EV (electric vehicle) News & Discussion

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#2705513 10-May-2021 14:15

Dingbatt:

To be honest, the Ioniq 5 was the only one that looked like the future, with the ‘look at me I’m different’ styling, particularly on the inside. In the same way as the Prius did in the 2000s and the Leaf in the 2010s. But then I guess there is a market (that includes me) where the car doesn’t have to look like an EV.

...

That's the one that interests me the most based on what I have seen on the many YT video reviews. But alas I think it's going to be priced in the mid $70's or more, so in the Tesla 3 range.

And I personally think it looks great, certainly better than the Prius, Leaf and most of the current crop of EV's The long wheelbase makes it a really practical car.

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mattwnz

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#2705523 10-May-2021 14:37

alasta:

There has been some talk about the MX-30 being available with a rotary range extender at some point in the future which would be really cool, but I guess that would push the price over $80k in which case you'd probably be better off with a Kona electric.

I had heard discussed in a video that in the future there will be longer range ones with larger batteries. But batteries are too expensive at the moment, and the MX 30 is more of a lower priced EV. So if a larger battery was installed, it likely wouldn't compete. These EVs sort of remind me of first generation LCD monitors and TVs which were small and expensive, before production really ramped up, bringings costs down

Jaxson

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#2705551 10-May-2021 15:16

mattwnz:

I had heard discussed in a video that in the future there will be longer range ones with larger batteries. But batteries are too expensive at the moment, and the MX 30 is more of a lower priced EV. So if a larger battery was installed, it likely wouldn't compete. These EVs sort of remind me of first generation LCD monitors and TVs which were small and expensive, before production really ramped up, bringings costs down

Definitely seeing that with the hybrid offerings, which can go as little as 1km on the batteries alone.
Basically just being used to start the vehicle rolling, where the Atkinson engines are not well suited.

The PHEV at least are a bit more half way house. Likes of the Mini countryman can do 20km plus on electric only, before the petrol has to kick in.

Obraik

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#2705559 10-May-2021 15:32

mattwnz:

I had heard discussed in a video that in the future there will be longer range ones with larger batteries. But batteries are too expensive at the moment, and the MX 30 is more of a lower priced EV. So if a larger battery was installed, it likely wouldn't compete. These EVs sort of remind me of first generation LCD monitors and TVs which were small and expensive, before production really ramped up, bringings costs down

I'm not buying that excuse. A Model 3 with double the range can be had for $70k. The MX-30 starts at $75k - it's already unable to compete. The only thing it has going for it against the Model 3 is that the cabin is higher off the ground for easier entry but if that was important I'd go with the MG which has a similar range and is $20k less.

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tripper1000

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#2708370 17-May-2021 12:01

Obraik:

mattwnz:

I had heard discussed in a video that in the future there will be longer range ones with larger batteries. But batteries are too expensive at the moment, and the MX 30 is more of a lower priced EV. So if a larger battery was installed, it likely wouldn't compete. These EVs sort of remind me of first generation LCD monitors and TVs which were small and expensive, before production really ramped up, bringings costs down

I'm not buying that excuse. A Model 3 with double the range can be had for $70k. The MX-30 starts at $75k - it's already unable to compete. The only thing it has going for it against the Model 3 is that the cabin is higher off the ground for easier entry but if that was important I'd go with the MG which has a similar range and is $20k less.

mattwnz: is correct. This is a fundimental issue when it comes to EV's and power walls. Tesla is the outlier becuase they have their own production facitiltes and can make batteries quite a bit cheaper than everyone else (how much is a secrete they're not revealing). Exactly like the LCD analogy above, as mass manufacturing ramps up, prices will come down. The problem at the moment is that demand is ramping up faster than production so no one is able to get on the front of the lithium wave.

Despite building huge battery factories Tesla still can't make batteries fast enough, which is why we haven't seen the predicted price drops in the Model 3 and more than likely why they are putting up barriers to stop people buying the power wall.

WyleECoyoteNZ

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#2708417 17-May-2021 14:00

News this morning, that the NZ Government considering a complete ban on ICE vehicles as part of the Carbon Neutral 2050 plan

https://www.autocar.co.nz/autocar-news-app/nz-govt-considering-completely-banning-petrol-cars-by-2050/

Obraik

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#2708427 17-May-2021 14:04

tripper1000:

mattwnz: is correct. This is a fundimental issue when it comes to EV's and power walls. Tesla is the outlier becuase they have their own production facitiltes and can make batteries quite a bit cheaper than everyone else (how much is a secrete they're not revealing). Exactly like the LCD analogy above, as mass manufacturing ramps up, prices will come down. The problem at the moment is that demand is ramping up faster than production so no one is able to get on the front of the lithium wave.

Despite building huge battery factories Tesla still can't make batteries fast enough, which is why we haven't seen the predicted price drops in the Model 3 and more than likely why they are putting up barriers to stop people buying the power wall.

I'm not saying there isn't a shortage of batteries or that EVs aren't inflated in cost due to this. However, Mazda is having a laugh with that pricing. As I mentioned, you can get similar speced non-Tesla EVs for less than that. You can get a Mercedes with double the range for not much more than Mazda is asking.

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SaltyNZ

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#2708434 17-May-2021 14:11

WyleECoyoteNZ: News this morning, that the NZ Government considering a complete ban on ICE vehicles as part of the Carbon Neutral 2050 plan

https://www.autocar.co.nz/autocar-news-app/nz-govt-considering-completely-banning-petrol-cars-by-2050/

Hmph, I'll believe it when I see it. It would be interesting to see whether National would a) promise to roll it back and b) actually follow through. ... In a plane-crash-fascinating sort of way.

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SaltyNZ

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#2708450 17-May-2021 14:20

From that AutoCar article:

That same pathway indicates that, in order to be possible, the country’s bus fleet would require a nine-fold increase in customers. It’s a troubling fact, given the reported lack of patronage on buses in the Auckland region.

I don't know about other routes but the Northern buses are only just coping with passengers especially in the mornings. They certainly aren't going to handle a 9x increase. What we need is some sort of mass transport system that can carry way more people on the same vehicle. It would have to be really long; you'd probably have to break it into pieces that were all joined together in order to make it around any curves. Those would be tricky to steer though so I'm not sure how you could accomplish this miraculous kind of transport. Perhaps we'll never know.

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CYaBro

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#2708460 17-May-2021 14:39

Tesla takes the lead with the fastest production car.

https://driveteslacanada.ca/model-s/tesla-model-s-plaid-new-record-quarter-mile-time-production-car/

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PolicyGuy

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#2708493 17-May-2021 16:03

SaltyNZ:

What we need is some sort of mass transport system that can carry way more people on the same vehicle. It would have to be really long; you'd probably have to break it into pieces that were all joined together in order to make it around any curves. Those would be tricky to steer though so I'm not sure how you could accomplish this miraculous kind of transport. Perhaps we'll never know.

You know, after all these years, you'd have thought that someone would come up with an answer to that problem, eh.

frankv

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#2708501 17-May-2021 16:15

SaltyNZ:

WyleECoyoteNZ: News this morning, that the NZ Government considering a complete ban on ICE vehicles as part of the Carbon Neutral 2050 plan

https://www.autocar.co.nz/autocar-news-app/nz-govt-considering-completely-banning-petrol-cars-by-2050/

Hmph, I'll believe it when I see it. It would be interesting to see whether National would a) promise to roll it back and b) actually follow through. ... In a plane-crash-fascinating sort of way.

Kite-flying aimed at stirring up a bit of controversy, but hardly relevant. Practically all the new ICEVs bought today will have gone through the crusher a decade before that deadline, so it's irrelevant to any purchase decision for the next 10 years. I expect that by 2030 EVs will be cheaper to buy and drive than ICEVs, so there won't be any need to ban them; no-one will want to drive them, apart from a tiny number of elderly wealthy enthusiasts. Might as well ban people from skiing naked.

National will pander to the elderly wealthy demographic and promise to roll it back, just like they do with any Labour policy, without actually saying what they will do instead. In the unlikely event that National form a government, "roll it back" will turn out to mean postpone it until 2052.

If it unexpectedly turns out that electricity is no good for (say) buses, either party will find some words to explain why the ban doesn't apply to buses.

tripper1000

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#2708504 17-May-2021 16:18

SaltyNZ:
WyleECoyoteNZ: News this morning, that the NZ Government considering a complete ban on ICE vehicles as part of the Carbon Neutral 2050 plan

Hmph, I'll believe it when I see it. It would be interesting to see whether National would a) promise to roll it back and b) actually follow through. ... In a plane-crash-fascinating sort of way.

Of course the Nat's would reverse it, not because it is fundimentally a bad idea, but because it will be a fundimentally incomplete solution and will damage the economy. Much like they have banned natural gas exploration without facilitating green alternatives and now there is a power shortage, wholesale power prices are spiking through the roof and we will have energy poverty very soon.

There is no way they're first going to build that long sectional vehicle that carries 1,000 people and doesn't drive on the motorway before banning ICE.

SaltyNZ

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#2708531 17-May-2021 17:01

They may have banned new exploration, but they haven’t revoked existing permits. Any current power shortage is unrelated to a ban on issuing new gas exploration permits in future.

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mattwnz

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#2708744 17-May-2021 23:49

tripper1000:

mattwnz: is correct. This is a fundimental issue when it comes to EV's and power walls. Tesla is the outlier becuase they have their own production facitiltes and can make batteries quite a bit cheaper than everyone else (how much is a secrete they're not revealing). Exactly like the LCD analogy above, as mass manufacturing ramps up, prices will come down. The problem at the moment is that demand is ramping up faster than production so no one is able to get on the front of the lithium wave.

Despite building huge battery factories Tesla still can't make batteries fast enough, which is why we haven't seen the predicted price drops in the Model 3 and more than likely why they are putting up barriers to stop people buying the power wall.

That is really the thing about Tesla, they have a huge head start, especially around batteries and the tech. It is really more of a tech company than a car company after all. But other manufacturers are quickly catching up. But I think we are a good 3-5 years away before EVs will become a default choice for people wanting to buy a brand new car, so the second hand market maybe limited for some time in NZ, esp considering the majority of people buying a second hand car spend less than 20k. Even now petrol engine mid priced new cars are starting to look like outdated tech, and I think some people are holding off buying a new car until EVs drop a bit in price. If someone was to buy new, and then have to sell it in say 5 years, the demand for petrol cars in five years in the second hand market may have dropped off a lot. It is an interesting space.

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