Simple, EPG website, need advice please!

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codyc1515

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Topic # 56613 18-Jan-2010 22:36

HI all, I have been working on a new website for the last few months in my spare time.
It's avaliable at http://www.codycooper.co.nz/epg/
I was wondering if you all could take a look, and maybe give me a few suggestions.

Cool Features:

Now has realtime search, on most channels!

Quick, easy to use!

No ads!

If anyone has any kind of sensible suggestions for features to add, please post!

Many thanks to the various broadcasters for allowing us to re-use their EPG data, we now have such channels as TV ONE, C4, and Triangle|Stratos!

--cody

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Reply # 291006 18-Jan-2010 22:49

Have you gained permission from the various channels to display/make available their EPG? Simply putting a disclaimer at the bottom of the screen does not mean you can freely copy and display it on your site.

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codyc1515

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Reply # 291012 18-Jan-2010 22:55

ZollyMonsta: Have you gained permission from the various channels to display/make available their EPG? Simply putting a disclaimer at the bottom of the screen does not mean you can freely copy and display it on your site.

As far as I was aware, under Copyright Act 1994 No 143 (as at 01 December 2008), Section 2.A.I:

Copyright in the broadcast is not infringed if and to the extent that the broadcast—

(i) Is made for reception in the area in which the cable programme service is provided; and

The guide data is recieved through that broadcast, therefore I believe that law applies, allowing me to redistribute it "in the area in which the cable programme service is provided".

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nate

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Reply # 291022 19-Jan-2010 00:06

Good luck with the EPG data, I know that the networks are pissy about it being used without licensing which is ridiculous. If I know what's on TV, I'm going to watch it and that's more eyeballs watching their ads. It's like a restaurant keeping their menu a secret.

/end rant

I would love a service where I could mark my favourite shows and I was emailed a reminder before they start. Something I've always wanted to do myself, but just don't have time.

sbiddle

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Reply # 291042 19-Jan-2010 07:49

Good luck.

There stands a good chance of a phonecall or email from a lawyer very soon, as is the case with everybody in the past who has tried such a thing.

Networks in NZ regard their EPG data as the single most important piece of IP that they have.

mentalinc

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Reply # 291065 19-Jan-2010 08:36

Well that was fast.

Your pulled page is not HTML compliant code (no doctype)
Suggest you make it compliant..

Would be keen to see the code used to display it, assume you were converting a xml file to be displayed via html.

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grolschie

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Reply # 291076 19-Jan-2010 08:51

Very handy webpage. You might want to get some legal advice though. I am guessing that the logos are copyright also.

http://validator.w3.org/ might help with the HTML.

codyc1515

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Reply # 291080 19-Jan-2010 08:57

mentalinc: Well that was fast.

Your pulled page is not HTML compliant code (no doctype)
Suggest you make it compliant..

Would be keen to see the code used to display it, assume you were converting a xml file to be displayed via html.

The page is now back up again, as I have legal advice that it would not be within the bounds of the law to prosecute a 14-year old boy, and also the code I have to process the tv data is raw xml direct from a broadcast somewhere...

sbiddle

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Reply # 291082 19-Jan-2010 08:59

codyc1515:
mentalinc: Well that was fast.

Your pulled page is not HTML compliant code (no doctype)
Suggest you make it compliant..

Would be keen to see the code used to display it, assume you were converting a xml file to be displayed via html.

The page is now back up again, as I have legal advice that it would not be within the bounds of the law to prosecute a 14-year old boy, and also the code I have to process the tv data is raw xml direct from a broadcast somewhere...

It doesn't matter how old you are - a breach of copright is still a breach of copyright.

There have been around 3 or 4 NZ based sites that have all done what you've done in the past and have had to pull their sites after being threatened with legal action by lawyers representing the copyright holders (TVNZ and Sky in two of the cases).

This doesn't mean they will do it to you..You can try your luck - If you do contact you and request you to stop I just hope you do seek proper legal advice before you choose to ignore them.

codyc1515

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Reply # 291099 19-Jan-2010 09:27

sbiddle:
codyc1515:
mentalinc: Well that was fast.

Your pulled page is not HTML compliant code (no doctype)
Suggest you make it compliant..

Would be keen to see the code used to display it, assume you were converting a xml file to be displayed via html.

The page is now back up again, as I have legal advice that it would not be within the bounds of the law to prosecute a 14-year old boy, and also the code I have to process the tv data is raw xml direct from a broadcast somewhere...

It doesn't matter how old you are - a breach of copright is still a breach of copyright.

There have been around 3 or 4 NZ based sites that have all done what you've done in the past and have had to pull their sites after being threatened with legal action by lawyers representing the copyright holders (TVNZ and Sky in two of the cases).

This doesn't mean they will do it to you..You can try your luck - If you do contact you and request you to stop I just hope you do seek proper legal advice before you choose to ignore them.

Im afraid it actually does matter, see here:

Any sum ordered to be paid pursuant to section 283(f) in respect of the loss of or damage to property shall be limited to the cost of replacement or (as the case may require) the cost of repair, and shall not include any loss or damage of a consequential nature.

and yes, I will seek proper legal advice, once they contact me.

codyc1515

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Reply # 291103 19-Jan-2010 09:39

grolschie: Very handy webpage. You might want to get some legal advice though. I am guessing that the logos are copyright also.

http://validator.w3.org/ might help with the HTML.

I have now resolved the html validation issue, and believe that the logo's are being used in accordance with "honest practises".

ZollyMonsta

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Reply # 291110 19-Jan-2010 09:55

Ok, so you know you're likely to be breaching copyright and you are relying on the fact that you believe you WON'T be taken to court. Having worked with EPG and suppliers I can tell you now that you will end up with no end of trouble if you don't obtain permission. Trying to hide behind the fact you're 14 and that they can't prosecute you is simply, stupid.

Check out my LPFM Radio Station at www.thecheese.co.nz

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codyc1515

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Reply # 291128 19-Jan-2010 10:24

ZollyMonsta: Ok, so you know you're likely to be breaching copyright and you are relying on the fact that you believe you WON'T be taken to court. Having worked with EPG and suppliers I can tell you now that you will end up with no end of trouble if you don't obtain permission. Trying to hide behind the fact you're 14 and that they can't prosecute you is simply, stupid.

Look if they send me a request to remove it, I may.
However, I have not been requested to yet, and I did contact all of the broadcasters, so I know what I am and aren't allowed to do.

I'm not trying to hide behind my age, only provide a helpful service, which I believe is within the law,
if they wanted to me to get rid of it they would have said.

--cody

mentalinc

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Reply # 291130 19-Jan-2010 10:26

Looks good. but 2 warnings on validaitiy that can be easiy fixed

should be

and your img tag on line 10 is missing /> at the end.

Would be cool to see multiple stations side by side instead of 1 at a time.

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wellygary

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Reply # 291134 19-Jan-2010 10:42

codyc1515:
Im afraid it actually does matter, see here:

Any sum ordered to be paid pursuant to section 283(f) in respect of the loss of or damage to property shall be limited to the cost of replacement or (as the case may require) the cost of repair, and shall not include any loss or damage of a consequential nature.

and yes, I will seek proper legal advice, once they contact me.

If you are going to quote legislation, be aware that under the Children, young Persons and their Families Act you can be charged as an adult if the Judge so determines,

http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1989/0024/latest/DLM153436.html?search=qs_all%40act%40bill%40regulation_prosecution+child_resel&p=1#DLM153436

283 Orders of the court
Where a charge against a young person is proved before a Youth Court, the court may, subject to sections 284 to 290, do 1 or more of the following:\
(a) discharge the young person from the proceedings without further order or penalty:
(b) admonish the young person:
(c) order that the young person come before the court, if called upon within 12 months after the making of the order, so that the court may take further action under this section:
(d) impose such fine as could have been imposed by a District Court if the young person were an adult and had been convicted of the offence following a summary hearing in a District Court, and exercise any of the powers conferred on a District Court by sections 81 and 83 of the Summary Proceedings Act 1957 (other than the power to impose a period of imprisonment in default of payment):

ALso fines and penalties relating to copyright infringement are not related to the loss or damage to property, and judges get snippy with flagrancy,

http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1994/0143/latest/DLM346857.html#DLM346857

Where, in proceedings under this Part of this Act,—
(a) The infringement is established; and
(b) The court is satisfied that it is proper to do so, having regard to
(i) The flagrancy of the infringement; and
(ii) Any benefit accruing to the defendant by reason of the infringement; and
(iii) All other relevant matters,—

the court may award such additional damages as the justice of the case may require.

eXDee

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Reply # 291163 19-Jan-2010 13:00

sbiddle:Networks in NZ regard their EPG data as the single most important piece of IP that they have.

Which is completely stupid and petty. It doesn't make any sense, whats wrong with essentially advertising their content?

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