Our PM Jacinda Ardern (and the government)

To post in this sub-forum you must have made 100 posts or have Trust status or have completed our ID Verification

Forums › Politics › Our PM Jacinda Ardern (and the government)

1 | ... | 90 | 91 | 92 | 93 | 94 | 95 | 96 | 97 | 98 | 99 | 100 | ... | 118

18690 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 7830

Lifetime subscriber

#3009225 12-Dec-2022 19:48

networkn: Why oh Why can't our esteemed leader just admit when she/they make a mistake?!

Ardern very clearly several days ago stated the entrenchment clause was a mistake. I find it hard to believe anyone in this topic missed that.

sir1963

3428 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 3756

Subscriber

#3009226 12-Dec-2022 19:51

gzt:
networkn: Why oh Why can't our esteemed leader just admit when she/they make a mistake?!

Ardern very clearly several days ago stated the entrenchment clause was a mistake. I find it hard to believe anyone in this topic missed that.

That is what happens when you realise everyone knows you screwed it up.... you finally admit it.

Denial was only causing more harm.

networkn

Networkn
32873 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 15475

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#3009228 12-Dec-2022 19:57

gzt:
networkn: Why oh Why can't our esteemed leader just admit when she/they make a mistake?!

Ardern very clearly several days ago stated the entrenchment clause was a mistake. I find it hard to believe anyone in this topic missed that.

Which is fine, except that isn't what I am talking about.

They admitted the entrenchment was a mistake after *days* of trying to wiggle out of it.

chatterbox

204 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 108

#3009294 13-Dec-2022 06:44

GV27:

networkn:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/130733059/government-officials-acted-unreasonably-over-miq-advice--ombudsman

A bit of a rock and a hard place for the Government, I have some sympathy for the situation. Damned if they took longer and got it 'right' and damned if they just put something in place.

It gets lost that while overseas Kiwis had a right to come home, the Kiwis who live here and actually live their lives have a right to be protected from multiples more points of ingress of a virus during a global pandemic as well.

I feel like "If you're going to curtail that right, your officials' advice needs to be up to scratch and you have to be more responsive with your repatriation system" is probably a reasonable conclusion.

There is no "rock and a hard place" here. You can implement a process and improve it along the way. The lottery system was actually worse than first in first served. Instead of addressing the issues at hand, they would wait for lawyers to prepare a case and at the 11th hour find MIQ allocations for those people so the case would go away. Or someone had to be lucky enough to have media run with their story. Yet for every story there were probably another 100 or more similar cases you didn't hear about. But we did hear about the wiggles getting MIQ allocations because apparently NZs entertainment was more important than humanitarian cases.

GV27: Government got burned on the MIQ allocation system. Nothing to do with MIQ being in place so there was no increased risk to kiwis in NZ. I don't know where you acquired that impression.

GV27

5978 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4212

#3009304 13-Dec-2022 07:34

chatterbox:

GV27: Government got burned on the MIQ allocation system. Nothing to do with MIQ being in place so there was no increased risk to kiwis in NZ. I don't know where you acquired that impression.

All the Ex-Pats complaining about how they didn't have unfettered right to return during a global pandemic, the likes of which we hadn't seen for over a hundred years.

There's two different issues people seem to be venting about - the lack of priority in the lottery system, and the fact that Kiwis couldn't return at the exact moment they wanted to in the midst of a global pandemic.

sen8or

1897 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1402

#3009316 13-Dec-2022 08:45

I was torn in my sympathy of the expats who couldn't get back home.

On one hand, they had made the conscious decision to live abroad for personal gain, they had paid tax abroad and not contributed to the NZ economy in whatever period, yet when things turned south, it was all of a sudden NZs problem to get them home?

On the other hand, they are NZers and ultimately have a right to return home at their discretion. This right was removed (or severely hampered) based on some antiquated system of either pure luck, or getting publicity that took the shine off the Govt's "we care" halo.

On balance, was it the right call to slow returning citizens initially, absolutely, but that system had a use by date, and it was well past it when they finally relented and gave up on MIQ opting for home isolation instead

Quic Broadband

Move to New Zealand's best fibre broadband service (affiliate link). Free setup code: R587125ERQ6VE. Note that to use Quic Broadband you must be comfortable with configuring your own router.

Varkk

643 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 477

#3009333 13-Dec-2022 09:03

tdgeek:

GV27:

That's the billion dollar question, really. Notable also that some councils have had metered water for some time now while others push back against it as if it's privatisation.

I can understand if there is a real cost for water, managing shortages, but ChCh doesnt have that issue. Our already clean water is from aquifers, we don't pay to transport it from other areas, so its a rort

A big issue in Christchurch is they were already drawing more than was sustainable from the aquifers, After the earthquakes I believe they had to start chlorinating in some areas. So they are not immune to the pressures driving up water delivery costs everywhere.

JPNZ

1717 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 843

#3009340 13-Dec-2022 09:34

Varkk:

A big issue in Christchurch is they were already drawing more than was sustainable from the aquifers, After the earthquakes I believe they had to start chlorinating in some areas. So they are not immune to the pressures driving up water delivery costs everywhere.

Thats a blatant lie. The aquifers under Christchurch city hold roughly 375 million cubic metres of water (Thats 375 billion litres a year) whilst the city in total only uses 50 million cubic metres (5 billion litres a year) the other 370 billion litres flows out to sea.

Chlorinating happened when repairing earthquake damage to well's and supply systems (piping etc). It had nothing to do with water over usage. Christchurch City Council has plans to fully remove chlorine from drinking water in the future.

Panasonic 65GZ1000, Onkyo RZ730, Atmos 5.1.2, AppleTV 4K, Nest Mini's, PS5, PS3, MacbookPro, iPad Pro, Apple watch SE2, iPhone 15+

GV27

5978 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4212

#3009342 13-Dec-2022 09:37

Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has announced Ministers Poto Williams, Aupito William Sio, and David Clark will retire at the next election.

Labour MPs Jamie Strange, Marja Lubeck and Paul Eagle will also retire then.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/480618/pm-jacinda-ardern-reveals-which-mps-will-be-retiring-at-the-next-election

Probably no surprises here but more surprising is who isn't going after the last three years.

tdgeek

30048 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 9455

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#3009344 13-Dec-2022 09:46

JPNZ:

Thats a blatant lie. The aquifers under Christchurch city hold roughly 375 million cubic metres of water (Thats 375 billion litres a year) whilst the city in total only uses 50 million cubic metres (5 billion litres a year) the other 370 billion litres flows out to sea.

Chlorinating happened when repairing earthquake damage to well's and supply systems (piping etc). It had nothing to do with water over usage. Christchurch City Council has plans to fully remove chlorine from drinking water in the future.

Correct. We were on alternate day restrictions, solely to avoid water pressure dropping too low. The same could happen in high Summer , but thats not a water supply issue its just a water pressure issue

JPNZ

1717 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 843

#3009416 13-Dec-2022 10:33

GV27:

Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has announced Ministers Poto Williams, Aupito William Sio, and David Clark will retire at the next election.

Labour MPs Jamie Strange, Marja Lubeck and Paul Eagle will also retire then.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/480618/pm-jacinda-ardern-reveals-which-mps-will-be-retiring-at-the-next-election

Probably no surprises here but more surprising is who isn't going after the last three years.

Labour will be praying for Christmas to come as fast as possible. Anything to keep them out of the headlines for a few weeks.

I don't think I've ever seen such a bad few news weeks for an incumbent government.

Panasonic 65GZ1000, Onkyo RZ730, Atmos 5.1.2, AppleTV 4K, Nest Mini's, PS5, PS3, MacbookPro, iPad Pro, Apple watch SE2, iPhone 15+

HP

Shop now for HP laptops and other devices (affiliate link).

networkn

Networkn
32873 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 15475

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#3009422 13-Dec-2022 10:52

JPNZ:

Labour will be praying for Christmas to come as fast as possible. Anything to keep them out of the headlines for a few weeks.

I don't think I've ever seen such a bad few news weeks for an incumbent government.

Really? It was pretty much like this their entire first year.

chatterbox

204 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 108

#3009426 13-Dec-2022 11:01

GV27:

chatterbox:

GV27: Government got burned on the MIQ allocation system. Nothing to do with MIQ being in place so there was no increased risk to kiwis in NZ. I don't know where you acquired that impression.

All the Ex-Pats complaining about how they didn't have unfettered right to return during a global pandemic, the likes of which we hadn't seen for over a hundred years.

There's two different issues people seem to be venting about - the lack of priority in the lottery system, and the fact that Kiwis couldn't return at the exact moment they wanted to in the midst of a global pandemic.

The Ombudsman pointed out there was a lack of consideration for individual circumstances. Some people found themselves in dire situations. Losing their jobs later in the pandemic and their visas about to expire therefore being unable to pay for rent etc. Becoming unexpectedly pregnant. And I felt very much for those returning to see dying loved ones only to have to watch it via zoom.

The complaints were regarding the system. Whilst they could return via MIQ, the way it was structured it effectively meant they couldn't return home thereby breaching the bill of rights.

What was astounding to me was the seemingly lack of compassion from NZ which wasn't something I ever expected to see from NZ but there you go. These people hold NZ passports or residency. They are New Zealanders regardless of whether they live and pay tax abroad. Most importantly they are human. Hence the Ombudsmans findings.

GV27

5978 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4212

#3009430 13-Dec-2022 11:09

chatterbox:

What was astounding to me was the seemingly lack of compassion from NZ which wasn't something I ever expected to see from NZ but there you go. These people hold NZ passports or residency. They are New Zealanders regardless of whether they live and pay tax abroad. Most importantly they are human. Hence the Ombudsmans findings.

The reality is the Kiwis who live here, pay tax here and took the pain of our aggressive lockdowns also have rights too.

Protecting people who live here during a global pandemic should precedent over the people who don't.

Kyanar

4089 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1684

ID Verified

Trusted

#3009475 13-Dec-2022 13:58

GV27:

The reality is the Kiwis who live here, pay tax here and took the pain of our aggressive lockdowns also have rights too.

Protecting people who live here during a global pandemic should precedent over the people who don't.

No, the reality is that these people are New Zealand Citizens, and the government has the same obligations to them as to you. They have the same rights as you.

1 | ... | 90 | 91 | 92 | 93 | 94 | 95 | 96 | 97 | 98 | 99 | 100 | ... | 118