames per second, e.g. for the Rugby World Cup next year.

I wouldn't hold your breath on that.
+1

I actually haven't really experienced the interlacing problem with high speed action etc that everyone seemed to worry about. Any full HD source programme, the likes of CSI / Lie to me etc, looks stunning in 1080i. I've only noticed a few issues with some SD programmes upscaled to 1080i, like nightline etc.

Point is I don't think it will be a problem either way with the rugby world cup etc.

I don't dispute that 1080i is clearly the best option for pre-recorded TV shows. It is my understanding that the shows you mentioned, along with most others from the USA are captured (to film) at 24 frames per second (same as movies), which for broadcast over here needs to sped up to 25 frames per second and then interlaced using telecine 2:2 pulldown. If this is at 1080i then ideally the receiving 1080p TV would weave the two fields belonging to the same original frame together and display it at 1080p25, so no deinterlacing is actually performed, just weaving fields together. I don't think many TVs are actually smart enough to do this (detect when the 50i interlaced source is actually 25p), does anyone here know? Anyway the point is that if the source material is 24p/25p, then there no (or very little) benefit in terms of the smoothness of motion in using 720p over 1080i, so one might as well go for the extra resolution.

On the other hand, if the source material is being captured at 50 frames per second (50p), such as most cameras used for live broadcasts (as far as I know), then interlacing this will either cut out half of the frames (so it can be interlaced in the same way as film), resulting in a jerkier film-like picture, or taking only half of the lines from each frame (alternating between odd and even lines), which would mean deinterlacing artifacts.

So clearly the best solution would be to change HDTV format depending on what is being broadcast. Does anyone know if anyone does this overseas?

Anyway, like TechnoGuy001 says, I'm not holding my breath.

TechnoGuy001

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#385541 28-Sep-2010 16:17

So clearly the best solution would be to change HDTV format depending on what is being broadcast. Does anyone know if anyone does this overseas?.

Thats what I wanted too.

richms

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#385549 28-Sep-2010 16:36

jol:
I don't dispute that 1080i is clearly the best option for pre-recorded TV shows. It is my understanding that the shows you mentioned, along with most others from the USA are captured (to film) at 24 frames per second (same as movies), which for broadcast over here needs to sped up to 25 frames per second and then interlaced using telecine 2:2 pulldown. If this is at 1080i then ideally the receiving 1080p TV would weave the two fields belonging to the same original frame together and display it at 1080p25, so no deinterlacing is actually performed, just weaving fields together. I don't think many TVs are actually smart enough to do this (detect when the 50i interlaced source is actually 25p), does anyone here know? Anyway the point is that if the source material is 24p/25p, then there no (or very little) benefit in terms of the smoothness of motion in using 720p over 1080i, so one might as well go for the extra resolution.

That is film mode detection, has been the most basic of deinterlace techniques forever. Just watch to see when they add an interlaced ticker onto film mode video to see the jaggies appear on that. Often they will appear and disappear as the deinterlacer changes modes, and you can see the vertical resolution of the picture change as well as it goes between film mode and adaptive.

Richard rich.ms

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