LED recessed downlights - retro fitting

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FineWine

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#208791 27-Feb-2017 19:32

Sorry for rehashing this again but previous topics are locked

Looking to retro fit my 16yr old recessed lamps with LED ones. (12 non-dimmable & 4 dimmable)

My electrician recommended a range of these: Allume Saturn (RD) LED - 3000K 8W = $14.30 & 13W = $16.25 plus the corresponding drivers (D$13.50 & N-D$17.55) from Lightingplus, he can not beat their price, plus will charge $8 install per fitting.

Any thoughts on this product?

Whilst the difficult we can do immediately, the impossible takes a bit longer. However, miracles you will have to wait for.

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#1727342 27-Feb-2017 19:39

Ive used some of the lons from there, I think its the same dimmable driver.

Very hard to get it to ramp up nicely, they come on when you have it up pretty bright like most dimmable non-incandesent lamps. Dim down ok, dont seem too bad at dropping right off at low brightness and not coming back till its way bright again like some others I have tried in the past.

Seems the industry is still stuck in the era of basic phase angle dimmers and trying to run a light off that and sense the brightness level all while changing that level by having a varying load on the dimmer. Its good enough to leave it at 1/4 brightness and just turn it up when you need it, but trying to have a nice fade in from black aint happening.

Richard rich.ms

timmmay

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#1727346 27-Feb-2017 19:46

I've used Lons from Lighting Plus, dimming has never worked properly with the proper driver and about six different dimmers. I would want to see one in action for a good while before I replaced them all. I'm probably going to take out the dimmable driver and dimmer and run them at 100%.

Note, threads can be re-opened easily. Also, retrofitting is different from a "retro fitting".

gregmcc

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#1727350 27-Feb-2017 19:58

So many different types of LED drivers, it makes it impossible to design a dimmer that will work well on all of them as well as work on non-led fittings. Remember the cheaper the fitting the lower the quality.

Best bet is to get the LED supplier to tell you which dimmer to use, that way when it doesn't work it's their fault........

shrub

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#1727392 27-Feb-2017 22:43

Mitre10 doing good Phillips all in ones.

https://www.mitre10.co.nz/shop/philips-led-downlight-smartbright-warm-white-15w/p/296050

Dimmable

https://www.bunnings.co.nz/deta-9w-warm-white-dimmable-led-downlight_p04390442

timmmay

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#1727418 28-Feb-2017 06:54

I'd definitely go for a well known brand, with the same brand dimmer.

CutCutCut

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#1821669 13-Jul-2017 10:25

Did the OP ever find a suitable solution for dimming these lights? I got these exact lights and drivers several months ago and am only just getting ready to put them in finally. I got 3 dimable ones and 2 non-dimmable, and now I'm thinking it might be easier just to make them all non-dimmable. They really don't need to be dimmable but they were replacing dimmable ones so thought I may as well. I've emailed lighting plus but haven't heard back yet, can I use the dimmable drivers in a non-dimming setup, does it matter? Or do I need to swap them.

FineWine

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#1821674 13-Jul-2017 10:32

No everything is on hold for the foreseeable future

Whilst the difficult we can do immediately, the impossible takes a bit longer. However, miracles you will have to wait for.

Sharesies

Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).

wazzageek

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#1821676 13-Jul-2017 10:37

CutCutCut:

I got 3 dimable ones and 2 non-dimmable, and now I'm thinking it might be easier just to make them all non-dimmable. They really don't need to be dimmable but they were replacing dimmable ones so thought I may as well. I've emailed lighting plus but haven't heard back yet, can I use the dimmable drivers in a non-dimming setup, does it matter? Or do I need to swap them.

Yes - you can use dimmable drivers in a non-dimming setup - we have the LEDLux lights in that same position now.

You cannot use a non-dimmable driver in a dimming setup, however.

Cheers

CutCutCut

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#1821690 13-Jul-2017 10:43

wazzageek:

CutCutCut:

I got 3 dimable ones and 2 non-dimmable, and now I'm thinking it might be easier just to make them all non-dimmable. They really don't need to be dimmable but they were replacing dimmable ones so thought I may as well. I've emailed lighting plus but haven't heard back yet, can I use the dimmable drivers in a non-dimming setup, does it matter? Or do I need to swap them.

Yes - you can use dimmable drivers in a non-dimming setup - we have the LEDLux lights in that same position now.

You cannot use a non-dimmable driver in a dimming setup, however.

Cheers

Great, yes that makes sense.

kryptonjohn

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#1821717 13-Jul-2017 11:14

We just installed about 50 of these:

http://www.lightingdirect.co.nz/shop/Downlight+Lights/LED+Downlights/LEDlux+INFINITY+MAXI+1+WW+900LM+ROUND+WHITE/x_sku/16602.html

Dimming seems to work perfectly.

Have about 16 left over for some reason, but I think LD will take them back.

These and probably most LED downlights can be covered and in contact with ceiling insulation which is a big plus (over the other benefits of low power and long life).

CutCutCut

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#1821731 13-Jul-2017 11:20

kryptonjohn:

We just installed about 50 of these:

http://www.lightingdirect.co.nz/shop/Downlight+Lights/LED+Downlights/LEDlux+INFINITY+MAXI+1+WW+900LM+ROUND+WHITE/x_sku/16602.html

Dimming seems to work perfectly.

Have about 16 left over for some reason, but I think LD will take them back.

These and probably most LED downlights can be covered and in contact with ceiling insulation which is a big plus (over the other benefits of low power and long life).

On a new build? I'll be building next year, and something like this looks good. Are the drivers built in on these models?

kryptonjohn

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#1821737 13-Jul-2017 11:30

It was a full house renovation - pulled out the old lights, plugged and plastered the holes and put these into new holes. The driver comes in the box with the light, but is not integrated. We got told to put the driver on top of the insulation but reading the info looks like that's not necessary,

Man, the price on these is in free-fall. When we ordered them they were about $50ea with trade discount.

clive100

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#1821742 13-Jul-2017 11:44

FineWine:

Looking to retro fit my 16yr old recessed lamps with LED ones. (12 non-dimmable & 4 dimmable)

What type of lamp was the existing downlights designed for ? Our downlights were designed to fit the CFL lamps up to 20 watts. But i'm sure the same could be applied to the Incadessant versions of standard or reflector lamps.

With this type of socket adaptor / extenders

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/5x-Lamp-Light-Bulb-Socket-Converter-Bayonet-Cap-Light-Accessories-Screw-E27-to-B22-FEN/32617275350.html?spm=2114.13010608.0.0.rWOOn1

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1x-Big-Promortion-B22-to-E27-Base-LED-Light-Lamp-Bulb-Fireproof-Holder-Adapter-Converter-Socket/32772633535.html?spm=2114.search0204.3.1.ROHVm6&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_3_10152_10065_10151_10068_10084_10083_10080_10082_10081_10110_10136_10137_10175_10111_10060_10112_10113_10155_10114_10154_438_10056_10055_10054_10182_10059_100031_10099_10078_5360019_10079_10103_10073_10102_10189_10052_10053_10142_10107_10050_10051,searchweb201603_16,ppcSwitch_5_ppcChannel&btsid=04b344a8-732c-4e1d-8c82-f691968046d7&algo_expid=075c5d40-4f72-4395-82bc-ae6671e251c5-0&algo_pvid=075c5d40-4f72-4395-82bc-ae6671e251c5

We have standard 8-10.5 Watt LED lamps to all our old downlight fittings and have had no issues. The adaptor extender helps by lowering the lamp within the downlight to lessen heat build up & to give a wider spread of light.

Non dimmable & dimmable lamps can be used & as no electrician is required & the cost of adaptors are under $1.00 each & the LED lamps as cheap as $3.00 from the Warehouse.

https://www.thewarehouse.co.nz/p/edapt-led-bulb-a60-b22-9w/R2182249.html or

https://www.thewarehouse.co.nz/p/edapt-led-bulb-a60-e27-9w/R2182250.html

This may not tick the boxes for looks but certainly a much cheaper & versatile option giving you the ability to alter wattage or colour warm or cool at each downlight to get the right amount of lighting.

tdgeek

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#1821748 13-Jul-2017 11:52

How is the flicker issue with LED these days?

Wife got a pamphlet that us getting an LED upgrade has saved some people 50% on their power bill. Have no idea how that could be the case, but am interested to see where LED is these days, price wise and flicker wise. Are they the same wattages as CFL equivalents? And hence same power usage?

richms

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#1821750 13-Jul-2017 11:54

tdgeek:

How is the flicker issue with LED these days?

Got worse with the demand for cheap crap from the typical masses who dont like to spend on quality.

Hard to find details and I'm sick of people saying dumb crap like "you cant see 100Hz flicker" and "its not a problem" when it is.

Richard rich.ms

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