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Topic # 113274 11-Jan-2013 16:25
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I see from this Herald article the government has moved forward with a plan to make learners and restricted licenses expire if not upgraded to full within 5 years of getting them.

Am I the only one that considers this a bit discriminatory against people who only have a driver's license because it's the only form of photo ID the government will accept?  Next they'll be passing Voter ID laws to make sure that people who can't afford a license every 5 years aren't allowed to vote.

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  Reply # 743403 11-Jan-2013 16:32
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Here in Victoria, Australia you can only hold a motorcycle learners permit (Not even considered a licence) for 15 months. After that it expires and you have to sit the tests again and pay for a new licence.




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  Reply # 743405 11-Jan-2013 16:34
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They also accept passports. The point of a drivers license is not to provide photo ID. The point of a drivers license is to prove that you are capable of and are approved to driving.

I have no qualms about this proposed change. Just like anything you do you need to stay up to date with the laws and current accepted practices

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  Reply # 743407 11-Jan-2013 16:37
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Why not just get a full license?

Even if you don't drive often it is useful to have and is an accomplishment to be proud of.

The government will also accept a passport as photo ID. There is no need to acquire a drivers license for identification only.

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  Reply # 743408 11-Jan-2013 16:43
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About time, I know too many people who sit on their restricted licenses, and never have any intention of getting there full. They also need to bring in compulsory third party insurance.

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  Reply # 743410 11-Jan-2013 16:45
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For me the argument was a little different:

I've been on a restricted license for a long time I always stick to the rules for that license

- I don't drive alone after 10pm
- if I have passengers one of them always has a full license (usually my wife)

- I can drive well enough to pass the driving test easily but why pay for something I don't need? What does it allow me to do that I can't do already?

And then I would have to take time off work to do the test...


When I really need a full licensed driver e.g. to hire a trailer or rental car - then my wife can do that, but these situations come up only once every few years...

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  Reply # 743412 11-Jan-2013 16:51
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Bee:
- I can drive well enough to pass the driving test easily but why pay for something I don't need? What does it allow me to do that I can't do already? 



It allows you to have a licence that doesn't expire after 5 years.

Bee

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  Reply # 743417 11-Jan-2013 16:54
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BlueShift:
Bee:
- I can drive well enough to pass the driving test easily but why pay for something I don't need? What does it allow me to do that I can't do already? 



It allows you to have a licence that doesn't expire after 5 years.


Currently it needs renewing every 10 years just like any other license...

This change would mean that after 5 years a restricted license would expire and you need to resit a test to get a new license yes but this new law doesnt even come into effect for another 2 years...

The question is what is the point of having a full license under CURRENT laws when Im not breaking any of the conditions on a restricted license???

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  Reply # 743422 11-Jan-2013 17:05
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In theory in a democracy the majority decides what rules everyone should obey.

You can never please everyone so if you're a minority in a strong democracy you do what the rest says.

Of course there are some times when you are the majority and other people have to suck it up and do what you like.

Of course you can always live in a communist country like north korea.

The real question is, is the majority actually supportive of this change or just the politicians majority and they didnt listen to the people ... I am happy with the 5 yr rule .... But am even happier with the old full paper licence that never expired!

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  Reply # 743427 11-Jan-2013 17:28
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I fully support this, Having went through my license as quickly as possible I don't the point in sitting on your restricted, If you are good enough of a driver for a full just go get it, Save yourself any issues if you do for some reason need to drive beyond your license conditions.

Also if all you need is an ID a HANZ 18+ is accept in pretty much all places as Valid photo ID

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  Reply # 743434 11-Jan-2013 17:37
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I think this is a good thing. Also I don't believe drivers licenses are a legal form of ID anyway, and they intentionally are not supposed to be.I believe you can also buy 18+ cards as ID. Also your passport, but that is an expensive form as they expire every 5 years, unless you get a European one. I have still got my lifetime license, but obviously the rules were rewritten to void it. Maybe it will be a collectors item someday, as most were destroyed when people were made to get photo ones, as people were supposed to hand them over.



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  Reply # 743453 11-Jan-2013 18:08
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mattwnz: I think this is a good thing. Also I don't believe drivers licenses are a legal form of ID anyway, and they intentionally are not supposed to be.I believe you can also buy 18+ cards as ID. Also your passport, but that is an expensive form as they expire every 5 years, unless you get a European one. I have still got my lifetime license, but obviously the rules were rewritten to void it. Maybe it will be a collectors item someday, as most were destroyed when people were made to get photo ones, as people were supposed to hand them over.


Incorrect, on virtually every front.  To a government department, finance company, insurance provider, or bank, there are two forms of ID.  Drivers license, or Passport.  An 18+ card does not qualify as ID for anything except buying alcohol.

For what it's worth, I have a learner's license.  The only reason I had it was for ID - the passport requirements are far too onerous for me to get one of those (you have to hunt out a person who isn't related to you who has has an NZ passport for 3 years and has known you for 3 years to vouch for you - you can't be vouched for by family or by someone who themselves doesn't have a passport), and an 18+ card is basically useless as noone accepts it as ID except Liquorland.  I let it expire to see if I really need it - so far, the answer is unequivocally yes - I can no longer identify myself to government departments (seriously, even my employer will not recognise me if I need to request personal info any more) and I cannot deal with my bank in person because I don't have enough ID.

So really, unless this government is prepared to introduce a national ID scheme that does not require expensive renewals every 5 years, this move is simply unacceptable.

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  Reply # 743466 11-Jan-2013 18:26
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Kyanar: 

Incorrect, on virtually every front.  To a government department, finance company, insurance provider, or bank, there are two forms of ID.  Drivers license, or Passport.  An 18+ card does not qualify as ID for anything except buying alcohol.



So really, unless this government is prepared to introduce a national ID scheme that does not require expensive renewals every 5 years, this move is simply unacceptable.


I don't think so. I am pretty sure that the NZ drivers license when it came out was not considered a legal form to prove someones identity. Only a passport and birth certificate was. However it has become a defacto one, due to NZ not having any form of national identity card. Not unless legislation has changed since the photo license came out. 
Do you have evidence that it is an actual legal form to prove someones identity? I can't see any information that says it is. Just because banks / finance companies use them doesn't really prove much, as they probably have not choice but to accept them when NZ doesn't have an national identity card. Also you will note that banks also require other ID too to support someones identity, such as IRD number, passport and letters with address details etc. If there was a national ID card, I would presume that they would only need that.

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  Reply # 743467 11-Jan-2013 18:28
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Passports are only 5 years, too.




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  Reply # 743471 11-Jan-2013 18:32
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I think the arguments put up against this are very shallow and agree with teh majority of the posters.

Having a drivers license for identity reminds me of an old analogy "fighting for peace is like having sex for virginity" ( loses a bit in translation and changed wording)




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  Reply # 743476 11-Jan-2013 18:38
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ajobbins: Passports are only 5 years, too.


this annoyed me. My current passport is 10 years. New chip passports are only 5 years. Have to renew very soon.

I support the new change for restricted and learners licenses change.




Do whatever you want to do man.

  

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