Disagreement with tradesman over invoice

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timmmay

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#205043 27-Oct-2016 17:44

I had some painting work done by a good tradesman. I won't go into the details, but we have a disagreement on the amount owed. The invoice was significantly more than the quote - $4100 quoted, $5600 originally invoiced, $5100 compromise offered by painter (which is still higher than I think is reasonable), $4600 paid as a sign of good faith. I don't think we're going to be able to come to an agreement. It's still civil, and I still want him to do more work for me in a year or two.

Is there a standard escalation path under the building code? Is there a standard arbitration service, or some kind of dispute resolution service? Of course I will try to avoid any kind of escalation but I want to know my options.

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#1659205 27-Oct-2016 17:52

Disputes Tribunal https://disputestribunal.govt.nz/ (who in my experience will often just split the difference)

Has he come up with a decent explanation for exceeding the quoted amount?

When he first noticed an issue did he raise this with you and flag to you early on that the invoice was likely to exceed the quoted amount? If not, he has placed himself in a difficult position, should learn from it, and accept your pretty reasonable compromise in order to be more likely to secure more work in the future.

Source: Experience as being the contractor and in my younger days not communicating well with the client when a job was not going to plan.

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timmmay

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#1659219 27-Oct-2016 18:01

He would have to take me to that. I'd wonder if there was some kind of lower key option first that I could suggest.

At no point did he say he might exceed the quoted amount. We also paid another $1000 or so for some indoor work separately when it was wet out and they couldn't work outdoors. They got a fair bit of paint on the carpet we had to have removed.

His quote was to strip as much as required and paint. He says that a full strip was required for some areas, but he has no evidence or proof that was done. I had asked in advance in a separate email how much it would cost if I asked for a full strip rather than "whatever is required", but I didn't ask him to go ahead, so the original quote applies. Basically he's charged the price that would've applied had I asked for the full strip, even though I asked for the original quote of "do whatever is required". This muddies the waters slightly. I'm confident of the language and my interpretation, but I paid extra as a sign of good faith. He's coming to the party somewhat, but not as much as I think is reasonable, given everything he did should fall under the quote.

He's a nice guy, we get on well, but written language isn't his strong point. It's possible he doesn't understand my position and points.

Ropata

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#1659223 27-Oct-2016 18:08

Your mistake is saying "whatever is required" His mistake is not making you aware of any extras. Sounds like you've done your bit by offering a bit more.

Handle9

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#1659224 27-Oct-2016 18:10

I work in a construction project management role. He hasn't got a leg to stand on.

If the scope is to "strip as much as required and paint" and a full strip was required then it's his problem. If he hasn't raised it with you and had a variation authorized then he's relying on your good will. If he hasn't allowed for a full strip where it is required then that is his problem.

In my opinion you have been very reasonable and he has done something very silly or he's trying it on.

timmmay

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#1659230 27-Oct-2016 18:28

Ropata:

Your mistake is saying "whatever is required" His mistake is not making you aware of any extras. Sounds like you've done your bit by offering a bit more.

"Whatever is required" is his language, not mine. He really should limit his liability more.

Dynamic

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#1659232 27-Oct-2016 18:32

Based on your first and additional comments about the mess do you *really* want him back?

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surfisup1000

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#1659241 27-Oct-2016 19:02

You base your selection on his quote so he must discuss anything that gives a good reason to increase the cost.

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dejadeadnz

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#1659252 27-Oct-2016 19:46

surfisup1000:

You base your selection on his quote so he must discuss anything that gives a good reason to increase the cost.

I don't want to comment much on the specifics of this case but people need to understand the legal difference between an estimate and a quote in terms of contract law and laws relating to fair trading etc in this context. In providing an estimate, someone isn't contractually bound to carry out X work at Y price but they still have legal duties to not mislead a consumer and to exercise due skills and diligence in preparing the estimate. Also, any consumer retains the protection of s 31 of the Consumer Guarantees Act which states that where no firm price is fixed, the price charged for a service must nonetheless be reasonable.

OTOH, if someone offers a quoted price for X service and a consumer accepts the quote as offered, the parties have a binding contract. But whether the parties have reached a binding contractual agreement is determined through viewing the objective circumstances of the events concerned and not necessarily by what words the parties used and certainly not what one party subjectively believe happened.

timmmay

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#1659263 27-Oct-2016 20:56

It's clearly marked "quote" not "estimate".

mattwnz

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#1659356 27-Oct-2016 22:44

If a quote and you had some extra work done that wasn't quoted for you should get another professional painter to provide you with a price for what that additional work would have cost to see how it compares. Pricing for work can be really difficult and I find many companies now give estimates rather than quotes. To give a firm quote you either have to build on a big risk margin or know very accuratelywhat it will cost which can take a significant amount of time to work out. Some companies will now even charge to give a firm quote due to the amount of time it takes them

networkn

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#1659382 27-Oct-2016 23:21

Dynamic: Based on your first and additional comments about the mess do you *really* want him back?

Agreed on this.

networkn

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#1659383 27-Oct-2016 23:30

I am not a Lawyer and one has chimed in. I'd expect a requirement to discuss cost overruns prior to doing the work, I think your compromise is fair and reasonable. Personally I'd stand my ground on it, but it would depend on how badly I wanted a relationship on an ongoing basis.

I do get the feeling he is "trying it on" as well. Even nice guys can be inclined to do this too.

tdgeek

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#1659400 28-Oct-2016 00:21

timmmay:

Ropata:

Your mistake is saying "whatever is required" His mistake is not making you aware of any extras. Sounds like you've done your bit by offering a bit more.

"Whatever is required" is his language, not mine. He really should limit his liability more.

Yep, he has taken, whatever is required, to mean whatever is required, literally. So he did that, as per the quote, plus whatever is required over and above the quote.

Disrespective

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#1659458 28-Oct-2016 08:52

You have the right to ask for a cost breakdown to indicate where all of the costs, including the extra ones were incurred.

If he decided he needed to use a more expensive paint than in the original quote, or painted the hallway when that wasn't in the quote, then he needs to have this value priced separately as extra work over and above the quote.

Without a cost breakdown it's hard to know where the price increase happened, and thus why.

timmmay

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#1659460 28-Oct-2016 08:55

mattwnz: If a quote and you had some extra work done that wasn't quoted for you should get another professional painter to provide you with a price for what that additional work would have cost to see how it compares. Pricing for work can be really difficult and I find many companies now give estimates rather than quotes. To give a firm quote you either have to build on a big risk margin or know very accuratelywhat it will cost which can take a significant amount of time to work out. Some companies will now even charge to give a firm quote due to the amount of time it takes them

Work done all falls within the quote. The issue is the language he used is more broad than he intended to use. Painters aren't English scholars but contracts need to be precise.

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