Vodafone takes Telecom to courts over interference of new network

Forums › Spark New Zealand (including Skinny and BigPipe) › Vodafone takes Telecom to courts over interference of new network

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#212261 4-May-2009 22:05

sbiddle: Wow Vodafone's expensive lawyers think Telecom has a AMPS and a GSM network. ROFL!

I was wondering that too... they switched off AMPS ages ago!

I've printed the 11 pages out so that I'll be reading it in more detail, but I still don't think Vodafone have got much to base this on other than hard proof... not statistical details.

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Snowflake

#212265 4-May-2009 22:09

since when does "vodafones right to the use and enjoyment of land"(*) have anything to do with interference on licenced spectrum?

(*) see VodafoneStatementOfClaim.pdf linked a few posts back

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manhinli

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#212266 4-May-2009 22:10

Reading through the thing...

Telecom's W-CDMA network presently includes approximately [insert] base stations...

Is that a trade secret or something? :)

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#212267 4-May-2009 22:12

Interesting read. Its worth noting that vodafone have incorrectly labelled the CDMA network a 2G network.

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#212268 4-May-2009 22:14

Are there any other countries other than Australia presently running 800 and 900 networks side by side?

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#212270 4-May-2009 22:16

From my brief read of it, it looks like this document has been in the planning for a while.
I know a lot of people who have been fed up with VF , due to the dimishing customer support over the last year, so when they had issues with their phone connection, that was probably the final straw, and they have just decided to move to another provider. People are allowed to switch providers, and VF doesn't 'own' their customers. Normally people will give a company the oppourtunity to fix things, unless they already have another reason to leave them, such as poor CS, and foreign call cetre staff whose accent is very hard to understand.

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#212271 4-May-2009 22:17

32 b)

No technically and economically justifiable measures are available to reduce the susceptibility of Vodafone's receiving equipment on Vodafone's 900 RX band to interference from Telecom's W-CDMA transmissions on Telecom's 850 TX band.

Vodafone can't do anything?

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#212272 4-May-2009 22:18

freitasm: Here it is then:

Vodafone Statement of Claim (PDF download).

Interesting. I haven't noticed any problems when I'm on the Voda GSM network, but then I'm usually on their 3G network in Auckland. In fact, their GSM network seems to be more reliable for voice calls!

The obvious question of course is why are Vodafone having interference issues when Telecom are not? Is GSM more susceptible to interference than UMTS? I can't see this helping Vodafone as it will clearly require a technical solution, unless they're trying to prevent Telecom from launching the XT network - surely not...

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Snowflake

#212273 4-May-2009 22:19

sbiddle: Are there any other countries other than Australia presently running 800 and 900 networks side by side?

not that the site constitutes fact but it appears that thailand could be one possible candidate:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_UMTS_networks

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Zeon

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#212274 4-May-2009 22:21

The real question is what the the findings are of MED (I assume this is their responsibility) engineers? Vodafone's claim is not substantiated nor nullified until we have this crucial evidence.

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#212275 4-May-2009 22:24

wow i have to say it doesn't seem like the author of this short novel has consulted anyone who actually knows anything. eg. what the hell does AMPS have to do with this?, i certainly hope vfone have a hell of alot more to throw at tcom than that. If that's the best they can do I think the judge may die of laughter.

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#212276 4-May-2009 22:27

It's a very interesting read. From an RF Engineering point-of-view, the crux of this whole problem is the proximity of Vodafone's Rx band starting at 899.8MHz to the upper limit of Telecom's Tx band finishing at 885MHz.

They are only 1.7% apart in frequency terms meaning that a very complex high-order passive filter would be required on Telecom's transmitters in order to reduce the out-of-band emissions to acceptable levels.

Another alternative is a filter on Vodafone's receivers, but in this sort of situation, it is always preferable to remove the interference at its source i.e. the Tx output.

Vodafone have put together a very comprehensive -- if somewhat repetitive -- statement of claim, so it will be interesting what Telecom hit back with by way of response.

There are two sides to every story, and until we have the full details on both of them, it would be premature to make any judgements as to rights and wrongs.

Having read the PDF with an open mind, one would have to assume that the launch date of Telecom's XT Mobile Network is in some doubt until this issue is resolved.

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#212280 4-May-2009 22:29

The court hearing is set down for 10am on Wednesday 6th May in the Auckland High Court.

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#212286 4-May-2009 22:37

Is it a open court, I wonder how long the court hearing would be for. I would turn up if it was more than a 10 minute hearing.

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#212287 4-May-2009 22:37

As mentioned the statement of claim is void of any technical information in relation to the interference eg. field strength of the spurious signals and are they within permissible limits as specified in their license conditions?

Interesting that Voda claims telecom should know Voda have a 900MHz network and design their network around it, however I would expect that under law the only thing Telecom have to prove is that they built their network around the conditions of their license (which will be designed to minimise interference).

It's RSM's job to ensure good spectrum design.

Telecom can equally argue most of the points that Voda have in their statement also apply to them.

Good luck to Alison (Layer for Voda mentioned in claim) arguing this one.

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