Speed cameras

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#1268355 26-Mar-2015 12:21

Technofreak: Your description of events makes them sound quite extreme/dangerous, not something that's seen very often if at all in my experience.

From what you wrote in you first post you seem to attract more than your fair share of these events. I had to wonder why.

Its probably because I'm a really really bad driver. I follow road rules to the letter. There aren't many around who do. I'm one of those muppets who on the open road, if I see road works and the signs say 30kmh, I do 30kmh. All the way until the increase in speed sign. Thats 30 gps speed incidentally. Yet people honk their horns, flip me the bird, pass me on the inside, or plain just try to intimidate me by getting dangerously close.

But I can deal with that, when possible, I pull over before roadworks to let all the speeders go past. But there is nothing I can do about traffic lights, apart from I guess to plan my route to avoid them.

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#1268359 26-Mar-2015 12:30

IlDuce: if I see road works and the signs say 30kmh, I do 30kmh. All the way until the increase in speed sign. Thats 30 gps speed incidentally. Yet people honk their horns, flip me the bird, pass me on the inside, or plain just try to intimidate me by getting dangerously close.

I do the same with the road work speed limits, yet I rarely experience that sort of things you describe. I must be extremely fortunate.

I guess some of it's perception. We have a friend who has shifted from Auckland to Hamilton and this friend thinks Hamilton divers are bad compared to Auckland drivers, yet my wife and I would consider the opposite applies.

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DravidDavid

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#1268378 26-Mar-2015 12:41

Technofreak:
IlDuce: if I see road works and the signs say 30kmh, I do 30kmh. All the way until the increase in speed sign. Thats 30 gps speed incidentally. Yet people honk their horns, flip me the bird, pass me on the inside, or plain just try to intimidate me by getting dangerously close.

I do the same with the road work speed limits, yet I rarely experience that sort of things you describe. I must be extremely fortunate.

I guess some of it's perception. We have a friend who has shifted from Auckland to Hamilton and this friend thinks Hamilton divers are bad compared to Auckland drivers, yet my wife and I would consider the opposite applies.

Can definitely confirm people following roadworks speed limits causes road-rage. I only ever follow them if there are actually workers present. If not, it's the speed limit as usual for me.

jaymz

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#1268379 26-Mar-2015 12:41

Technofreak:
jaymz: I can see the point you are trying to make, but I simply cannot agree with it.

As you mentioned, there are road ways here in NZ that "could" have a higher speed limit, but just because they could have a higher speed limit does not entitle the road user rights to break laws that are in place for everyone.

Where did I say it was acceptable to break the speed limit. I might not agree with the limits on some roads but I never said it was OK to break them.

My comment was not an attack on you or your driving. It was a generalized comment in line with the point I was attempting to make.
I meant no attack by it towards you.

Technofreak:
jaymz: I return to the simple fact of the whole argument, if you are prepared to disobey road rules and get caught, be prepared to pay the fines for it.

I agree. However that's not the point of my argument, nor that of some others on here either I suspect. It's not about the use of speed cameras but how or where they get deployed.

I am finding it hard to see the differences between where cameras are located and how this has an effect on them being labelled "revenue gathering" when they are placed in areas where more people are caught speeding.

It seems to me that if a speed camera is in an area and several people are caught on it then said speed camera gets labelled as revenue gathering. I would have thought that if a speed camera is catching people then it is in the correct location?

On a side note, I appreciate that this argument may get a bit heated as we clearly have strong views, but please understand that none of my comments are directed at you or other individuals on this site :)

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#1268387 26-Mar-2015 12:55

DravidDavid: Can definitely confirm people following roadworks speed limits causes road-rage. I only ever follow them if there are actually workers present. If not, it's the speed limit as usual for me.

Sometimes the speed restrictions are stupid I completely agree. A single unmanned little patch of seal repair, and maybe a 50kmh restriction for 500 metres. The bottom line for me really is that my licence is my life, and if I ignored the 50 and carried on at 100, and was unlucky enough to be caught, I lose everything. Or if a copped a fine it would be hugely detrimental, so since I'm not in a hurry I simply choose to play the game.

I guess after replacing several windscreens, a headlight, and spotlight, I cringe when I am doing 30 and a car going the other way at 70 showers me in stones and I wonder if next time I stop I will discover my headlights smashed again.

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#1268397 26-Mar-2015 13:06

DravidDavid:

Can definitely confirm people following roadworks speed limits causes road-rage. I only ever follow them if there are actually workers present. If not, it's the speed limit as usual for me.

Unless there are other factors, the road work speed limit signs are supposed to be removed when there's no work taking place. Very often this doesn't happen and drivers are having to slow down unnecessarily.

IlDuce: I cringe when I am doing 30 and a car going the other way at 70 showers me in stones and I wonder if next time I stop I will discover my headlights smashed again.

Me too, though it's no just head lights it's stone chips to the paint work too. Drivers who speed on new seal aren't just being a nuisance to other drivers they are also risking damage to the new road surface.

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Technofreak

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#1268399 26-Mar-2015 13:08

jaymz:

On a side note, I appreciate that this argument may get a bit heated as we clearly have strong views, but please understand that none of my comments are directed at you or other individuals on this site :)

Understood, No problem from me.

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Technofreak

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#1268405 26-Mar-2015 13:20

jaymz:

It seems to me that if a speed camera is in an area and several people are caught on it then said speed camera gets labelled as revenue gathering. I would have thought that if a speed camera is catching people then it is in the correct location?

That's true to a point.

However what is the purpose of speed cameras? I thought it was to help reduce the road toll and make the roads safer.

Deploying them on safe stretches of road where the road toll is already low doesn't do much for the road toll. Whereas if they were deployed to a greater extent in problem areas we may see some real safety benefit.

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Geese

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#1268422 26-Mar-2015 13:37

Technofreak: Unless there are other factors, the road work speed limit signs are supposed to be removed when there's no work taking place. Very often this doesn't happen and drivers are having to slow down unnecessarily.

IlDuce: I cringe when I am doing 30 and a car going the other way at 70 showers me in stones and I wonder if next time I stop I will discover my headlights smashed again.

Me too, though it's no just head lights it's stone chips to the paint work too. Drivers who speed on new seal aren't just being a nuisance to other drivers they are also risking damage to the new road surface.

I used to be a road worker and travelled setting up and taking down signage. Back then anyway, the instruction for state highway sealing was 30km/h while workers are present, 50km on freshly sealed road (no markings, unswept), 70km once swept, 100km once both swept and paint marking completed.

We or I was very on the ball with ensuring all signage followed the above. As in didn't slow people down any longer than required. But I guess sometimes some stretches may end up forgotten in other areas.

There was also many instances of damage to the roads we were sealing from speeding motorists flicking the chip off before bitumen was totally set. To mitigate that sometimes we would use the work ute to drive back and forth through the roadworks to slow motorists down. I must say also, while I don't condone it, I have seen road workers attempt to kick passing cars and throw shovels at cars clearly speeding through road works.

RUKI

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#1268812 27-Mar-2015 08:45

Some people think that if there is 30 km/h road work signage and no workers - it is OK for them to go at higher speed than 30 km/h.
If it is new seal/metal/gravel - you MUST slow down. FYI: In other countires the limit on the patches like that is 25 km/h.
Folks, please when you see another car coming from the opposite direction on those patches - slow down and be considerate.
If you are driving with higher speed - stones will be like small bullets - smashing other people windshields.
I had windshield cracked by gravel coming out of the speeding car at gravel patch overseas.
Every time I see car rushing through the gravel patch - I reduce my speed to "turtle" to mitigate "bullet effect" of those stones .....

I guess when you pay $$$ for a new glass - you will start slowing down at those patches regardless what signage says....
Back to topic - never saw mobie speed cam/radar around those places ...

MikeB4

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#1268820 27-Mar-2015 08:54

There should be temporary speed cameras installed at all major road works sites, for example the Kapiti expressway construction. Too many seem to think the temporary speed limit is optional, it is not, it is the posted maximum speed for that section between the signs.

frankv

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#1268834 27-Mar-2015 09:14

Technofreak:
However what is the purpose of speed cameras? I thought it was to help reduce the road toll and make the roads safer.

Deploying them on safe stretches of road where the road toll is already low doesn't do much for the road toll. Whereas if they were deployed to a greater extent in problem areas we may see some real safety benefit.

I believe that the Police (rightly) perceive that they don't have enough resources to control traffic properly. They believe (probably correctly) that this is the public perception as well. So they must magnify their *apparent* presence by doing things which are highly visible. One of these things is speed cameras... they're placed in high-traffic areas so that they will affect the maximum number of people, thus magnifying the visibility of the Police. As a bonus, those who are careless get to contribute significantly to the Govt coffers.

The same applies to alcohol checkpoints... they're generally speaking an ineffective way of catching drunk drivers... 3 or 4 drunks are caught after an entire night of operations by a large number of Police after stopping thousands of cars. However, they are a highly visible tactic, especially when used in high-traffic areas. Hence, a checkpoint at the North end of Waiouru, stopping southbound traffic, on the Monday afternoon of Labour weekend. Completely ineffective at catching drunks, but stopping thousands of cars. The fact that it pisses off thousands of people is seen as a *good* thing, because it reinforces the perception that the Police are out there and doing something.

I suspect that the same applies to WoF checkpoints and the harassing of boy racer-wannabes... not very effective at catching lawbreakers, but highly visible and intimidatory.

Who knows.. maybe this approach *does* bring down the road toll?

Bung

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#1268837 27-Mar-2015 09:17

Edit: In reply to Kiwinz - that is too far North of their Wellington base. I think they prefer just shooting 5 minutes up the Porirua motorway.

I think the Police are contracted by the ACC to do a certain number of alcohol checkpoints. There may be other joint campaigns.

TonyR1973

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#1272649 29-Mar-2015 00:05

jaymz: As you mentioned, there are road ways here in NZ that "could" have a higher speed limit, but just because they could have a higher speed limit does not entitle the road user rights to break laws that are in place for everyone. I am reminded of the instance recently where a driver was clocked doing 240Km\hour (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11379738).

The point being made isn't about those blatantly and excessively exceeding the arbitrary posted speed limit such as in your example. It's about people travelling at what is still a perfectly reasonable speed for the conditions that happens to also be exceeding the arbitrary speed limit and the fact such locations are targeted for no reason other that the statistical likelihood of catching them doing so and thus it having almost nothing to do with road safety.

scuwp

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#1272680 29-Mar-2015 08:22

Bung: Edit: In reply to Kiwinz - that is too far North of their Wellington base. I think they prefer just shooting 5 minutes up the Porirua motorway.

I think the Police are contracted by the ACC to do a certain number of alcohol checkpoints. There may be other joint campaigns.

Road Policing is funded via the NZTA. Under the finding agreements Police are contracted to undertake a certain amount of tasks and have outcomes to achieve.

I am not sure what planet RUKI (24 March) is on, but he/she needs to take off their tinfoil hat and come back to earth.

Police do not get one cent from fines, it all goes to the government.
I don't believe they target the bottom of hills more than anywhere else - regardless speed limits apply on hills as much as anywhere. If you can't control the speed of you vehicle on a hill then please hand in your drivers licence as you are not fit to be on the road
I would guess the maps are updated by the individual GPS providers - talk to them if you think their data is wrong
You won't generally get a ticket for 52 - 53km/h as in your examples. Tolerance is normally much higher
Speed detection equipment is calibrated and certified to be correct, your dash-cam and/or GPS is not. Good luck with that argument in court
And as for threatening to take a Police Officers job if they issue you a ticket again....you have been watching too much TV I think! That's just a ridiculous statement to make.

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