2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2451698 31-Mar-2020 17:35

mattwnz:

I think it is a good problem to have, if we do manage to starve the virus of hosts and kill it off, and at least run a domestic economy. Other countries may have to be in lockdown for 6 months or even longer, on and off, just to flatten the curve to reduce the demand on the health system, but will end up resulting in a lot of people getting it. IMO we don't really want to have to go in and out of lockdown, and don't think people will be happy if that occurs, and we may then have to look at what Australia appears to be doing and hibernate the economy. IMO we want to go hard and go strong now , especially as we are heading into winter, so the earlier the better

Whats Australia doing though? That we can do? Apart from allowing barbers to open. I agree re domestic economy, Kiwis can be tourists, imported goods still coming in, exports going out.

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#2451702 31-Mar-2020 17:39

tdgeek:

Whats Australia doing though? That we can do? Apart from allowing barbers to open. I agree re domestic economy, Kiwis can be tourists, imported goods still coming in, exports going out.

My understanding is that everyone entering Oz country is now being quarantined https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/30/treated-worse-than-criminals-australian-arrivals-put-into-quarantine-lament-conditions , so not just those who don't have self isolation plans, or are showing symptoms.

Allowing hairdressers to remain open IMO is not good. How can someone cut hair and retain a 2 metre distance.

tdgeek

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#2451703 31-Mar-2020 17:39

heapsort:

tdgeek:

Now that we are locked down, the virus theoretically has nowhere to go. Its limited to slight risk at supermarket, the common risk of flouters, and the new risk of supermarkets open on Easter Sunday, dumbest idea ever.

I am not sure how it is the dumbest idea ever. Actually, I am not convinced it is a dumb idea at all. It could be argued that every day of trading is a risk, but it is probably more accurate that every shopper outing is a risk and it helps to spread that over a reasonable amount of time in a seven day week. If supermarkets were to close on Good Friday and Easter Sunday, the busier trade on Thursday/Saturday/Monday may well pose an even greater risk of community transmission.

If two days of closure was to bring a significant benefit, surely we should restrict supermarkets to five days of trading per week every week of level four. Just like in our childhoods, for those of us above a certain age. Well, not quite like it: they would still be able to sell milk, something they could not do forty years ago.

They are open Monday through Thursday, and Easter Saturday. And Easter Monday. Who goes to the supey many days a week? Im sure many are making it as less as possible. It worked fine every other year. I say give the lowly paid and hard working and stressed employees a real weekend.

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#2451706 31-Mar-2020 17:44

mattwnz:

tdgeek:

Whats Australia doing though? That we can do? Apart from allowing barbers to open. I agree re domestic economy, Kiwis can be tourists, imported goods still coming in, exports going out.

My understanding is that everyone entering Oz country is now being quarantined https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/30/treated-worse-than-criminals-australian-arrivals-put-into-quarantine-lament-conditions , so not just those who don't have self isolation plans or are showing symptoms.

Ok, thanks. Good, but a pretty minor point. We already suffered through incoming tourists, then many Kiwis, the quarantine issue is now really small numbers. And now hotels are empty so easy to do, wasn't possible before. But yes, a little helps I guess. Not sure how many are coming in here now, a mates kid works at Novotel ChCh, which are taking them. No arrivals yesterday or today.

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#2451712 31-Mar-2020 17:53

mattwnz:

My understanding is that everyone entering Oz country is now being quarantined https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/30/treated-worse-than-criminals-australian-arrivals-put-into-quarantine-lament-conditions , so not just those who don't have self isolation plans, or are showing symptoms.

Allowing hairdressers to remain open IMO is not good. How can someone cut hair and retain a 2 metre distance.

I feel the general consensus here is that we should have done more and sooner. I see a lot of hindsight in that. Jan 26 block China, like everyone else, that's not bad, then it rapidly went pear shaped. We hung on to clear tourists and Kiwis when we were very low, so then it was an ok call. Had no choice to hang on further for large numbers of Kiwis. Im sure if we knew now what we knew then we would have been better with airport arrivals. Same with flouters with the Alert level 4. I feel we did what we had to, about the right time. Wish it could all have been done Jan 26 then we would be clean. and broke :-) We can test more now, plus everyone (almost) is in lockdown. I just EVERYONE who has a possible symptom, calls Healthline and gets tested or at least gets told to do another 14 days, then we are well on the way.

gchiu

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#2451715 31-Mar-2020 17:56

mattwnz:

IMO they should also be temperature testing anyone who goes into the supermarket with a scanner, which is easy to do. In China it appears they are now doing this as they return to some state of normality.

The experience shows that this is almost completely worthless as a screening method.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/02/19/health/coronavirus-airport-temperature-checks/index.html

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heapsort

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#2451716 31-Mar-2020 17:56

tdgeek:

heapsort:

I am not sure how it is the dumbest idea ever. Actually, I am not convinced it is a dumb idea at all. It could be argued that every day of trading is a risk, but it is probably more accurate that every shopper outing is a risk and it helps to spread that over a reasonable amount of time in a seven day week. If supermarkets were to close on Good Friday and Easter Sunday, the busier trade on Thursday/Saturday/Monday may well pose an even greater risk of community transmission.

If two days of closure was to bring a significant benefit, surely we should restrict supermarkets to five days of trading per week every week of level four. Just like in our childhoods, for those of us above a certain age. Well, not quite like it: they would still be able to sell milk, something they could not do forty years ago.

They are open Monday through Thursday, and Easter Saturday. And Easter Monday. Who goes to the supey many days a week? Im sure many are making it as less as possible. It worked fine every other year. I say give the lowly paid and hard working and stressed employees a real weekend.

It worked fine every other year through substantially busier trading days around and in between the two public holidays. Doing the same this year, that busier trading might well have increased the risk of community transmission. The government weighed this among other factors, and allowed them to open one of the two days. Seems reasonable to me.

It's also reported that staff will "be able to volunteer" and "will not be obliged" to work the Easter Sunday.

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#2451719 31-Mar-2020 18:00

mattwnz:

Allowing hairdressers to remain open IMO is not good. How can someone cut hair and retain a 2 metre distance.

mattwnz

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#2451722 31-Mar-2020 18:10

tdgeek:

Ok, thanks. Good, but a pretty minor point. We already suffered through incoming tourists, then many Kiwis, the quarantine issue is now really small numbers. And now hotels are empty so easy to do, wasn't possible before. But yes, a little helps I guess. Not sure how many are coming in here now, a mates kid works at Novotel ChCh, which are taking them. No arrivals yesterday or today.

I am not sure of incoming numbers, but over time there will likely be more people coming in once people can finally manage to get connecting flights. The likelihood that someone is infected is also likely to increase over time as well as it spreads in other countries. So I think it would be prudent and safe that we do make 100% sure that we don't import any more cases by just doing a blanket quarantine, especially if the numbers coming in are now low. https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12321119

Apparently there are now 14 significant clusters in NZ, eight more than yesterday which is a concern https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/412986/covid-19-live-updates-developments-in-nz-and-around-the-world-on-31-march

gchiu

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#2451723 31-Mar-2020 18:13

In Wuhan no one was allowed out to purchase groceries. Everything was delivered from the shops. Seems sensible if you have the workforce .. all those taxi drivers out of work could be employed. Easier to teach infection control to a small group of people.

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#2451724 31-Mar-2020 18:27

Amazing the number of people walking past here that I have never seen before around here.

And obviously haven't been around here before by what they look at, as if it's the first time they have seen it.

More than pre lock down. Even lycra clad cyclists (I've never seen one here before) several times.

Good to see people exercising,but I do wonder where they all come from.

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mattwnz

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#2451726 31-Mar-2020 18:30

gchiu:

The experience shows that this is almost completely worthless as a screening method.

This article discusses them doing it in China, so not sure if they are doing things differently, using different equipment, or whether it is about making people feel safer? The problem is there is a lot of conflicting info out there. https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/03/can-china-return-normalcy-while-keeping-coronavirus-check

dejadeadnz

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#2451734 31-Mar-2020 18:54

Grunta47:

I knew exactly who he was talking about and undoubtedly so did many people here. Pedantic point scoring is such a waste of time and effort.

You also don't seem to get it. The point isn't whether he got the title of the person right. It's the unexplained and unjustified (he might have an underlying point but it hasn't been fully developed) comment that Mr Bush was sowing confusion etc, set against the background of that elementary error, that I contended to be a challenge to anyone taking his underlying assertion seriously. But hey you keep to your strawman.

neb

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#2451740 31-Mar-2020 19:01

tdgeek:
I feel if we have a couple of Level 4's we will be well in control. Dampening hotspots more than using the fire.

That's pretty much what the hammer and the dance talks about, in a great amount of detail. Good reading for those who haven't seen it yet.

gchiu

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#2451741 31-Mar-2020 19:07

mattwnz:

This article discusses them doing it in China, so not sure if they are doing things differently, using different equipment, or whether it is about making people feel safer? The problem is there is a lot of conflicting info out there. https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/03/can-china-return-normalcy-while-keeping-coronavirus-check

the videos I watched showed medical workers checking their temperatures twice daily and reporting them by apps on their phones.

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