Support for 'Crusaders' name change appears to be growing..

Forums › Sports › Support for 'Crusaders' name change appears to be growing..

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#2201526 19-Mar-2019 12:19

networkn:

cruxis:

I suggest changing it to the Canterbury Knights, Then the can keep the imagery and the guys on the horses. Plus Knights or portrayed better in history. We still give out Knighthoods today.

I don't mind that.

However, the only option is to call it "Canterbury Super Rugby Team" that way almost no-one could be offended.

It's just a name change for pete's sake, not the end of life as we know it. And it's not about not offending anyone; it's about offering a humanitarian gesture to a community in grief following the worst mass killing in modern NZ history - is that such a terrible thing?

I have no idea how we ever progressed out of caves given the inherent opposition to any change shown by some of our species.

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#2201533 19-Mar-2019 12:33

dafman:

networkn:

cruxis:

I suggest changing it to the Canterbury Knights, Then the can keep the imagery and the guys on the horses. Plus Knights or portrayed better in history. We still give out Knighthoods today.

I don't mind that.

However, the only option is to call it "Canterbury Super Rugby Team" that way almost no-one could be offended.

It's just a name change for pete's sake, not the end of life as we know it. And it's not about not offending anyone; it's about offering a humanitarian gesture to a community in grief following the worst mass killing in modern NZ history - is that such a terrible thing?

I have no idea how we ever progressed out of caves given the inherent opposition to any change shown by some of our species.

I personally find it somewhat insulting that there are organisations/groups extending its hand in a way that is not called for from the affected group. I see it as a PR stunt and a capitalization on someone else misfortune. Whether it is a commercial gain, publicity or someone trying to get their own confirmation from others..

We got out of the caves as we are a competitive species, we got to look better than the one next to us. We got to advance our technology or find new ways to beat our enemies. Its all competition and I am in no favor of the convenient pop up humanitarians.

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#2201538 19-Mar-2019 12:40

dafman:

And it's not about not offending anyone; it's about offering a humanitarian gesture to a community in grief following the worst mass killing in modern NZ history - is that such a terrible thing?

I have no idea how we ever progressed out of caves given the inherent opposition to any change shown by some of our species.

Personally I see giving money or meals or whatever as humanitarian gestures (which plenty of people are doing), but not things like this. I see this as one facet of the attack on free speech and free thought that's happening in NZ in the aftermath of the shooting and it makes me feel like I'm living in Orwell's 1984. People are grieving, but that grief seems to have driven many of them to form pitchfork mobs and plenty of people are _scared_ to say what they think right now in New Zealand, for fear of the mob that might come there way, and that's a huge tragedy in itself.

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#2201543 19-Mar-2019 12:50

Lias:

dafman:

And it's not about not offending anyone; it's about offering a humanitarian gesture to a community in grief following the worst mass killing in modern NZ history - is that such a terrible thing?

I have no idea how we ever progressed out of caves given the inherent opposition to any change shown by some of our species.

Personally I see giving money or meals or whatever as humanitarian gestures (which plenty of people are doing), but not things like this. I see this as one facet of the attack on free speech and free thought that's happening in NZ in the aftermath of the shooting and it makes me feel like I'm living in Orwell's 1984. People are grieving, but that grief seems to have driven many of them to form pitchfork mobs and plenty of people are _scared_ to say what they think right now in New Zealand, for fear of the mob that might come there way, and that's a huge tragedy in itself.

If anyone lives a non discriminatory lifestyle they can say what they want to say, no issues.

Coil

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#2201544 19-Mar-2019 12:51

tdgeek:

Lias:

dafman:

And it's not about not offending anyone; it's about offering a humanitarian gesture to a community in grief following the worst mass killing in modern NZ history - is that such a terrible thing?

I have no idea how we ever progressed out of caves given the inherent opposition to any change shown by some of our species.

Personally I see giving money or meals or whatever as humanitarian gestures (which plenty of people are doing), but not things like this. I see this as one facet of the attack on free speech and free thought that's happening in NZ in the aftermath of the shooting and it makes me feel like I'm living in Orwell's 1984. People are grieving, but that grief seems to have driven many of them to form pitchfork mobs and plenty of people are _scared_ to say what they think right now in New Zealand, for fear of the mob that might come there way, and that's a huge tragedy in itself.

If anyone lives a non discriminatory lifestyle they can say what they want to say, no issues.

Such a shame that the lines of discrimination and interpretation are anyone's best guess as you are walking on egg shells if your ideas get anywhere near the cross over points....

tdgeek

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#2201550 19-Mar-2019 12:56

Coil:

tdgeek:

Lias:

dafman:

And it's not about not offending anyone; it's about offering a humanitarian gesture to a community in grief following the worst mass killing in modern NZ history - is that such a terrible thing?

I have no idea how we ever progressed out of caves given the inherent opposition to any change shown by some of our species.

Personally I see giving money or meals or whatever as humanitarian gestures (which plenty of people are doing), but not things like this. I see this as one facet of the attack on free speech and free thought that's happening in NZ in the aftermath of the shooting and it makes me feel like I'm living in Orwell's 1984. People are grieving, but that grief seems to have driven many of them to form pitchfork mobs and plenty of people are _scared_ to say what they think right now in New Zealand, for fear of the mob that might come there way, and that's a huge tragedy in itself.

If anyone lives a non discriminatory lifestyle they can say what they want to say, no issues.

Such a shame that the lines of discrimination and interpretation are anyone's best guess as you are walking on egg shells if your ideas get anywhere near the cross over points....

Are they though?

Coil

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#2201575 19-Mar-2019 13:28

tdgeek:

Coil:

tdgeek:

Lias:

dafman:

And it's not about not offending anyone; it's about offering a humanitarian gesture to a community in grief following the worst mass killing in modern NZ history - is that such a terrible thing?

I have no idea how we ever progressed out of caves given the inherent opposition to any change shown by some of our species.

Personally I see giving money or meals or whatever as humanitarian gestures (which plenty of people are doing), but not things like this. I see this as one facet of the attack on free speech and free thought that's happening in NZ in the aftermath of the shooting and it makes me feel like I'm living in Orwell's 1984. People are grieving, but that grief seems to have driven many of them to form pitchfork mobs and plenty of people are _scared_ to say what they think right now in New Zealand, for fear of the mob that might come there way, and that's a huge tragedy in itself.

If anyone lives a non discriminatory lifestyle they can say what they want to say, no issues.

Such a shame that the lines of discrimination and interpretation are anyone's best guess as you are walking on egg shells if your ideas get anywhere near the cross over points....

Are they though?

If current social media is to be used as an example for peoples political position then yes.

Had someone at work bring this topic up with me as they know I generally have unadulterated opinions on things and they like to hear them. Explained my position on some of the way things has been handled by authorities and commercial entities and got the "How could you have such thoughts at times like these, 50 people died." Last time I checked the NZ Law didn't laugh if you told it a funny story, nor did it cry when you told it a sad one...

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#2201590 19-Mar-2019 13:38

dafman:

It's just a name change for pete's sake, not the end of life as we know it. And it's not about not offending anyone; it's about offering a humanitarian gesture to a community in grief following the worst mass killing in modern NZ history - is that such a terrible thing?

I have no idea how we ever progressed out of caves given the inherent opposition to any change shown by some of our species.

If it's JUST a name change and no big deal, then why change it? It's still not clear who suggested it or asked for it, but are we honestly saying it's going to make those affected directly, feel or actually be any safer?

I'll be interested if the community who this affects the most actually care right now about such an inconsequential thing under the circumstances. In my view there are many things on the list of things that should change, well before anything like this.

I am not opposed to meaningful change that will have actual real world impact. I don't see any evidence that this would achieve that.

It's going to happen almost certainly, but for me, unless the affected community approached the Crusaders formally to request it, I feel it shouldn't have been raised, *especially* right now.

tripper1000

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#2201626 19-Mar-2019 13:52

Tolerance is a two way street - you take sentiments as they are intended and offered, not as you would like to twist them for selfish gain.

Clearly the war reference in the name refers to beating the opposing rugby team, not killing Moors.

Heck, the ANZAC's also perpetrated war on a Museum country so perhaps the pro-name-change lobby would like us to also bury that name and take down the memorials around town?!!??!?

tdgeek

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#2201638 19-Mar-2019 13:59

networkn:

It's going to happen almost certainly, but for me, unless the affected community approached the Crusaders formally to request it, I feel it shouldn't have been raised, *especially* right now.

That's the missing issue, and the only issue. Media said many mentioned this, first thing I thought of was many on Facebook. One day the families will be consulted, and as I already mentioned they may well not be worried. They know the context

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#2201676 19-Mar-2019 14:05

networkn:

If it's JUST a name change and no big deal, then why change it? It's still not clear who suggested it or asked for it, but are we honestly saying it's going to make those affected directly, feel or actually be any safer?

I'll be interested if the community who this affects the most actually care right now about such an inconsequential thing under the circumstances. In my view there are many things on the list of things that should change, well before anything like this.

I am not opposed to meaningful change that will have actual real world impact. I don't see any evidence that this would achieve that.

It's going to happen almost certainly, but for me, unless the affected community approached the Crusaders formally to request it, I feel it shouldn't have been raised, *especially* right now.

It may not have much of a real world impact to those affected directly but the act of doing shows people want to do something that helps kiwi culture. Seeing that people want to improve things will help. The knights templar are not part of NZ history, so the loss of name is something we can easily adapt to.

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#2201703 19-Mar-2019 14:24

It may not have much of a real world impact to those affected directly but the act of doing shows people want to do something that helps kiwi culture. Seeing that people want to improve things will help. The knights templar are not part of NZ history, so the loss of name is something we can easily adapt to.

There is a long list of things in NZ that need to change to help Kiwi Culture that should be a much higher priority than this, don't you think?

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#2201759 19-Mar-2019 15:05

networkn:

It may not have much of a real world impact to those affected directly but the act of doing shows people want to do something that helps kiwi culture. Seeing that people want to improve things will help. The knights templar are not part of NZ history, so the loss of name is something we can easily adapt to.

There is a long list of things in NZ that need to change to help Kiwi Culture that should be a much higher priority than this, don't you think?

Sure, but can the Crusaders do them? Instead of saying "I can't do the most important thing so I will do nothing." the approach can be "This is something I can do. It may be small but it sets an example and others may follow."

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#2201774 19-Mar-2019 15:22

I'm curious how many of you who are outraged at this are actually Cantabrians? Or are you just generally angry because this must surely be all those pesky alt-left\socialist\SJW types causing political correctness to go mad again?

Personally the name doesn't bother me, and personally I wouldn't call for them to change it, but I can see how it might bother some. I don't see any issue with the Crusaders reaching out to the Muslim community (and wider community) and consulting with them on whether they should change it.

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#2201788 19-Mar-2019 15:36

I'm amazed some people have so much personal identity wrapped up in the name of a franchised Super Rugby team. Isn't that... you know...kind of sad?

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