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455 posts

Ultimate Geek
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Topic # 236390 30-May-2018 21:17
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We’re currently in the process of renovating, and have had the electrician install a few additional power sockets before putting on the wall linings. I’m installing data outlets alongside in a few locations.

One issue has arisen where the electrician has run his wiring horizontally along the wall through a number of studs, which cuts across spaces where I plan to install data outlets. I’ve asked for that run to be relocated to under the floor, which is straightforward and they have agreed to do. But, they don’t believe it’s necessary and our contracted builder has asked me to produce the material citing this requirement.

If I was to install the data cabling with things as they are currently, it would be in direct contact with the electrical wiring in the bottom of the wall. I have been working to the TCF Premises Wiring Installer Guidelines, which is where I have taken the requirements for the separation of power and data cabling.

The TCF Guidelines refer to the separation requirements under AS/NZS 3000 (“The Australian/New Zealand Wiring Rules”), which is incorporated by reference into the Electricity (Safety) Regulations 2010. I’ve seen in this old thread that those requirements then themselves incorporate Telecom’s PTC 106 by reference, which contains much the same requirements, but is quite old.

AS/NZS 3000:2007 costs a reasonable amount, and I’m not keen to purchase a copy just for the sake of this minor issue. Is anyone with experience in this area able to confirm the current requirements around power and data separation, and what is generally considered acceptable practice?

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  Reply # 2025955 30-May-2018 21:34
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Hi, you must maintain 50mm of separation or use a solid structure such as a stud or dwang. So if running horizontal you must use a separate set of stud holes 50 mm away from the electrical.

Cyril

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  Reply # 2026006 30-May-2018 22:17
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Is this really necessary? Does it cause interference as I can't imagine there is any major inductance.






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Master Geek
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  Reply # 2026012 30-May-2018 22:37
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this might help

 

Click to see full size

 

 if the cables cross at a 90 degree angle like "+" its usually fine and shouldn't cause any interference


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  Reply # 2026014 30-May-2018 22:42
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Zeon:

Is this really necessary? Does it cause interference as I can't imagine there is any major inductance.



My understanding is that this is an electrical regs issue of minimising the risk of data cables becoming live with mains power due to a fault rather than any concern about interference.

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  Reply # 2026028 30-May-2018 23:26
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Horizontal mains wiring

*shudder*

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  Reply # 2026033 31-May-2018 00:00
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froob: We’re currently in the process of renovating, and have had the electrician install a few additional power sockets before putting on the wall linings. I’m installing data outlets alongside in a few locations.


You reference all the right specs so when you say alongside have you seen the minimum spacing unless flush boxes have a rigid barrier requirement. Most electrical flush boxes are too full of holes.

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  Reply # 2026034 31-May-2018 00:00
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froob: We’re currently in the process of renovating, and have had the electrician install a few additional power sockets before putting on the wall linings. I’m installing data outlets alongside in a few locations.


You reference all the right specs so when you say alongside have you seen the minimum spacing unless flush boxes have a rigid barrier requirement. Most electrical flush boxes are too full of holes.



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  Reply # 2026036 31-May-2018 00:06
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Bung:
froob: We’re currently in the process of renovating, and have had the electrician install a few additional power sockets before putting on the wall linings. I’m installing data outlets alongside in a few locations.


You reference all the right specs so when you say alongside have you seen the minimum spacing unless flush boxes have a rigid barrier requirement. Most electrical flush boxes are too full of holes.


Thanks for this. By alongside, I mean on the opposite side of the stud, which I understand to meet the separation requirement. The flush boxes are indeed little more than an open plastic frame.

JWR

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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 2026040 31-May-2018 01:27
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I thought the ' usual segregation' was around 30cm for parallel cables (i.e. power and data/ethernet) .

 

The EM (electromagnetic) field drops off as inverse squared, there isn't a huge difference between 30 and 50cm.

 

The main thing about data cables and power cables, is run them as far apart as practical in parallel.

 

Cross them at right angles if you have to. That's just Physics.




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  Reply # 2026124 31-May-2018 10:56
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Thanks all, much appreciated.

@MadEngineer - I’m interested to hear more about your issues with horizontal cable runs. I assume just interference with other services, such as here, and increased chance of drilling into the cable because it doesn’t take the predictable path in the wall?

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  Reply # 2026127 31-May-2018 11:03
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If you go horizontal there is no way to pull the cable through from top or bottom in future.

 

Cyril


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Master Geek
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  Reply # 2026139 31-May-2018 11:29
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cyril7: Hi, you must maintain 50mm of separation or use a solid structure such as a stud or dwang.

 

JWR:

 

I thought the ' usual segregation' was around 30cm for parallel cables (i.e. power and data/ethernet) .

 

The EM (electromagnetic) field drops off as inverse squared, there isn't a huge difference between 30 and 50cm.

 

 

Just pointing out a potential mis-read here.

 

The original reply mentioned 50 millimeters, and the second compared 30 and 50 centimeters.

 

The comparision should be 30cm to 5cm or 300mm to 50mm using the same units.

 

From a quick google the 50mm would apply for a shielded data cable I think ?

 

 




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  Reply # 2026563 31-May-2018 22:02
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Just to close this out for anyone else reading, the current version of AS/NZS 3000 now refers to the TCF guidelines, rather than PTC 103 and 106.

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  Reply # 2027180 1-Jun-2018 19:41
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cyril7:

 

If you go horizontal there is no way to pull the cable through from top or bottom in future.

 

Cyril

 

I'll just leave this here ...

 

 


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