Another early grave filthy food pusher sees NZ as a soft target

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#1999318 19-Apr-2018 13:59

networkn:

We as a family are really dynamic. We often have things happening all the time, and there are some weeks where we might eat out 5 times in a week. It's not our ideal and we try and mix up what we have, Sushi, McD's, Burgers, Mexican.

We have other times we would eat nutritious meals for 10 days straight, all home cooked with fresh ingredients, but from the outside, we might be seen, depending on the week, by some, to be "poisoning" our kids.

You are not alone on the @networkn - we are the same can go some weeks eating out and having to get lunch or dinner on the go because the week has been killed by work or other forces... But then other weeks its the opposite. I would say it is the same for most of us in the industry sometimes we just don't have a chance to sit down and eat "healthy".

One major point to make and freitasm made a great point.. 2 Pizza's for $10 add coke 2 for $7 and it some people in this country that's what they can afford.
I am one for adding taxes on "bad" food but we need to address the bigger issues that most healthy options are too expensive for some people.

@oblivian - Amazed you have not chimed in on this... with your diet.

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#1999323 19-Apr-2018 14:11

ResponseMediaNZ:

@oblivian - Amazed you have not chimed in on this... with your diet.

Ignorance = bliss. I do like a good taco or chicken enchiladas tho.

Fred99

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#1999386 19-Apr-2018 15:39

MikeB4:

Fred99:

MikeB4:

If you we don't think it is wise to eat it then educate and show the alternatives.

That's a thoroughly doomed strategy.
Telling someone that they (or their family) don't eat "healthily" deserves its own chapter in the book of "How to Lose Friends and Alienate People".

Educating about is not the same as telling they are wrong, the former has a greater chance of success than the later.

I think you misunderstand - it's not that you'd state directly that their diet is bad, but whichever way you put it - presenting alternatives etc, that's how it's taken. People are extremely defensive about diet related issues - they will take it personally regardless.

At the extreme end, then try educating people that breast feeding baby is best (inarguably scientifically true) and it's almost guaranteed that you'll be on the receiving end of some extremely defensive kickback.

Education on healthy eating has been preached in NZ schools for decades. Those decades correlate perfectly with the worsening epidemic of obesity in NZ children. As such I'm unconvinced that education (as we've been doing it) is more than only a small part of the answer.

The problem is made far worse, as there's not even close to a common consensus on what's healthy and what's not, nor what encourages good or bad eating habits.

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#1999401 19-Apr-2018 15:59

To take your example of breast feeding and my family has personal experience here (sensitive and upsetting) Now its fact that breastfeeding is best and should be presented as such however the best way to present that is breast feeding is best if you can do that, if you are not able to then these are the best alternatives. If this is done in a non accusing non confrontational manner it will be take as that. As easy as it may seem breast feeding may be natural but it more often that not, not easy and does not always come naturally. It is the same as the food we consume, it may seem natural and wise to eat the right type of food but that is something that does not naturally, all creatures are taught how to eat, maybe we are missing that vital education is the busy lives of the twentyfirst century.

Here is a crazy notion, lets give peace a chance.

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#1999469 19-Apr-2018 19:21

Fred99:

At the extreme end, then try educating people that breast feeding baby is best (inarguably scientifically true) and it's almost guaranteed that you'll be on the receiving end of some extremely defensive kickback.

As an aside, sometimes justifiably.

A friend's wife can't, for medical reasons, breastfeed. She was quietly giving her baby a bottle in public about 2 years ago, when a very loud and aggressive woman she had never met before marched up and started lecturing her about how terrible a mother she was for bottle feeding. If that had been my wife I would have been more than merely defensive!

Fred99

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#1999494 19-Apr-2018 20:04

JimmyH:

Fred99:

At the extreme end, then try educating people that breast feeding baby is best (inarguably scientifically true) and it's almost guaranteed that you'll be on the receiving end of some extremely defensive kickback.

As an aside, sometimes justifiably.

A friend's wife can't, for medical reasons, breastfeed. She was quietly giving her baby a bottle in public about 2 years ago, when a very loud and aggressive woman she had never met before marched up and started lecturing her about how terrible a mother she was for bottle feeding. If that had been my wife I would have been more than merely defensive!

Yup - it works all ways. Heed advice -"beware a zealot" - and there are plenty of those around when food/nutrition/diet etc is the topic.

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#1999496 19-Apr-2018 20:08

Rikkitic:

MikeB4:

I don't eat any of this type of food, however if we are an open society then why would we stop it just because its not our choice or like. If the product is not what the public want then the venture will fail. If you we don't think it is wise to eat it then educate and show the alternatives.

I wish people would quit thinking I want to ban stuff. I don't. I just wish there was a way to show people something better. From everything I have read and heard, a steady diet (note the word 'steady') of junk food blunts the senses and creates addiction. People lose the ability to taste what is good. They crave the added salt and fat. At this point I think they become victims.

Parents who live on junk food also pass it on to their children, who develop the same cravings and blunted taste. More victims before they even learn how to choose.

People do not start out making a neutral choice to prefer junk food. They are channelled to it by many forces. Low cost may be one. Advertising is a big one. I do not believe that people who abuse junk food (note the word 'abuse') are making a truly free choice. They are constantly being manipulated and manoeuvred by very precise advertising. This uses many of the same ploys that tobacco did, which is one of the reasons I compare them. Like tobacco packaging, which is now in the process of also being banned, the logos and decorative schemes of junk food premises are carefully worked out to maximise appeal. I don't think these places should be banned and maybe taxing consumption is a bad idea (I don't know), but I would already be delighted if just the advertising was banned. Or maybe that could be heavily taxed. I'm sure there are ways of doing this if there is a will.

I don't think consumer education alone is sufficient. I think it is a sop that those who oppose change hide behind. With the forces of advertising and other incentives, it is not a level playing field. But @networkn's comments about the food preferences of younger people are heartening. I hope he is right and it is indicative of a larger trend.

One of the (in my opinion) insidious effects of junk food is that it pushes good food aside. By good food I don't mean gourmet food, just the fresh, balanced, well-prepared home cooking style food that used to be common. People forget what good food actually tastes like. I think this is a tragedy. Junk food (or fast food or convenience food if you prefer) does have a place in modern society. But it needs to be kept in proportion. At the moment it is not and our society is suffering.

This is what I believe and I feel strongly about it. But I have said all I am going to on the subject. Anything else is just repetition.

In any part of life, there are always those that are excessive. Tobacco, booze, gambling, food, and so on and so on.

I have never felt that junk food was an issue for most. Its a treat, its once a week, its no big deal. Macca's, lollies which have been in kids lives forever, whats the issue? If there are 5 fast food places nearby, who cares? If its a Friday treat night, no need to cook and clean, it doesnt matter if its Carl Jnr, Wendy's, Sonic, Macca;s and so on. Choose one. Before this "junk food" was a saying, it was fish n chips. Burger bar. Same thing. Nothing has changed. I cannot see an issue.

Rikkitic

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#1999500 19-Apr-2018 20:18

I have explained the issue. New Zealand has the highest rate of bowel cancer in the developed world. One of the highest rates of type 2 diabetes. It is the third fattest nation in the world. All of this is directly related to diet. There is no question about that. I'm not certain to what extent, if any, this has been specifically linked to convenience food, but logic would suggest that there is at least some connection. I think research has been done on this in the USA, but I'm not sure exactly what.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

Fred99

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#1999540 19-Apr-2018 20:55

Rikkitic:

New Zealand has the highest rate of bowel cancer in the developed world.

No it doesn't.

Incidence (age standardised rate per 100,000 population, 2015 data) is slightly lower (about 3%) in NZ than Australia, but about 20% lower than Korea and about 15% higher than Japan.

Go figure - Japan and Korea have similar diets in many ways, but they're at opposite ends of the bowel cancer stats in developed nations in that study (WCRF)

That's why I repeat the comment "beware a zealot". They'd go looking for a diet related reason for that paradox, and likely come up with an incorrect assumption.

A clue to a potential real answer may be that diet related correlation isn't very strong, but exercise related correlation is.

Fred99

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#1999599 19-Apr-2018 22:01

Rikkitic:

I have explained the issue. New Zealand ...One of the highest rates of type 2 diabetes.

I'd dispute that too. It's relatively high by world standard, but normal enough by first world standard.

I suspect that global data is severely distorted by underdiagnosis - except in first world countries like NZ.

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#1999600 19-Apr-2018 22:03

xpd: Was a taco place that opened years ago in Mangere, closed down within a year - people just werent interested. Went in one night with a couple of mates, mainly to hassle another friend working there. He said we counted for 90% of the customers that day.

I guess maths wasn't his strong suit.

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Fred99

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#1999604 19-Apr-2018 22:11

Rikkitic:

I have explained the issue. New Zealand ... It is the third fattest nation in the world.

No it isn't.

It's pretty dire and in the top quintile (no doubt also related to the not good - but not the worst other data above) but NZ is not the third fattest nation in the world. Some tables derived from from WHO data on Wikipedia here.

Fred99

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#1999618 19-Apr-2018 22:42

tdgeek:

lollies which have been in kids lives forever, whats the issue?

Quantitative rather than qualitative.

From a relatively well-off family, I'd be able to afford, perhaps once a week with my pocket money, a small white paper bag with a few lollies in it, and I'd need to ride my bike a couple of km round trip get them.

Playing on my connected iThing, on a trip with mum in the SUV to the modern supermarket lolly aisle to buy bucket loads of stuff to jam in my gob was beyond my wildest dreams - yet I believed at the time the moon landings were real and I'd get a turn at that...