OpenGL support in Windows Vista

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bradstewart

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#10211 10-Nov-2006 11:51

I love Vista but I have one rather large issue...

The lack of OpenGL support is killing me. Vista has a very basic level of support but not good enough for games. ATI and nvidia's drivers are no better. I have quite a few games that require Open GL and they just won;t work on Vista. Gah.

With a bit of hacking I can get Knights of the Old Republic to get as far as the loading screens, but it dies on the menu.

Now as far as I know there is nothing that can be done about this, so this post is more of a vent...

But any ideas are welcome.

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I iz your trusted friend
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#51878 10-Nov-2006 15:21

Yeah, it's call, Windows XP. :-D

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bradstewart

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#51882 10-Nov-2006 15:28

I would spank you for that, but you might enjoy it too much. Bad Chiefie....

tonyhughes

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#51884 10-Nov-2006 15:31

If you read the FUG carefully you may note that the spanking of one moderator by another is only allowed on Tuesdays.

Consider this your final warning.

But seriously... gaming... i have just never been a big fan of games - i dont have the time to get into them deep enough to make it worthwhile buying them.

bradstewart

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#51891 10-Nov-2006 15:47

tonyhughes: If you read the FUG carefully you may note that the spanking of one moderator by another is only allowed on Tuesdays.

Ah yes after the debacle of last Thursdays moderator spanking fest this is no surprise.

I don't play a huge amount of games but it would be nice if I could play the ones I own when i want to relax. Come on ATI and nvidia, get your stuff sorted

chiefie

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#51892 10-Nov-2006 15:51

I got another idea... it's call XBox 360. :-D

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juha

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#55097 9-Dec-2006 12:30

Spanky stuff aside, I've noticed the same. Running OpenGL benchmarks on Vista is dog slow... makes me wonder if there's any hardware acceleration at all. And Nvidia hasn't updated the beta drivers for Vista since October :\

Juha

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bradstewart

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#55101 9-Dec-2006 13:01

The RC2 (96.85) drivers are the only ones which provide any decent OpenGL performance. In fact Knghts of the Old Republic plays better than on XP. I have tried the newer leaked drivers, 97.17 and newer but they bring on issues where saving the game gives you a blank screen and you have to minimise game to desktop and restore. A very painful process in a game where u regularly hit the quick save button.

So I have rolled back to the RC2 drivers. KotOR works ok again. But it could be better. Where are the RTM drivers? I doubt they will even be out for Jan 30 at this rate given the crap quality of the post RC2 ones and the ones included in RTM.

Fraktul

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#55157 10-Dec-2006 15:33

Take up playing WoW instead Brad.

Athlonite

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#55597 15-Dec-2006 17:27

yup same problem here i evan tried hackin ati xp drivers and the rc2's together to get opengl icd to intsall. It did ofcourse but as soon as i started a game of quake 3 or UT2K4 (set to use opengl), i got wierd graphics problems and on 1 occasion a BSOD in vista ( thats a first) for me . i think MS is tryin to retard GL in favour of direct X ati forums are full of the same complaints aswell and no clear answers from ati dont placat me one bit either way

bradstewart

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#55598 15-Dec-2006 17:34

Its actually not an MSFT problem.

ATi have just released their final drivers for Vista. Guess what, no OpenGL support at all and no intention to include it in the future. Whereas Nvidia have said they will provide full OpenGL support when they release their final drivers. Go figure. Glad I have a GeForce card.

BugMeNot

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#56525 29-Dec-2006 10:14

Boy that sucks from ATI not having OpenGL support :-(.

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weblordpepe

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#56637 31-Dec-2006 02:29

It's the beginning of the great divide in computer gaming. DirectX 10 or ......or what? Last time I checked OpenGL was an awesome, open standard. If Microsoft are good at doing one thing in the world it's dividing the computer industry. You're always stuck with the choice of:

Microsoft or Everybody-else.

This is a list of examples where Microsoft have created their own version of something which is already around for free, or otherwise an open-standard, or a superior commercial product. With each item you'll either find a compatibility problem, a security hole, or a lawsuit.

Should I use Word or Open Office?
Should I use Direct3D or OpenGL?
Should I use Unix/Linux or Windows? DOS-based or NT-based or Vista based? What? I need to upgrade?

Should I use Internet Explorer or a standards-compliant browser?
Should I use forwardslash or backslash for pathnames?
Should I use Windows firewall or something that works?
Should I use NTFS or ext2 or ext3 etc?
Should I use Active Directory, or Novell?
Should I use Google or the google-tryhard Windows Live Search?
Should I use Myspace, or the Myspace-clone MSN Spaces?

Should I use Windows Media Player, or a freeware player e.g. Winamp - something I can listen to music with without a laywer?
Should I use Windows Media format or MP3 / DivX / Xvid?

Should I use AOL, ICQ or IRC or MSN?
Should I use mIRC for IRC or the 'Microsoft Chat' client which everybody hates?

And the last, most famous one:

Should I use a Mac or Windows?

...these are just the examples I can think of off the top of my head. I'm sure you guys can think of more examples. There's the whole Palm situation, as well as email. It goes on and on and on.

freitasm

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#56642 31-Dec-2006 07:23

I would say half of these are not correct. For example Word came out before Open Office. Comparing DOS to NT or Vista is not comparing to an open standard.

Google is not an open standard. Myspace is not an open standard.

Neither AOL, ICQ use an open standard - you should think of Jabber and XMPP then.

Most of the comparisons you put there is just a matter of personal preference.

What e-mail situation? You can use any e-mail client, after all pop3, imap are standards.

Nope... I can't see the reason for that list.

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weblordpepe

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#56645 31-Dec-2006 09:14

I said they were either open standards or superior products or had already been around for free. I mean the point is - MS enjoy re-inventing the wheel. With a cog missing. Or as a square. Or just adding two wheels and a cog together and calling it the Zune.

Here is a very good .plan (a blog) by John Carmack about OpenGL and Direct3D. His word is law. About realtime 3D graphics and gaming, anyway.

http://www.bluesnews.com/archives/jc112396.html

"Direct-3D IM is a horribly broken API. It inflicts great pain and suffering on the programmers using it, without returning any significant advantages. I don't think there is ANY market segment that D3D is apropriate for, OpenGL seems to work just fine for everything from quake to softimage. There is no good technical reason for the existance of D3D.

I'm sure D3D will suck less with each forthcoming version, but this is an oportunity to just bypass dragging the entire development community through the messy evolution of an ill-birthed API."

That was ten years ago, and not a alot has changed.

juha

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#56647 31-Dec-2006 09:59

Computer Power User: What do you think of DirectX 10?

John Carmack: DX9 has its act together well. I like the version of DirectX on the 360. Microsoft is doing well with DX10 on tightening the specs and the exactness. The new features are not exactly well-thought-out. Most developers are pretty happy with DX9. The changes with DX10 aren’t as radical. It’s not like getting pixel shaders for the first time. Single-pass shaders are nice with DX10, but it’s a smaller change.

Juha

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