2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

Forums › Health and fitness › 2019 Novel Coronavirus Covid-19 Discussion

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#2513091 26-Jun-2020 16:44

Apparently Hotels are Prisons again , should these people have considered travel is not for them.

3 Day isolation complaints.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12343318

""
Despite taking great pains to keep her bubble intact and not interacting closely with anyone else, she says she has been ordered to stay in her room without natural sunlight or fresh air until Sunday when test results are due back.

At this stage she was told it would be necessary to stay in her room for 48 hours. Today that increased to 72 hours. Despite this, the woman was also told there was no need for a fresh Covid test. She had tested negative earlier in the week.

The four isolated travellers - including one who is expecting a child - were confined to tiny rooms, some without natural light. This was playing havoc on their mental health.
""

What about facetime and , zoom , a good old bingewatch ( Do we have to give them netflics on the house too ), surely with all our technology you are not truly alone.

Cry Havoc indeed. Mines the breakfast with double bacon

mattwnz

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#2513100 26-Jun-2020 16:53

Calling it 'room detention' doesn't help. It sounds like it is supposed to be a punishment. When infact it is just doing what is normal in the current circumstances the world is in.

IMO if people want to return to a covid free country, they should be doing their part. We were all in what could be described as 'home detention' for many weeks in level 4, and many of these people returning to NZ didn't have to do this.

Batman

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#2513111 26-Jun-2020 17:06

Handle9:

Rikkitic:

I have avoided this discussion until now because I did not feel I have anything to contribute that others haven't already done to death. As the saying goes, I am not a lawyer and I am also not a medical expert or health care professional.

Anyway, here is my highly inexpert opinion on the matter at hand: As a vulnerable individual, I was, and remain, extremely grateful for the actions of our authorities in limiting the spread of Covid19. I believe they got a lot more right than they got wrong. The lax and incoherent 'she'll be right' actions at the border are inexcusable and deplorable, but they don't appear to have led to any new major outbreaks. Maybe we have just been lucky.

I don't think the authorities are lying through their teeth to cover their sloppiness. I think they made some big mistakes and have done their best to rectify those.

It is intriguing to see how quickly the PM and Dr Bloemfield went from hero to zero. The media, and some posters here, remind me of geese. Anyone who has ever walked past some will know what I mean. They scatter like cowards as you approach, then gang up and come after you honking bravely once you are safely past.

Of course things could still take a turn for the worst, but as of right now, we seem to be one of the few places in the world where the virus has been contained, with no sign so far of new community transmission. People are able to go shopping and participate in other daily activities without feeling they are taking their lives in their hands every time they go out. That is certainly worth something. Most of the world still sees New Zealand as an extremely desirable place to be.

Criticism is warranted where justified, and some bad mistakes were made. That shouldn't be glossed over. But who would we replace Jacinda Ardern and Ashley Bloemfield with? I am glad they are running the show and I can't think of anyone I would rather have in their place. They and many others are doing the best they can in extraordinary circumstances. Instead of honking at them, we should be thanking them. But that is just my opinion.

You are being exceptionally unkind to geese. Some of the posts on here are very revealing of peoples character. Fear, panic and anger does very strange things to people. The smug sense of superiority that New Zealand had has been burst quite dramatically.

Ardern is a politician, Bloomfield is head of a part of a large organisation. They aren't saints, they aren't the devil.Politicians lie and deflect blame, large organisations doing highly complex tasks have all sorts of coordination problems and screw ups.

Man bites dog, more news at 11.

There's so much truth in one sentence.

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#2513114 26-Jun-2020 17:11

On a day when Mr Trump once again blamed china, played down deaths and again said if they didn't test there would be no cases. It's good that the arts and entertainment industry is back making comedies.

Oh wait...

Batman

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#2513120 26-Jun-2020 17:25

MAGA!

freitasm

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#2513200 26-Jun-2020 18:31

cshwone:

From todays press release at:

https://www.health.govt.nz/news-media/media-releases/1-new-case-covid-19-3

"We have had 142 people who will not be tested because of reasons such as being a child, being part off repositioning crew, currently being overseas or they are refusing a test. 71 people have refused testing."

Words fail me.

From https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12343351

Director general of health Ashley Bloomfield had previously said during a media stand-up as those people were now outside managed isolation, they had to provide informed consent to be tested.

"We simply can't force a procedure on them," he said.

"If we felt they were presenting a risk to the community then we could. We don't in this case, remembering most of them will have completed their 14 days."

University of Otago law professor Andrew Geddis said once a person was released from isolation - those known not to have the virus, and quarantine - for those who do, they were no longer subject to the Health Act Notice that required testing while in isolation or quarantine.

"So if the ministry now says to them, 'please take a test', they are legally free to say, 'no', just as you or I would be."

It could not be required simply to "save the ministry's blushes", Geddis said.

"If the ministry really wants to test such folk who don't consent, they'll have to do so using individual orders under the Health Act - orders that say 'such and such a person must present themselves for medical examination'.

"Whether such orders are then justified depends on the individual facts, such as: What actual risk is there that each individual person could now have Covid-19?"

People in isolation/quarantine under the Health Act notice from April 9 were required to submit themselves "as soon as possible" for testing.

This included mouth or nose swabs.

At the end of 14 days' isolation/quarantine, they could be released unless they did not meet "low risk indicators".

In order to check they did meet those indicators, they could be tested (including mouth or nose swabs).

"So, from April 9 until June 23, all returnees legally could be tested twice, on arriving into and leaving isolation/quarantine.

"But once you are out of isolation/quarantine, then the legal grounds for that testing ends, and there is no general legal power to require a test from anyone who is out in the community."

So, in summary, 71 people are just being dicks. It doesn't cost them anything. It's a 15 seconds swab. But they are dicks.

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Batman

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#2513214 26-Jun-2020 19:02

kingdragonfly

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#2513218 26-Jun-2020 19:13

Washington Post: Tesla gave workers permission to stay home rather than risk getting covid-19. Then it sent termination notices.

A day before their employment was threatened, two workers had spoken publicly of their concerns about conditions inside a plant

When he defiantly reopened the company’s plant in Fremont, Calif., against county orders last month, Elon Musk promised Tesla employees they could stay home if they felt uneasy. They would not be penalized, he said.

If “you feel uncomfortable coming back to work at this time, please do not feel obligated to do so,” he wrote in an email sent to the company’s factory workers in early May that was viewed by The Washington Post.

Nonetheless, two Tesla workers say they received termination notices alleging a “failure to return to work” after they opted to take unpaid leave to protect themselves and their family members when the factory restarted production the second week of May.

The workers ... believe they received the notifications for speaking up about their concerns over working conditions at the plant.

...Their concerns about safety are shared by a half-dozen workers who spoke with The Post, some on the condition of anonymity for fear of losing their jobs. They said that Tesla is failing to follow social distancing guidelines, with lax enforcement of rules concerning masks and sanitation of machinery. They also complain of little transparency by the company about new cases of infection, as well as its response.

Employees are “hovering over each other,” one worker said. Some workers disappear for two weeks and their peers are told they’re “sick,” without further explanation, another worker said. Supervisors cite health privacy law in not disclosing particular cases, but workers say Tesla hasn’t even described broadly how widespread the novel coronavirus is at the plant.
...
Tesla’s standoff, first with public health officials, then with its own workers, has become one of the most dramatic corporate battles taking place over the response to the global coronavirus pandemic. Musk and the company have argued that the work is essential, something the county disputed. Some workers say that the company’s opaque approach is endangering their lives to build cars.

Companies around the world are struggling to balance measures to limit the spread of the virus with the need to reopen. Amazon, for example, has kept its warehouses running as essential for supply, but dozens of cases have been reported there. (Amazon founder and chief executive Jeff Bezos owns The Washington Post.) Grocery stores, too, have seen a spread of cases.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/06/25/tesla-plant-firings/

xlinknz

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#2513220 26-Jun-2020 19:18

@Batman

This was an interesting read on A J Hackett and 'Corporate Welfare'

frankv

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#2513224 26-Jun-2020 19:27

Batman: Free holiday in luxury 5 star hotel. Why not.

Put them into the Ibis then... it's a pit.

ezbee

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#2513226 26-Jun-2020 19:40

A.J Hacket thing.

If it was a publicly listed company on share-market at least you would have some audited accounts and financial reports to see what is going on.
Here you just have the rich listing owners saying their need the money and their own pockets are not deep enough.

Being public money , I think we are owed a full accounting of precisely where this is going , obviously not just the workers earning << 100K per annum, at about 250K per employee.

It would seem to be a business that could go on ice and tick over if the owners wished it to, and then once world is back its all gravy.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/300041859/aj-hackett-payout-corporate-welfare-for-richlisters-economist-says

""
AJ Hackett Bungy is owned by Bungy New Zealand, which has three shareholders – Fun Innovators NZ, owned by Van Asch and John Ward, Trojan Holdings, owned by Sir John Davies, and Gulley Holdings, owned by Andrew and Claire Brinsley and Farry & Co Trustees.

Davies was cited in the NBR’s Rich List as being worth $140 million. His company also owns NZSki which operates The Remarkables, Coronet Peak and Mt Hutt ski areas.

The former mayor also owns millions of dollars in Queenstown property.

Van Asch owns a number of properties, including one in Dalefield with a valuation of almost $7m.
""

Left me feeling like someone stole my car , well my tax money anyway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcCoKuk5mc4

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xlinknz

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#2513228 26-Jun-2020 19:54

@ezbee and @batman

This is what can occur when big names and big brands lobby govt and even when covid-19 wasn't an issue, why use ones own money when the govt is printing it

From memory a number of economists have advised caution before pumping money into some covid-19 affected sectors/businesses

Geektastic

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#2513267 26-Jun-2020 21:13

Batman:

MAGA!

I saw a ute in Martinborough with a MAGA sticker in it. As I walked by, I looked at what was written underneath MAGA. It said "Make Ardern Go Away"!

Scott3

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#2513289 26-Jun-2020 22:59

xlinknz:

@ezbee and @batman

This is what can occur when big names and big brands lobby govt and even when covid-19 wasn't an issue, why use ones own money when the govt is printing it

From memory a number of economists have advised caution before pumping money into some covid-19 affected sectors/businesses

Government should be at least taking a sizable chunk of equity (50%?) in any business that it bails out.

Batman

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#2513519 27-Jun-2020 07:56

frankv:
Batman: Free holiday in luxury 5 star hotel. Why not.

Put them into the Ibis then... it's a pit.

heh heh you'd think they would have thought of that. or maybe charging them $. oh actually no don't charge a couple hundy, just give $10 million to millionaires instead.

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